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Am I the only person who loved season 6?

Discussion in 'Season 6' started by fredandwesfan, Feb 10, 2015.

  1. thrasherpix

    thrasherpix Scooby

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    I get tired of this line of reasoning, because it's wrong. Hell, season 6 had more of a happy ending than season 2.

    What I dislike because about season 6 was for trying to become more realistic when it made me think "this is a story written by people raised with silver spoons in their mouths who don't know what they're writing about." The Reefer Madness silliness felt like a PSA or after school special. I didn't find it realistic character wise (and though it could be called character driven in some sense, it was more caricatures of who the characters had been for the most part) or supernatural wise (many examples, some blending in with the realistic part).

    Even everyday wise it fails, like a fast food job is enough to cover payments, a kid which is expensive, and that Xander & Anya could have that super amazing wedding on such a budget, among other things I could bring up, the least of which Willow could create party favors and balloons out of thin air but she can't conjure money or use her skills to make money. As someone who makes a lot from entertaining at birthday parties myself, I can say Willow could've made more than Buffy did working fast food just by conjuring balloons and the like to the joy of children.

    And then at the very end Willow pulls up a temple apparently forgotten about and is pouring power into it, which begs the question why others hadn't tried that before, or for that matter, why was Willow the first such witch like Willow they encountered, though granted when you turn into a silly hardcore stereotypical junkie trope after one hit of magic drugs then maybe they die off fast...but that then begs the question of how people like Rack stayed in business.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2017
  2. thetopher

    thetopher Member of the Church Of Faith

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    Sineya
    That's the problem when you take the 'magic' and metaphor out of the show and try and make it more true to life and 'dark'; the plot holes actually become more glaring and stark because the 'polish' has been written out for a season.
     
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  3. RomanticSoul

    RomanticSoul Scooby

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    Seriously.

    Buffy has a mountain of bills waiting for her and has to pay for house upkeep, food for everyone in the house and so forth. A fast food job doesn't cover any of that in the slightest. But apparently she makes a ton of money since she has a new thousand dollar outfit every episode and no one else living in the house has to get a part time job to help out with finances. If the money problems were that bad Dawn should have gone for jobs teenagers can do. Willow and Tara were apparently living off of what little money Joyce left with no contributions of their own. And even though Tara moved out what about Willow?

    Trying to make this show more like real life actually made it all the more unrealistic.
     
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  4. Ethan Reigns

    Ethan Reigns Scooby

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    Sineya
    There is nothing that says Willow and Tara did not contribute to housing costs. They seem to be in a new season where they do not attend university, so their college fund may be supporting the house. Their presence means Dawn does not have to go into a foster home with all the potential for horrendous treatment. I doubt Dawn could have been independent enough to live like Jody Foster in "The Little Girl Who Lived Down the Lane". Life insurance for Joyce seems to be paying the bills but we do not see who the beneficiary is or who the executor of her estate is (if she ever assigned one in her will or actually had a will) and probably Willow and Tara are performing that function otherwise the property would have been seized for back taxes. There may have been a payout to Joyce's estate from the art gallery she worked for.

    The story could have been bogged down in financial details but it is not supposed to be a treatise on finance other than when Buffy goes to the bank for a loan she can't afford and goes to work at Doublemeat Palace. That's more financial coverage than you usually get in a story about a superhero.
     
  5. WillowFromBuffy

    WillowFromBuffy "My bowling shoe fetish is not the issue here."

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    WAIT A MINUTE! I was reading @Ethan Reigns lovely post, when it dawned on me. How was Willow and Tara able to convince the world that Buffy was still alive...
    [​IMG]
    ... if Buffy was buried in the ****ing cemetery!?
     
  6. Ethan Reigns

    Ethan Reigns Scooby

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    Sineya
    Good question. The vampires should have read that tombstone as well and known what was up as that is where they hung out. But the Buffybot was what convinced them all - she showed up at the PTA (Parent - Teacher Association) meeting and no one suspected it was not her. A death certificate for a young girl would not normally result in any questions about what property she owned. And the Buffybot didn't get destroyed until the real Buffy was resurrected, so there would be no noticeable break in continuity.

