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Questions in Buffy love life in season 8

Discussion in 'Season 8' started by RogueDemonHunter, May 1, 2012.

  1. RogueDemonHunter

    RogueDemonHunter Potential

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    So I read season 8 a long while back, and just now read something that said that Buffy had romantic interest in Xander during season 8. So could someone possibly attempt to clear this up by providing insight?

    Also, I would like to ask what you think about Buffy's homosexual experience with Satsu and also provide your insight into her apparent enjoyment of the night; while maintaining her heterosexuality.
     
  2. white avenger

    white avenger white avenger

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    As far as Buffy's brief affair with Satsu, I would say that it would fall under the same category of prisoners confined in a single sex environment for long periods of time. Though normally heterosexual, it is quite common for them to engage in homosexual relationships during their isolation, then return to their heterosexual orientation upon release. Buffy was surrounded by nothing but girls, one of whom was obviously attracted to her, and she had no other sexual release, so, nature took its course. At least when she ended the relationship, she didn't tell Satsu "I can't love you, and it's killing me." The break up was made easier, of course, by the fact that Buffy left Satsu in Japan when she and her team went back to Europe.

    As for her feelings for Xander, quite likely that was a subconscious attempt on her part to assure herself that she actually wasn't gay. At least, I can think of no other reason why she would be romantically attracted to someone who was just one step removed from a brother.
     
  3. brinkster130

    brinkster130 Riley's BFF Staff Member

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    Sineya
    I always interpreted Buffy's romantic interest in Xander in s8 as a sign of her loneliness and longing for the "normalcy" she once had in Sunnydale. She only showed interest in Xander after she had been through all her choice love interests and he was the last one standing; not to mention by this point he was unavailable.

    I liked the Satsu story line; mostly because I found Satsu interesting. IMO Buffy fell for the person rather than the gender when it came to Satsu. She was a strong beautiful person with whom she shared a connection and who happened to have feelings for her; I think it's understandable why Buffy decided to test the waters.
     
  4. Skytteflickan88

    Skytteflickan88 Proud Spikette

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    I agree on both accounts. I do however think her interest in Xander seems real. Maybe she did love Xander at the time, but it was a short lived love? Maybe she just feel in love with him because everything around her was unstable, but he was? She trusted him, liked him. Fooling herself or no, it makes sense.

    And yes, the Satsu thing was Buffy meeting a amazing girl, they connected and they ended up in bed. I think she would have to be atleast a litle bi for that to happen, to desire women, or atleast Satsu a bit. I vaugely recall Buffy saying she found it hot when Satsu said yes ma'am, and she looked happy during and after sex, so her saying she's wasn't gay might have been true, but, she must have been a little bi. Depends on your definition of bi of course. Bicurious might be a better term.
     
  5. SpikeJones

    SpikeJones Townie

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    Can i just say how infuriating it was when buffy did her thing with Satsu... really? Like they really did that? Im gay, so youd think id be all "yay gay" but no... it was seriously outta character and seriously lame... it was just the begining of the awful to me...

    And the Xander thing.. well that was lame too... the whole comic series just feels out of character... like ive read way better fanfiction than this crap... yet, i continue to read it... hey its gotta get netter at some point right?
     
    Aimee: I agree, Buffy hooking up with Satsu seemed more like horny boy writing than something that might actually happen despite how cool (& hot) Satsu was
    Vorchan: Not the points you made, they're fine, but cut out the cursing, please, Ma'am.
  6. Vorchan

    Vorchan Townie

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    Sineya
    Yeah, not to offend or anything but to tell what I think here, and with the deepest respect, but in my eyes, sleeping (in a marital way) with one of her subordinates who happens to be of the same gender as her is a new low for her in my eyes, I guess that they had that to say that she has her own faults too, and that she's prone to impurity.
    Plus she really didn't have a stable family relationship when she was growing up- and that is sort of a Really Random situation for a child.:mad:

    Nothing is a certain sentence of evil behavior in anybody's moral consitution, but divorce does make good behavior on the part of the children much harder, and it turns out that her father was unfaithful and somewhat unconcerned over his wife's death, she was also unfaithful... so it was a broken home.:mad:

    Out of character is not nessessarily bad fanfiction, just something is up., But as for Elizabeth (Buffy) Summers acts, they were Way out there: robbing a bank, physical intimacy with her employee, killing humans, et cetera.:mad:

    I read a forum where people said that the Slayer Army lost their souls as an explaination for the immoral behavior in season 8., I don't really know what the 'queen of the world' concept is, but I am firmiliar with 'facing the tyrant'... maybe they're the same.:confused:

    It does get better, I think their behavior stems from the addage 'pride goeth before a fall'... Keep at it, Sir or Ma'am!
     
