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Discussion of 8.20 "After These Messages..." - Released 17/12/08 (Dark Horse)

white avenger

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I haven't read this one yet, but it obviously includes Dawn at a time when Buffy and the gang are still in high school, which is contrary to canon. I wonder how they're gonna resolve that?
 

Primal Slayer

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I haven't read this one yet, but it obviously includes Dawn at a time when Buffy and the gang are still in high school, which is contrary to canon. I wonder how they're gonna resolve that?
It is in canon since all of their memories were altered to include Dawn in them.

I loved the issue. Even though the majority of the issue was just a big dream and could have taken place during the animated short that we saw, I loved every minute of it. Going from the "real" world to Buffys dream land was good.

I really wish they would do a spin-off starting from S1 in this style.
 

Clem Rocks

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I haven't read it yet, but from what i've read on Whedonesque, it's one of the worst yet. Do we really get no clues about Twilight? No big mysteries? Absolutely nothing to speculate on?

Discussing different theories with you guys is the best bit of the comics
 

Primal Slayer

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I haven't read it yet, but from what i've read on Whedonesque, it's one of the worst yet. Do we really get no clues about Twilight? No big mysteries? Absolutely nothing to speculate on?

Discussing different theories with you guys is the best bit of the comics
No this is just your usual stand alone story which we knew for awhile. No clues, no mysteries, just pure simpleness. Which I didnt mind.
 
C
Clem Rocks
I know it's just a standalone, but A Beautiful Sunset had stuff for us to speculate about

Primal Slayer

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The only thing that could be somewhat speculative was Buffy going on about changing the future "you cant change a persons past. And just by telling them, you'll change their future into who knows what" I guess she could be talking about the Fray arc and Emo Willow. But one thing is for sure, she misses the old days like hell.
 

AndrewCrossett

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Jeph Loeb writes it pretty much the way the animated series would have been written if it had happened. Mostly action and fun with the majority of the uber-angst stripped away. His style is a little bit different from what we've seen so far in Season 8.

Points of note...spoilers here for those who haven't read it yet...





I wonder who is the owner of the country house that Buffy, Xander, Willow and Dawn are staying in. And I wonder where all the Slayers, Wiccans, etc. are.

Dawny is still a centaur, and not a giant monkey robot. Which is good, because having her be a giant monkey robot would just be silly.

Buffy seems to get very sad when she meets/thinks about Angel. Maybe sadder than one would expect based on their last meeting in "Chosen" or anything we heard about in the final season of "Angel." Maybe this is a hint at some as-yet-unrevealed incident that happened in the interim? Or the events of the "After the Fall" comic? Or maybe just Jeph trying to inject a little relationship angst into the mix so it seems a bit more like classic Buffy?

Buffy seems to feel the need to hug Willow every time she travels back or forth in time, whether it be for real or in a dream. Cute.

And, from what we saw of Buffy's doings in the first couple of pages, she killed Great Cthulhu himself! Way to go Buff!
 
A

Allycat

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I liked this issue. Although in the larger scale of things it didn't really further the plot it was a fun excersize. I was also happy to see characters like Snyder, Joyce, Cordelia, and Angel on Buffy again, even though it was just a dream. Kudos to Jeph Loeb for capturing the voices.

I have to critize one aspect of this issue and that's the letterscol. In response to a letter about Angel, that wasn't printed, Scott writes. "... it would be rude of me to run your letter here. I've been critized for not running every single letter unedited, but I reserve the right to omit letters that tear down writers and artists... even if they're not my writers and artists." In not publishing the full letter and responding to its content, Scott hides between political correctness, but still allows the insult to Angel to be read. If he'd published the full letter, he'd have to actually respond to it, and either dismiss or support the claims.
 

AndrewCrossett

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The only jarring note was Buffy's offhanded dismissal of Cordelia's death, as other people have mentioned before. I guess since Buffy had very little direct contact with her after she left Sunnydale, maybe she isn't fully aware of how much Cordy changed and the circumstances of her death.

