Discussion of 4.13 "Salvage" - Aired 3/5/2003 (WB-US)

[Flannen]

After Angelus apparently kills Lilah, Wesley realizes that they will need help finding and stopping him. After he makes sure that Lilah will not rise as a vampire, the former Watcher goes in search of a powerful ally.

Source: TV.com

Discuss this episode here!

 

[Jules]

Poor Wesley finding Lilah dead like that, it was very similar to Buffy finding Angel drinking from Joyce. Then he has to behead her. I'm unsure that the hallucination of Lilah was needed, I thought it was pretty obvious that they both had feelings for each other that they tried to hide. That whole scene does seem a lot like Lilah's The First. I think Connors comment about them relying too much on magic links in nicely with Willow's appearance in the upcoming episode. You would think that they would have learnt their lesson by now.

I've just realised that the tall vampire playing pool and the one who helps Angelus find the Beast is an actor that appears with David on Bones.

I love that Faith is back in this episode. I've missed her so much! I loved watching her fight in the prison, that scene shows in one that Faith's still a tough girl who can take care of herself, yet she's still on the road to redemption. I think the fact that it was so easy for her to escape prison shows how much she wanted to change.

I dont like Cordy being evil, she just lacks intimidation. When she was talking to the Beast and giving orders and telling him off for misbehaving it just seemed silly. Plus her kissing him was so unnecessary.

I really like how Wes introduces Faith to the group as Faith the Vampire Slayer, it has a nice ring to it I also like how Connor seems to have an instant admiration for her, I almost wish they'd brought her in earlier. I think if Connor had had someone other than Cordy to fixate on he wouldnt have turned out so damaged. I also liked how she instantly took control of the group.

I love how Angelus phones the Summers and speaks to Dawn to check which Slayer is in town. I so would have enjoyed a Buffy/Angelus reunion. I would rather have watched Faith fight Angelus than the Beast, but she did really well for a while. Its so ironic that Angelus was the one to kill the Beast and bring back the sun.

This is an awful thing to say, and I hope it doesnt offend anyone, but Cordy seems to represent those small number of women that use pregnancy in a way to try and keep a partner interested. Connor is clearly pulling away, he's very much in awe of Faith and Cordy can see that so she drops the baby bombshell.

 

[PassionBecoming]

Alright, let's see what in Hades is going on around here...

-Wonder if finding Lilah made Angelus ponder.
-Wait, just realized the dagger Cordelia had was the one the Beast was offering...well, now that's interesting.
-So, if Cordelia is evil now or whatever, wouldn't Angelus be able to smell/sense that or something?
-"You people rely way too much on that junk." Connor does have a point. It's like BtVS all over again.
-Ok, the Fang Gang should know for certain by now how a vampire sires someone, and there was no way Lilah was sired. Duh.
-So, all those know of Angelus even in LA?
-Umm...how was she turned...??? Angelus was still drinking her when they found them. Oh, ok. Wes is just going crazy. Great.
-I'm also wondering why Angelus wants to go after the Beast so badly? Isn't he usually all "Yay, apocalypse!"?
-Couldn't they just do the spell that uninvites vampires on the hotel? It isn't really a public place.
-Yeah, you can totally tell Charisma is pregnant. And again with Cordy's timing. Manipulation.
-FAITH!
-Fancy knife that lady prisoner had. Interesting.
-This weird hallucination of Wesley's reminds me of an episode of House.
-So...Wesley is trying to convince himself to get Faith?
-Angelus. Always a taunter. Gotta love it.
-Soo...Cordelia is the Puppetmaster? And...EW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-Well, the demon non-fighting spell worked. But is Connor part demon so he can't fight anyone in the hotel??
-Wesley and Faith, together again, eh?
-Faith contemplating Angelous being back. She knows what's up.
-A Slayer? A little rusty? Looks like Wesley is turning into a real Watcher.
-Wrench in Cordy's plan much?
-Thank you Faith for telling Connor what's what.
-Angelus checking on The Slayer. "It's the other one." Heh.
-Does Dawn ever mention to Buffy that Angel called looking for her then just hangs up? a little suspicious?
-And again Connor getting taken down a notch. Thank you, Faith.
-Ut-oh. Beast vs. Slayer. Let's see how this goes.
-Oh, Beast, you should probably never call a Slayer weak.
-HAHAHA. The look of glee on Angelus' face when he stabs the Beast is just excellent.
-Yay, daytime!
-Sorry, Angelus, did you forget Slayers have brains, too?
-"Where's Cordy? Does she know?" Heh. I bet she's real happy.
-Frickin' Joss Whedon what are you up to?? Baby of Connor can't be anything good. And there goes Cordelia manipulating him like crazy.