  7. Black Eye Guy

    Black Eye Guy Taking over the World!

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    Black Thorn
    Right, sex with her subordinate that has murdered hundreds of thousands of innocent people is pretty awful, but consenting sex with someone of the same sex makes for a new low? ugh.

    Satsu was no more a subordinate then any of the other scoobies were, it wasn't a job, as far as we know they aren't paid, they are a team.

    I dont think it's considered random any more, in fact Xander and Willow come from crap families too, and Giles only mentions his mother if I remember correctly. This is really reaching for a conclusion, based on hearing, generalisations, that kids from broken homes might do this.

    Your way off, the idea that KIDS act out cuz they came from a broken home is one thing, but Buffy robbed a bank (as a women in her mid 20's) to fund her cause! Yes robbing the bank maybe wasn't great, but it wasn't cuz she was bored, it was so she could continue to fight off apocalypses and fund any army of warriors for good.

    And who's Elizabeth?



    Well that person was 100% wrong. If they had robbed a bank for fun just cuz they had the power that would be different. To just see the fact that they robbed a bank and make your decision there on the goodness of the characters is just blinding yourself into a narrow and irrelevant view - it's irrelevant, as it leads to conclusions like the slayers lost their souls, which isn't true at all and isn't backed up by facts.

    ---------- Post added at 09:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:32 PM ----------
    [MENTION=12515]Vorchan[/MENTION] Karma is for making a point, not asking questions, if you want to continue a discussion you post.
    The person said the slayers lost their souls - not true, not even a little true, completely made up, fabricated and a straight up lie.
    We've seen characters with no souls, robbing banks wasn't high on their agenda.

    Did you notice in the comics they suddenly had a castle, computers, a lot of high-tech equipment, food, supplies, weapons, armour, a helicopter. They had operations worldwide, presumably all with the same I think Buffy would need to be robbing more banks if she bought all that and paid the Slayers a wage.
     
    Vorchan: The person was not wrong at all about the immoral nature of bankrobbery! At All, it's Always a disordered act, and if she was trying to finance her army, then what need did she have for money if her soldiers are not her subordinates?
  8. Vorchan

    Vorchan Townie

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    Sineya
    If you recall, I think I put Buffy in paranthesees, because Buffy is a nickname for Elizabeth.
    Robbing someone, anyone, is always wrong, no matter who it is on either end of the deed! Furthermore, I didn't say that the fanfic is a valid element for the storyline- that's the copyright holder's call, but I have heard that Joss did say that he considers fanfiction to be canon... how that can be is anybody's guess, aside from him that is, but if so, he's got more storylines than can fit together if you ask me., I cannot tell you where, but I did find it online.
    You cannot do wrong in order to do right and have it work out, it'll always go wrong if you do... "no two wrongs make a right" (you Will, however go in a circle if you turn left 4times, or right, but that's another topic entirely.).

    Remember Faith's little attempt at redemption? She had messed up her soul, most of her friends do the same in the series.
    Mr. Whedon seems to love the concept of the 'evil twin', examples: Faith is Buffy's, VampireWillow/Willow, (just to name two), then for the guys- Angel/Angelus (same body, different personality)., Giles/Ripper, and such.

    Willow herself was eager to streighten out her life after she attempted to commit murder (I say attempted because she failed, Warren survived, as people find out in season 8), but I wonder: did she realize what she did to her girlfriend?

    Don't take this the wrong way, but what makes you the absolute authority on this series? You seem to like it, and that's Great, but, are you Joss Whedon?:eek: Did you concoct this series?:eek: If so, I had no idea!:eek: Congradulations, Mr. Whedon on a great Series, you will find rewards beyond your wildest dreams for the ideas in it.:D (that last part was directed to Mr. Whedon, much of the rest is "who are you? are you the guy with the copyright? if not, what makes you more of an authority on this topic than anybody else here. I really want to know).:)
    To paraphrase Mr. Teeth "It's been a genuine pleasure."
     
  9. Black Eye Guy

    Black Eye Guy Taking over the World!

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    Black Thorn
    Well Buffys full name isn't Elizabeth, Buffy is her full name, not a nick name, so calling her Elizabeth is incorrect.

    No you haven't. Find me that quote, I challenge you!
    I love canon, been on the boards a long time had many discussions about canon and this isn't true you wont find that quote. Joss is very particular about canon, absolutely 0% chance he's said fanfiction is cannon.



