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Angel's Awakening Fantasy

Discussion in 'Season 4' started by Fool for Buffy, Aug 2, 2017.

  1. Fool for Buffy

    Fool for Buffy "I wanna see how it ends"

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    Sineya
    I'm afraid this is one of the things I understand the least when it comes to interpretation of a dream. I think it makes much less sense than any part of Restless. Not because of the working together, Angel being alongside Connor, or the sex, but because of the magical sword, the shamim being evil, and, most notably the Raiders of the Lost Ark fantasy journey. For those who may have understood this better, how do you interpret this fantasy and what does it mean for Angel? Also, is it realistic that Angel would have imagined Cordelia to be his moment of perfect happiness? I was also bothered by that.
     
  2. Meliza

    Meliza Potential

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    Refresh my memory which episode was this?
     
  3. Fool for Buffy

    Fool for Buffy "I wanna see how it ends"

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    Sineya
    Season 4 episode 10. A shamin does a spell to extract Angel's soul and he imagines a scenario where it would happen.
     
  4. Mylie

    Mylie Scooby

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    The whole thing is set up as a big hero adventure in which Angel fights the evil lurking, everyone comes together and forget all the problems they've had (Wesley apologizes and Angel forgives him, Angel and Connor come to an understanding, Cordelia reassures Angel that his past doesn't matter and that she loves him) and ends with Angel getting the girl.

    The day was set up so he'd had the perfect hero day which I think was all that was going to work to give him true happiness at this point because after knowing of the happiness clause and being this damaged by Angelus's acts on BtVS s2, the only way he was going to be able to reach that point again was through an hero journey where everyone in his life completely accepts him.
     
  5. Fool for Buffy

    Fool for Buffy "I wanna see how it ends"

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    Sineya
    This makes sense, but I guess I'm still wondering what makes an underground journey through boobie traps a perfect hero day.
     
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  6. dcai0830

    dcai0830 "Shoulder to shoulder. I'm yours."

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    It is not realistic. But what can you do? Different networks. Can't bring in Buffy. And then the saying her name at the end of the dream sequence was - I don't know what that was.

    But I have heard commentary from writers along the lines of what @Mylie says where the conditions for Angel's curse to be lifted had to be that he had the perfect hero's day. He had to be win the day, all of his friends had to apologize and accept him, Connor had to be ok with him and then he gets the girl which is just icing on the cake.

    I personally hate this sequence of events in this episode. First of all, is this a dream? If so, are you telling me that Angel has never had wet dreams about Buffy? If so wouldn't have lost his soul a while ago? Also, in this scenario wherein he is getting his perfect happiness how is he so quick to forgive and forget the fact that Cordy slept with his son, and proceed so smoothly into going to bed with her. I would think he would feel strange about sleeping with the woman who slept with his son a few weeks before, strange enough so that it would at the very least prevent perfect happiness.

    I wish they had brought in the Shamin to forcibly remove the soul without needing to create a moment of perfect happiness. I'm sure they could have come up with a story where they just did a crazy spell and put his soul in a bottle.
     
    Fool for Buffy: Yes I agree with all of this. I'm glad someone else is just as frustrated as I am :)
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  7. Tez

    Tez Townie

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    It is dream but the Sharman made it reality or at least angels reality that's what he said at the end so it made the dream have the effect of if it was real
     
  8. Puppet

    Puppet Hands in the hair!

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    Black Thorn
    I never found it terribly logical either and tend to skip it in a lot of rewatches, despite being the episode right before my favorite Angel arc begins :)
     
  9. white avenger

    white avenger white avenger

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    It's been awhile since I last saw the episode in question, but, as I recall, the last word that Angel spoke before his soul departed was, "Buffy." I think that this was just the writers' way of somehow justifying the "moment of perfect happiness" clause in Angelus' curse, by somehow giving the impression that, despite the fact that none of his imagined fantasy actually included her, it was his memory of her that ultimately cost him his soul.

    (And, now that I look back over this, the explanation makes even less sense than the plot device)
     
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