Do you like Cangel?

[FaithLehane16]

The whole ship felt very forced and seemed to only happen because the writers decided that, as a Male Lead, Angel must have a love interest and Cordelia was the nearest available female character.

It is possible to live life being single and have friends/family to enjoy it with.

 

[Cangel1987]

Maybe it's really rude. But I just stopped reading by a specific point because I thought it was nonsense. And I was and I am today in a bad mood that is why I thought I stop reading before I write something I would regret.

Normally I am a friendly and open person who can also listen to criticism, but after my ”great” working day, I just did not have the mood for it. I just could not deal with it.

There are some points which brought me over the edge plus my work. I am sorry if I offered someone – I didnt want to.

I just hate when someone try to " injury " my favorite couple, there I see red and I cant help myself. Because I also try to respect other favorite couples as well.

 

[FaithLehane16]

As friends, absolutely.

As I've watched the two series more and more, the more I find the friendship to be contrived. I mean it doesn't make sense to me that these two would automatically start a friendship after they hardly had interaction in Buffy Season 1, half of Season 2, and all of Season 3. I mean Oz, Xander, and Willow had more interaction with Angel than Cordelia ever did in those seasons.

 

[thrasherpix]

In my headcanon, Cangel only came about because Jasmine was tweaking it to happen...especially when Cordelia has a conversation with her own reflection about how much she loves Angel, I see that as Jasmine giving her custom made vision to push Cordelia into making her choice so she could sacrifice the relationship to prove her worth (and thus come fully into Jasmine's power) before Cordelia realized Angel (who Jasmine didn't give a damn about once Connor was born) was in some sort of trouble.

Again, my headcanon. The way it was written and portrayed, I just couldn't buy the Cangel, especially when Cordelia's reflection comes to life. While I like to think the writers were actually thinking this as well, it feels like they were just making it up as they went along for the most part (they had a broad formula that Joss told them to make happen) and wrote themselves into a corner after shoehorning Cangel into it.

 

[Taake]

Maybe it's really rude. But I just stopped reading by a specific point because I thought it was nonsense. And I was and I am today in a bad mood that is why I thought I stop reading before I write something I would regret.

Normally I am a friendly and open person who can also listen to criticism, but after my ”great” working day, I just did not have the mood for it. I just could not deal with it.

There are some points which brought me over the edge plus my work. I am sorry if I offered someone – I didnt want to.

I just hate when someone try to " injury " my favorite couple, there I see red and I cant help myself. Because I also try to respect other favorite couples as well.

If you have had a bad day, it is advisable to take time off of the boards instead of trying to take your bad mood out on someone else.

Feeling like someone else is being rude about your ship does not make it acceptable to be rude to them. It doesn’t exactly demonstrate your respect for others or their ship either. If you knew you were out of temper, perhaps staying away from sensitive topics that day is something to consider.

No because it goes against the show's purpose and why Angel left Buffy in Sunnydale in the first place. Angel and Cordy are hardly compatible. If he were to achieve a true moment of happiness with her (which he NEVER did), he would have easily sunk his teeth into her neck the next morning. Cordelia is obviously weaker than Buffy.

This ship is very insensitive towards Buffy considering Cordelia's treatment towards Buffy in the past. Buffy saved Cordelia's life a zillion times while Cordelia was an ungrateful bitch towards Buffy. Cordelia blames Buffy when darkness follows. It doesn't follow whenever Buffy is around, it is when Faith, Wesley, Giles, Oz, Xander, Willow, and Angel is around. She told Angel to set up an agency to help people against demons/darkness. So that is hypocrisy there.


Cordelia's behavior towards Angel annoyed me greatly in Season 2.

https://theangelrewatch.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F111096183295
It wasn't Angel's fault that Cordelia had "no where else to go". It's her own fault that she doesn't know how to fill out an application in to Macy's and give up her visions. Angel didn't deserve to grovel over her forgiveness by buying her "presents".

I'm having a hard time thinking how a marriage between these two characters would be like. They would get a divorce within a year. They are not even compatible. When he invited her to the ballet, she feel asleep on his shoulder.

The writers had to change Cordelia in AtS Season 3 to be Saint Corduffy in order to be with Angel. The writers knew that Buffy and slayers were his type, so Cordelia had to act like a poor conceited version of Buffy in order to be with Angel.