    That'll put marzipan in your pie plate, bingo!
     
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  7. Athene

    Athene Scooby

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    How do we know it's in the cemetery, maybe they found a private place to bury Buffy, and Willow created the headstone magically along with the coffin? They can't be stupid enough to put Buffy's grave in a cemetery lol
     
  8. Ethan Reigns

    Ethan Reigns Scooby

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    Sineya
    The following is from the script when they go to perform the ritual to resurrect Buffy:

    EXT. BUFFY'S GRAVE IN WOODED AREA - NIGHT

    It's a still night. Buffy's grave is nearly hidden in a stand of trees in the farthest reaches of a cemetery.

    Tara, Xander and Anya all stand around the grave holding black candles. Willow holds Urn of Osiris and some spell ingredients. The mood is dark and tension is running high. They all tremble with a potent mix of fear, anticipation and cold.
     
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  9. Last Watcher

    Last Watcher Tweed Icon

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    Sineya
    Yes, that's exactly how they portrayed it on the show.
    The scoobies got split up running through the trees when the Demon bikers showed up......Didn't look like a graveyard at all from what I remember.
     
  10. white avenger

    white avenger white avenger

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    Possible explanation: The grave site and tombstone were strictly for the Scoobies' access and benefit. Buffy's actual death was covered up by using the Buffybot, and the grave site, whether it was actually in a cemetery or not, was somehow warded by Willow and Tara to keep out unwelcome visitors, or assure that they didn't remember being there after they left, sort of like the previous Season's "Ben is Glory/Glory is Ben" spell.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2017
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  11. thrasherpix

    thrasherpix Scooby

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    Yeah, I know people say this is the most realistic, but I find it the most UNrealistic, especially real life wise.

    Maybe it was because when I first saw it I was still just scraping by myself (and I got most of my clothes from thrift stores, and very glad for my sewing skills while living in a rat trap which was better than Faith's motel room but nowhere near what Buffy had, and I later found out the rent was so cheap because it could not pass inspection and was actually dangerous to live in) while people I knew were getting married (and no one had a wedding even closely remote to what Anya and Xander cooked up)...and glad I didn't have a teen to take care of then as I did later, but if I had then I'd have known how even more unrealistic it is.

    I heard others comment on how unrealistic it was, like a guy who used to drive armored trucks for a living had some things to say about the scene of Warren ripping into such a truck. As someone who owns a gun in California, I was also aware of gun laws in regards to their legal purchase that apparently the writers never bothered to learn (wait, that was technically season 7 that flashes back to Warren getting the gun for season 6)--even the Simpsons was more realistic than season 6 Buffy in that regards.

    And even if Willow didn't want to use magic for financial gain (which seems extremely unlikely given how quick she was to use it), surely she'd have figured how to use the tech skills she gained from working on the Buffybot to patent SOMETHING worth money. Given her ability to combine magic with technology (like when she was "telepathically datalinking" into the police files in one episode) I'm sure she could make sure she wasn't screwed over as well as enhancing the quality of her product (perhaps even enough to get a visit from Wolfram & Hart...).

    I find the Reefer Madness aspect silly. I think some people mistake my attitude for one that "drugs are harmless." That's not the case at all. It's that the show is silly. To use an analogy, you can have a show where radiation turns people into homicidal mutants or causes them to grow extra arms, and I might enjoy it, but if you call it realistic of the dangers of radiation and I'm gonna call BS on it, but that doesn't mean I think radiation is therefore harmless. And one reason I want HONEST drug awareness education is because all the BS meant to terrify rather than inform sabotages the messages regarding the genuine dangers of recreational drug use.