 

[AnthonyCordova]

After how impossible it seemed the beast was to hurt in previous fights I was wondering what it was going to take to beat him. I thought it was going to take something drastic or special or ingenious, or something like the slayer spell/boost like the one Buffy used to beat Adam in S4. Then he gets stabbed in the back and just like that he's finished. Does anyone else feel it was kind of a copout? It not only happened too easily, but it was also real unimaginative. After building up that guy, that's the best they can come up with to finish him? An all-too-convenient special artifact (that the beast carelessly allows to be taken from him) one back stab and that's it? It's like the writers got themselves into a corner and didn't know how to get out...or they felt lazy or suddenly uninterested and thought, "oh we'll just get rid of him this way real quick". I expected something epic or ingenious.

 

[The Thirst Evil]

I'm on a Buffy/Angel watchthrough at the minute, and for some reason I've found myself really loving Faith as a character this time around, more than ever before. I've watched through both series so many times and I've never been so excited to see Faith again as I was when I watched this episode today. It's too early to tell, but I think Faith might be turning into my new favourite character.

 

[Samuel Reyes]

Angelus babbles way too much during these episodes, bordering on cartoonish. It was nice to bring him back to fight Faith, but he was far scarier and more interesting in Buffy Season 2.

 

[Out for a walk]

In the middle of this episode...but the person that attacked Faith in the prison is the same actress that attacked Buffy at the school. One of the assassins I think?

I like how Joss is loyal and usually casts people multiple times in his universe.

 

[Give Us A Kiss]

They are chasing Angelus while they should be chasing Cordy instead...

Windows won't help, he will get in if he wants...

Vampire bar ???

1845 ??? That was over 170 years ago

Is Wes hallucinating ???

Bloodroot ???

Sluk, I'm using that instead of the f word from now on

Something's seriously off with Cordy...

Meanwhile in prison, we see Faith again after a very, very long time

Did Deb try to steal David Bowie's hair ??? cause it looks awful...

Lilah has been beheaded

If he's made of rock, will covering him with a big piece of paper kill him ???

Angelus is kind of lame, and his hair goes straight up

Cordy is officially possessed, and she's in charge of the beast.

Good luck with that Wes...

I think that Faith would be helpful, she's redeemed...

At least they get the news in prison.

Angelus is back, guess it's more important than being in prison...

Faith, please wear a seat belt...

Faith ? Rusty ? I doubt that...

Cordy, stay out of this...

Faith sure has matured since she stopped being evil...

Angelus, leave Dawn alone, she has enough to deal with already...

Faith isn't all boring and vanilla, she's still more or less the same as she was before, except for the evil part of course...

Faith is fast, no wonder her mom called her a firecracker when she was younger.

Faith is not dinner, even if she may look like she has some meat on her...

Angelus...

The beast is treating Faith like a rag doll, he's succeeding

The sun is back

Connor is just like his father...

It must be nice to have a dirt free belly button...

Next time: The beast is dead, but this isn't over yet.

 

[Mr Trick]

After how impossible it seemed the beast was to hurt in previous fights I was wondering what it was going to take to beat him. I thought it was going to take something drastic or special or ingenious, or something like the slayer spell/boost like the one Buffy used to beat Adam in S4. Then he gets stabbed in the back and just like that he's finished. Does anyone else feel it was kind of a copout? It not only happened too easily, but it was also real unimaginative. After building up that guy, that's the best they can come up with to finish him? An all-too-convenient special artifact (that the beast carelessly allows to be taken from him) one back stab and that's it? It's like the writers got themselves into a corner and didn't know how to get out...or they felt lazy or suddenly uninterested and thought, "oh we'll just get rid of him this way real quick". I expected something epic or ingenious.