The full-page closeup on the last page of this issue was the visual highlight. It really captured the loneliness that Buffy is feeling at this point.
 

sosa lola

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The only jarring note was Buffy's offhanded dismissal of Cordelia's death, as other people have mentioned before. I guess since Buffy had very little direct contact with her after she left Sunnydale, maybe she isn't fully aware of how much Cordy changed and the circumstances of her death.
Since it was a dream, I don't see the point of discussing this anymore. We sat lots of weird stuff in dreams.

I reality the Scoobies always had a black humor thing going on, like when Willow said, "Or we could kill Anya?" in S7 after all the developments and sacrifices Anya had made and the Scoobies had witnessed. Buffy never liked Cordelia and never knew about the changes she went through. Only Willow seemed interested in what happens in LA with Angel's gang.

And the most important thing, Cordelia just insulted Willow. Buffy needed to make her friend feel better by telling her that she will outlive them and Cordelia will die soon like the rest of them.
 

AndrewCrossett

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I suppose considering where Buffy's head is at during season 8, it was a perfectly appropriate thing for her to say.
 

Silum

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i thought this was a pretty good one. I liked seeing Buffy with all her 'refined' slayers skills kicking ass while her friends watching in amazement. The last page was pretty sweet too
 
U
UnKle
Yeah, Season 1 Buffy just can't even shine a candle to Season 8 Buffy. Buffy does stuff now without blinking, that she would have never been able to do 8 years ago. Mad skillz, yo!

Lyri

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This was such a fun little isue. I really loved getting back to the basics, and the less complicated early seasons, even though Buffy was still her S8 self.

I thought the last page was beautiful. I loved that so very much.

One thing that did bug me a little was whenm Buffy is talking to Angel, she's thinking about him at the same time and she thinks 'Before I knew he was Angelus and all handsomey'. then she says to him 'Any other reason you might have in that undead head of yours'. Angel nhever picks up on her slip of the tongue, never questions how she knows he's undead. Nothing really majorm, but it just annoyed me, lol.
 

FeastOnScraps

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It was a lot of fun to read. It really made me miss the old days and what the animated show to be made. The plot was little thin I though but it was good.
 

AndrewCrossett

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I thought the last page was beautiful. I loved that so very much.
Although I love Jo Chen for her covers and pinups, I think Jeanty has emerged as my all-time favorite Buffy interior comics artist. He does a great job of capturing such a large and subtle range of emotions. That final page just made me want to reach into the book and hug her. It made a lot of the difference as far as preventing this issue from just being a "silly filler" affair in the end.

It will also make an excellent final page for the "Time of Your Life" paperback.
 
U
UnKle
Totally felt the same about the final page. I just feel kinda heartbreak for Buffy anymore. I hope she gets some happiness, someday.

AndrewCrossett

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Three things about this issue which may simply be random quirks on Loeb's part, or may have some deeper significance:

1. When Buffy first sees Willow in her past-dream, she acts very surprised to see that Willow is alive and not evil. But Buffy knows she only killed the future Dark Willow, not "her" present-day Willow. Why is she so shocked at seeing Will alive?

2. When she returns from her dream, Present!Willow tells her, "Andrew called in and he's in Madrid again...the vamp nest looks bigger than they thought, again." And Buffy replies, "Why do you keep saying again?"

Now, there was reference way back in issue #1 to Andrew having to deal with a Spanish vamp nest that was bigger than they thought...but why would Willow (who wasn't around yet) know about that and Buffy (who was around) NOT know about it?

3. Buffy's dream covers the events of an entire day, but her friends tell her she only dropped off to sleep for a few seconds. While there is certainly time compression in dreams, usually you don't start dreaming the instant you fall asleep, and I don't think it's possible to dream a whole day, in detail, in 4 seconds.

So... is there some sort of subtle reality displacement going on here? Was this more than just a dream? Are the events of "Time of Your Life" starting to have their first slight noticeable effects on the time stream?

Because God knows, when Joss presents us with something that looks like innocent filler... it usually isn't.
 
T
tommy
the time thing is fishy, yup
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