    Ironically, I found it even easier to suspend disbelief for season 1 though the writers themselves treated it as a joke at times, like Snyder's comment, "There are things I will not tolerate: students loitering on campus after school, horrible murders with hearts being removed, and also smoking." I think it was because then the show was obviously meant to be fun and not taken seriously, and it was also more about the metaphor than trying to integrate ordinary reality into the Buffyverse (an interesting idea, but poorly executed in season 6, IMO). But season 6 took itself way too seriously, by its own admission (I believe I saw in interview on one of the dvds about how it was to be made "realistic" which made me go WTF). Season 6 was the first time I failed to fully suspend disbelief enough to immerse myself into the show.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2017
  12. RomanticSoul

    RomanticSoul Scooby

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    There is also nothing in the show that tells us if Willow and Tara are contributing financially. And since the Scoobies in S6 were painted as the evil bad guys who can't be bothered to help poor Buffy I'm automatically going to assume the worst of them. And if they aren't going to college why on earth are neither of them working a full time job to support the household? I can't imagine Willow's parents paying college fund when Willow doesn't attend college. Tara's family isn't paying hers and she moves out of the house later and supporting herself via...I have no clue.

    Then why bother trying for 'realism' in the first place? Either you treat that aspect of the story seriously or you don't bother at all, like all the Seasons before. But if I'm told that a character is dead broke and I see her wearing a spanking new 1000$ outfit every episode I won't be able to suspend my disbelief. Nevermind supporting a household of 3-4 people on a fast food job. Because that is utterly unrealistic.

    Buffy's job at the DMP was another WTF for me that was utterly unbelievable. The Magic Shop was the perfect place for her to work at since Anya and Giles knew of Buffy's irregular schedule. But the writers just had to have that not work for some stupid reason because we just have to force Buffy into a crappy job in order to make her more miserable. Why not have Buffy work as an instructor who teaches self-defense classes for example? I bet there would be plenty of participants because this is Sunnydale.

    James Marsters certainly agrees with you. As he himself said S6 was when they took themselves too seriously and that ended up not really working out.
     
  13. white avenger

    white avenger white avenger

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    I personally either cringe, get angry, or laugh out loud at the depiction of guns, their use, and anything pertaining to gun laws and regulations as depicted in the movies and on TV. It's all myths and outright lies. Unfortunately, very few of the writers actually know or care.
     
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  14. thrasherpix

    thrasherpix Scooby

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    Yeah, me, too! Sometimes it's unintentionally funny. (I think I laughed all 3 times that I saw Resident Evil 2 with Jill Valentine walking into that police station firing guns like mad, which included shooting people who were in cuffs, and even getting someone out of handcuffs by shooting the cuffs themselves, and none of the cops freaked, one says something like, "It's just Valentine." Like she does that all the time. :eek: Of course her streetwalker outfit was pretty funny to me as well making me wonder if that was what all policewomen wore.) And I sometimes cringe when I see someone scantily clad (usually a woman, Jill Valentine just one of many examples) shooting guns like mad or even automatics as I'm thinking, "Lady, that low cut shirt is just BEGGING for brass burns." :D

    I'm still not sure what to think of the part in The Mist where some people ask a store owner if there are any guns in the store and he says something like, "This isn't Los Angeles." In a way I could see someone being that dumb as to think just because there's so much gun crime there that there must be armories at the local stores, and probably ammo vending machines, too, rather than realizing just how strictly regulated the sales of firearms are. On the other hand, these were supposed to be mostly small town people, and I'd think they'd be more gun wise than that and not mistake availability for criminal use...that seems to be true even in many rural areas of California. Maybe many small towns aren't despite my experiences to the contrary...but I'm betting that's just how some Hollywood scriptwriter thought of it. I'd think otherwise since they should know better about LA, but apparently the Buffy scriptwriters didn't know any better.
     
  15. white avenger

    white avenger white avenger

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    Unless someone has had a hot .45 case drop down the front of their shirt, they have no idea what you are talking about. Let's just say... IT HURTS!!!!!
     
  16. Out for a walk

    Out for a walk 5 Words Or Less...

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    I have finished season 6 on my rewatch. I have only watched season 6 and 7 a couple of times. So a lot of it was kind of new to me, since I had forgotten it.

    I really enjoyed season 6, there were some great episodes in there. I liked that they got back to some really strange episodes. The trio gave them an opportunity to put some corky stuff in there.
     
  17. LeeJones41

    LeeJones41 Townie

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    It's not my favorite season, but I really liked Season 6 a lot. I think it is one of the most interesting seasons of the series.
     
  18. thrasherpix

    thrasherpix Scooby

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    I just read 2 threads on why season 6 is either the best or worst season, and came to reread this thread where I think I have finally grasped the appeal of season 6 for some people, but I'll leave this here for those who love it co comment on. I genuinely am curious.