    If you want to know what Whedon has said about canon:

    "Canon is key, as is continuity. If you are massive nerd. Which I am. I believe there's a demarcation between the creation and ancillary creations by different people. I'm all for that stuff, just like fanfic, but I like to know what's there's an absolutely official story-so-far, especially when something changes mediums, which my stuff seems to do a lot."
    Source

    I doubt if he was that interested in canon, he's let anyone with access to the internet decide canon.

    Well you see it as her using a spell to stop Tara from saying 'no' to sex, while what actually happened in the show was Willow skipped an argument, it's pretty clear she realised how she was using magic was wrong and was correcting that.
    But she can't be expected to seek atonement for a rape scenario you made up in your head.

    I dont consider myself more of an authority on BtVS unless I'm talking to someone that is talking crap. If you want to give a piece of information but can't back it up, your talking crap, if you take something that applies in the real world but doesn't apply in the verse of the show your talking crap, and wasting time in a discussion. Any facts I give you I can back up in canon and sources :)
     
    Vorchan: I don't have an intellectual problem with the points you made, but cut out the cursing!
    Aimee: Thank you for clearing up all that nonsense
  10. Joan the Vampire Slayer

    Joan the Vampire Slayer Carpe Spuffy!

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    Not to interject...nevermind, who am I kidding, I'm totally going to interject.

    In this context, many of us are authorities on this subject. We've all seen the series multiple times, and discuss it on a regular basis. We know everything.

    If anybody is an "authority" on Buffy, it's us. Really, we're only one step below these folks.
    http://slayageonline.com/
     
    Vorchan: I respectfully disagree, Joss concocted the series, he decides what happens in it, He's the expert, not us... do you own the copyright? I didn't think that YOU were Mr. Whedon!
  11. EVIL UU

    EVIL UU Scooby

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    You know what I like the most about the whole Satsu thing? Not that it exposes the rampant homophobia in the fandom, not even that it exposes the bullshit denial of shippers who claim that Buffy goes to bed and has one of the best nights of her life with somebody she is not sexually attracted to nor the petty insecurity of fans who, while overidentifying with Buffy, claim that Buff having sex with a person of the same sex in a canon work is out of character because they do not do it. No, it exposes something far worse than homophobia and bullshit - ignorance. Lack of understanding, lack of insight. Look, an openly bisexual lead in 1999 was a no go in a mainstream US TV show about teenagers and still, I don't think that one can watch season 3 and claim that there's absolutely no sexual attraction between Buffy and Faith because then their arc kinda stops making sense. Also, just read "Enemies" shooting script. Just do it, OK? Add the subtext with the other characters and really, Satsu thing does not come out of nowhere.

    Bonus. The cookie dough speech.

    And the guy thing? (sighs) I always feared there was something wrong with me. You know, because I couldn't make it work. But maybe I'm not supposed to. (...) I'm cookie dough. I'm not done baking. I'm not finished becoming who ever the hell it is I'm gonna turn out to be. I make it through this, and the next thing, and the next thing, and maybe one day, I turn around and realize I'm ready. I'm cookies. And then, you know, if I want someone to eat m-

    Guess what, the franchise leaves the realm of television, first thing that happens, surprise, surprise, Buffy's getting eaten out! Suck on that!

    The Buffy/Xander thing is interesting. So many questions. Buffy knows that Xander is in love with her since "The Pack", right? So was he always more than just a friend to Buffy? An emergency love interest perhaps? Somebody to hook up with if her primary romances don't work out? Certainly explains Buffy's attitude towards Xander's girlfriends. Or maybe her feelings really did develop in Tibet? Was it caused by the loss of power? Does being a slayer affects Buffy's sexuality beyond the hungry and horny thing?

    Of course I'm not saying that Buffy can't just go like Hey, Xander's a cool guy! He's alone, I'm alone, maybe we could like, not be alone together? 'Cause it makes sense.
     
    Kean:
    thetopher: This! I totally agree. (though perhaps I'd have put it a little more delicately...
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2014
  12. thetopher

    thetopher Member of the Church Of Faith

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    Sineya
    Personally, I see Buffy having sex with a consenting adult, somebody who realised that Buffy didn't love her, but she took the chance to make a connection anyway.

    As for the 'Buffy only did this 'cause she was lonely' argument- that's...balony, she wasn't in jail. She could go to a club and hook up, she could date- the fact that there more slayers should mean that she had more time for a social life, not less.

    No, Buffy was taking some time to be Buffy (she's cookie-dough apparently :rolleyes:), and after eighteen months she decides to fool around with a cute chick who in love with her. She gives Satsu fair warning, and they still have sex- at least twice. You don't do that 'cause your lonely. Maybe she was curious? Maybe she was horny? I mean, she obviously liked it a lot (unless she was needlessly flattering Satsu's ego).