Sorry for replying 5 years too late! But yes that did cross my mind too. I think they did it that way because of the Beast only being one part of a wider puzzle. But they did back themselves into a corner by building him up so much in the first place.

One of the things I like about Wes going to Faith and them working together again is it was a chance for him to be a better Watcher to her than his was back in Sunnydale. Except here they are more equal and both characters have changed a lot.

And yes God do I hate the Cordy acting evil stuff!

 

[Kratos]

Really good episode aside from the Cordy/Connor stuff. I watched most of Angel before Buffy, so this episode was my introduction to Faith and, like Connor, she left a big impression on me.

 

[Gnomie192]

It's interesting that Angelus can remember Buffy's telephone number but Angel can't remember the cirrect colour of her eyes in season 5

 

[Stake fodder]

I have been thinking the past few episodes that Charisma Carpenter was really starting to look pregnant, and I guess the writers agreed, with the surprise twist of the pregnancy plot! Angel(us) is going to be a grandpa, aww.

The scenes with Wes and dead Lilah were affecting. We see that he really did love her, and it's completely believable how hard it is for him to behead her corpse.

Connor says, "I don't give a flying sluk what Wesley says." Way to get around those censors! I might use this line myself.

Hurrah for the return of Faith! I can't figure out if her prisoner number, 430019, means something. She's been keeping her skills up in prison, and doesn't need the test Wes gives her on the way back, stopping the car for her to kill some vamps. Apparently, Angel stopped visiting her, since she doesn't even know about Connor, which is a pity, since I liked their friendship, and wish it had been built on more in the series.

So, Cordelia is the power behind the throne of the Beast. My respect for him has diminished. He was much cooler when he didn't talk... or kiss, bleagh! The best thing about him being killed is that we won't have to see more of that.

I loved that Lorne came up with the idea of the anti-violence spell. He's not just a pretty face. ❤️

How did Faith ever think she didn't have leadership skills? She comes in and takes right over. Gunn: "I hold my own." Faith: "That's a shame." Heh. And Connor's little smile when she put him in his place - I think he's in love!

Angelus calls Dawn to check that Buffy isn't the vampire slayer he's heard is in town. Was this mirrored in BtVS? I don't remember that.

I don't get why Angelus killed the Beast, but likely it will be made clear. For now, I wondered for a moment if he was really Angel all the time (since the spell) and just faking for some reason. But whose side is Angelus on? His own, of course, I know. It just makes no sense.

 

[Bop]

How did Faith ever think she didn't have leadership skills? She comes in and takes right over. Gunn: "I hold my own." Faith: "That's a shame." Heh. And Connor's little smile when she put him in his place - I think he's in love!

If you mean compared to season 7, Angel's group was far more experienced and easier to mobilise than Buffy's group. The only person Faith had to wrangle on Angel's group was Connor and he did low-key respect (and fancy) Faith so with a bit of pushback he was kept in line.
With Buffy's group most of them are scared or very difficult.

 

[KaitKat]

If you mean compared to season 7, Angel's group was far more experienced and easier to mobilise than Buffy's group. The only person Faith had to wrangle on Angel's group was Connor and he did low-key respect (and fancy) Faith so with a bit of pushback he was kept in line.
With Buffy's group most of them are scared or very difficult.

I also think it’s a case of being away from Buffy who she has always felt inferior to. She feels like the second rate slayer when she’s back in Sunnydale, hell it’s like the wrote into her redemption arc that the could never be Buffy’s equal.

 

[Bop]

I also think it’s a case of being away from Buffy who she has always felt inferior to. She feels like the second rate slayer when she’s back in Sunnydale, hell it’s like the wrote into her redemption arc that the could never be Buffy’s equal.

I agree that's partly what makes Faith's episodes on Angel so refreshing because Faith by design was a foil for Buffy but on Angel, Buffy is not around so she's something else on Angel.

The way Wesley introduced Faith to the team was a moment because who is "Faith the Vampire Slayer" she was never referred to on Buffy like that 😄

It's awesome because for 3 episodes of Angel, Wesley and Faith had the role of co-leads.