    I think what some people realistic is the TONE rather than the events. That is, it's the feeling of one's dreams ("heaven" or even the perfect marriage) out of reach, finding life overwhelming and not at all simple, and in which people make terrible mistakes over trivial (yet potentially life destroying) ways that leaves one feeling adrift, despairing, and perhaps even in shock which people can relate to.

    Many people are actually nostalgic over childhood, and then they find life is much harder than they imagined, their friends are caught up in their own problems (and keeping their own heads above water) just as they themselves are which is in itself alienating and depressing. Plenty of people are conflicted about relationships more sexual and not particularly intimate otherwise (like Buffy/Spike), or that the relationship they believed in falls apart terribly and traumatically (Xander/Anya). And now the parents can't or won't help you now (like Giles leaving Buffy). Of course many take jobs they hate (Like Buffy dabbling in different jobs in Life Serial and later working at the Doublemeat Palace), and though the specifics aren't at all realistic in the show, I could see the TONE of it being appreciated by say someone forced to work such a job (but lives in a much smaller place with fewer clothes and no kid to take care of, and/or has others chipping in, no doubt with lots of arguments about not everyone chipping in their full share). In this case the feelings one struggles with could relate to the struggles on the metaphoric show.

    These are all common things, and throw in the sex (which always sells) and fan service JM was forced to give the audience (which must've been as terrible for him as it was when Cordelia was forced to wear a bikini for a commercial, but I digress), then I can see that appealing to people. And yet I don't see people talking about how realistic this season is relating much to the getting visits from social services or losing someone to violence (along with the friend going vigilante over it), or the Reefer Madness aspect ("yep, a friend took me to some hippie drug den where I took one hit and then I was dragging kids into back alleys to get my fix before laughing like a maniac while driving super fast in a stolen car before entering rehab" :D ). If anything, these (and other issues that I don't want to bring up here) and their glib portrayal of such issues make it harder for us to get into season 6 (and it's not that the season is "too dark" as seasons 2 and 5 also packed emotional punches and even had a less happy ending than season 6, but few if any of us will complain of the dramatic soap opera elements in those seasons). Therefore, all that could be overlooked as more symbolic as well while it's the tone of the show (dreams die, and the center does not hold) that people are relating to through the sets and characters of Buffy the Vampire Slayer.

    And another alternative I've seen is some talking about depression. There seem to be 2 kinds in my understanding, the perpetually pessimistic (even somewhat paranoid) and easily upset kind (like both Xander and Anya) that might include some very self-destructive activies (like Willow), and the "I can't feel anything" kind (as represented by Buffy). I could see how the tone of this season speaks to them as well, and thus feels real to them.

    Though that said, the show becomes incredibly upbeat fast as everyone quickly starts to reconnect, from Buffy making promises to Dawn to Giles returning to the yellow crayon speech in which Xander reminds Willow of a more innocent time and healing their bonds that had become frayed over time. Heck, Spike even gets his soul, like Pinocchio becoming a real boy. I could see even this being appealing as a surprisingly upbeat message of hope, no matter how much pain and sorrow you experienced, you can come back to a happy place...ironically making it not the pain of season 6 that appeals so much as the hopeful message at the end. I personally think the poem An Awful Tempest Mashed the Air helped me survive both a traumatic event (whereas I could've given up and died all too easy) and helped me out through some hard times, which in this aspect it reflects season 6....no matter how terrible it gets, it can get better if you don't give up hope, and that's something many people need to hear, be it through a poem like it was for me, or through say season 6 of Buffy for others.
     
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  19. Puppet

    Puppet My ass is not pansy!

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    Black Thorn
    The Spuffy shipper that lives inside me does not like S6 one bit, lol, however, the writer who thrives on angst and putting her characters through the ringer, that person can totally see how amazing S6 truly is. So I'm a bit torn there, between heart and soul ;)
     
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  20. AlphaFoxtrot

    AlphaFoxtrot Potential

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    I felt it fulfilled its thesis well, as an exploration of what can go wrong with life in your early twenties, but it’s not an enjoyable season to watch.
     
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