    And remember Joss isn't that big on labels, gay or straight- you fall in love with/feel attracted to a person. That theme runs throughout a lot of Joss's shows (and also explains why slash-ships are so popular in Buffy), and really shouldn't be all that shocking.
    If you want to look at Satsu as as legitate sexual partner to Buffy as Angel, or Riley, or Spike then all power to you, there's absolutly no reason not to. :)

    I'm not really sure about the Xander/Buffy stuff, maybe that part of her was longing for a normal life away from all the craziness, and Xander's a fairly grounded guy at the end of the day. I think it was less about him and more about what he represented.
     
  13. Robb Stark

    Robb Stark King in the North

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    Sineya
    This thread got really weird really quickly :p
     
    Vorchan: Yeah, it kinda did at that.
  14. Blaze

    Blaze Let it Burn

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    Black Thorn
    This is really offensive. This comment, as well as others you've made in the past, come of as extremely homophobic. There was nothing wrong with Buffy sleeping with a girl, none whatsoever. It wasn't a fault of hers, and it wasn't an impurity. And Satsu wasn't any more of a subordinate than Buffy was with Riley.
     
    thetopher likes this.
  15. Ethan Reigns

    Ethan Reigns Scooby

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    Sineya
    The only other Buffy I am aware of is Buffy Sainte-Marie, a folk singer whose actual first name was Beverly. She was a Cree native of the province of Saskatchewan who went on to get her BA and PhD in teaching and Oriental philosophy. But she is mainly remembered as an anti-war activist and her song "Universal Soldier" remains one of the great songs of the 1960's.

    So the correct name would be Beverly Anne Summers.
     
    GwenRaiden: I <3 Buffy Sainte-Marie
    GwenRaiden likes this.
  16. Joan the Vampire Slayer

    Joan the Vampire Slayer Carpe Spuffy!

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    Well, I can only speak for myself, but my inability to understand the Satsu thing isn't because I'm homophobic - I just thought it was out of character since Buffy had never once shown any interest in another woman prior to that.
     
    thetopher: A lot of fans have picked up on the chemistry between Buffy and Faith, there was a definate vibe there.
  17. EVIL UU

    EVIL UU Scooby

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    [MENTION=3210]Joan[/MENTION] the Vampire Slayer
    There's no such thing as acting out of character in a canon work, written by a guy ( "Beautiful Sunset" ) who created the character on the top of that. This isn't fan fiction.

    As to Buffy showing interest, well, there's Faith. I know, it's all subtext but Buffy still responds to what Faith does and more importantly, who says that she had to show interest prior to Satsu? Has Willow shown any interest prior to Tara? Was it out of character too when she did?
     
  18. Robb Stark

    Robb Stark King in the North

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    Sineya
    [MENTION=11194]EVIL UU[/MENTION],

    I think part of the reason is that after Satsu Buffy makes it fairly clear that she's not interested in women any further. Along with that, Willow (through the pen of Joss Whedon), informs Satsu multiple times that Buffy is primarily interested in guys.

    Buffy does clearly enjoy herself, but considering her past romantic history and who she sleeps with after Satsu, it's pretty clear that Buffy is not gay.

    On top of that, I think that trying to label Buffy, or anyone for that matter, is kind of dumb. "Gay", "straight". What I kind of took out of the Buffy/Satsu/Angel thing of S8 was that you should sleep and spend time with those that make you happy.
     
    Lyri:
    thetopher: So which is it, is Buffy not gay, or do labels not matter?
  19. Black Eye Guy

    Black Eye Guy Taking over the World!

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    Black Thorn
    I also dont think sleeping with someone of the same sex immediately throws you out of character.

    People that do it in real life, shouldn't be automatically lumped into being gay.

    If Buffy sleeps with one women but goes on to only date men, it's no different to her sleeping with Spike, he wasn't her boyfriend, it was just sex.

    Spike and Angel have a sexual past, both them seem to be interested in women.
     
    crazysoulless likes this.
  20. Robb Stark

    Robb Stark King in the North

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    Sineya

    [MENTION=12602]Robynrainbow[/MENTION],

    I know, I wasn't meaning to imply that it can't be. My point was more that labeling it so fiercelely, as so many do, has served to do nothing more than alienate people. You can only sleep with the opposite sex, only sleep with the same sex or be a mix of the two. I think that, on the whole, the societal construct a lot of people have toward sexuality is kind of flawed, and just a colossal waste of time.