https://camillesengelsons.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F159801599830
https://eversincetheman.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F97358739104
Well in Angel Season 3, they made Angel look dumb as well as the gang. We can see Cordelia and Wesley telling Fred taht she cannot have a relationship with Angel considering his curse and why he left Buffy back in Sunnydale. They pretty much decided to throw everything that is said about Cordelia being against Angel being with Buffy&being in a relationship because of the result of Angelus coming forth. Also they tried to erase how snotty and ungrateful Cordelia was against Buffy, something Angel doesn't like. The Angel writers in Season 3 were making the whole Angel gang be so goddamn insensitive towards Buffy. Who set Angel on his path on doing the good fight and saving souls? It sure as hell isn't Cordelia. It was Buffy. In Amends, Buffy put him on that path. Lorne, an empath demon should have known better to not to meddle in Angel's love life and that Cordelia doesn't really like Buffy, which makes me confused of why Cordelia was on the show in the first place. Cordelia wasn't much of a hero as Buffy was. She never had the same exact strength as Buffy does, which makes You're Welcome stupid considering Eve has better power over Cordelia. Cordelia didn't have much training to begin with while Buffy has thousand more experience than she does. Buffy is also a seer.
Then AtS acts hypocritical and spends s3-4 trying to shove Angel & Cordelia into a “two champions” romance, calling it Kyrumption. Ignoring the friendship to turn it into Bangel 2.0 complete with scene recreations and matching dialogue but not in a mocking way. They just flat out plagiarized the ship while ignoring why it’d have the same issues and with the writers admitting Cangel was never intended to work out and really was for a two season plot to have an emotional punch.
The fact that they had Cordy mocking the relationship at the beginning of season 3 but by the season 3 finale she is a blonde haired part demon warrior human with visions who is in love with Angel. Like Buffy. They did to her what she did to Groo when she cut his hair and dressed him in Angel’s clothes.
As for Season 4, they kept on continuing with damn love triangles, which did nothing good. Even when Angel brought Buffy up in the second or first episode, he thought it would still be alright to try and find Cordelia even though Buffy lives 2 hours away. So let's continue with the whole Buffy/Angel/Cordelia thing even though Angel's first choice is Buffy, something that the real Cordelia couldn't settle for. Then they have this poor ass love triangle between Angel/Jasmidelia/Connor. Then they had high school persona Cordelia Chase hitting on Connor, which is something Buffy wouldn't do.

Cordelia is full of herself, which led to her downfall. She has narcissistic tendencies. From most of the quotes I've read on tumblr, it sounds like she is an egotistical individual. Her personality is what makes her unattractive. She shouldn't have been on the show. Angel should have just told her off in the beginning while Doyle should have moved on. If you pay attention to the show, you can see that she is a bad influence on Angel considering she cornered Doyle and Angel into getting paid for what Buffy(a selfless and smart girl who can kick her damn ass every day of the week) does for free. She advised Angel to move onto other people from his true love Buffy. Her stupid advice is what got Wesley killed in the finale. Everyone praises Cordelia for getting Angel back on track in You're Welcome, completely ignoring that the vision sent the group on a suicide mission that led to Wesley's death, Gunn a vampire for months, Connor temporarily dead, Angel having to commit suicide to undo all of Los Angeles trapped in Hell. If he wasn't tied to another prophecy and thus brought back to fulfill it, that would've been the end of Angel, dead because he followed Cordelia's plan to try to take down WR&H. Also let's not forget that Angel spent the entire season 5 fighting with Spike over Buffy. Plus I don't really count the episode as service for Cordelia. It's against the service of Cordelia.

Charisma is an idiot here:

https://whatisyourchildhoodtrauma.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F110569268847
I hate that everyone thinks willingly dying a preventable death was brave and heroic. Cordelia was being an idiot. Birthday is just a vision catered to Cordelia, to prey on her ego - Cordy's worst flaw. She likes to feel unique, appreciated, adored; she feels entitled or worth of stardom and fame. Of course Cordelia believed she could've been super famous. Cordelia also likes to feel selfless. What better way to make her want to become a half demon and feel worthy of being a higher being, Skip's endgame, than to convince her enough to give up fame and money to save Angel and the world? It's ridiculous. Anyone who used their brain would've realized that Angel, a champion&vampire, wouldn't need to be saved from a few visions. Doyle sure as hell wasn't dying in Season 1. He had visions a hell a lot longer than Cordelia ever did. And Cordelia has that saying " I don't think. I know." vibe to her which is ridiculous. In the long run, it makes her look bad.

Oh, the Birthday episode is a poor ass episode. It just goes to show how dumb and full of crap Cordelia is. How could she not question Skip's motives and smell bullcrap? If it was Buffy, she would be questioning Skip the way she did with Professor Walsh. Buffy knows how to prevent a preventable death considering she inspired Riley to get the crap the Initiative had out of his system.

Here are more insults against Buffy:

"I'm a bitch. I'm not a sniveling, whiney-cry, little Buffy. I'm the nastiest girl in Sunnydale history. I take crap from no one."

Cordy:"-Time out, Xander. Put yourself in Buffy’s shoes for just a minute. Okay? I’m Buffy, freak of nature, right? Naturally, I pick a freak for a boyfriend and then he turns into Mr. Killing Spree, which is pretty much my fault…"

Buffy:"-Cordy! Get out of my shoes!"

"Look Buffy, you may be hot stuff when it comes to demonology, or whatever, but when it comes to dating. I'm the Slayer."

"See in the end, Buffy's the runner up. I'm the Queen. You get me mad. What do you think I'm gonna do to you?"

Cordy doesn't like it when Halloween Buffy was latching onto her arm.

https://dailybuffy.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F165994711630
Here is Cordelia hiding behind Angel at the beginning of Season 3:

http://****yeahdavidboreanaz.tumblr.com/?og=1

And they had Angel act like it hurt when Cordelia punched him in the face during training in Season 3. Angel has been punched by Slayers & demons and they hit A LOT harder than Cordelia. Eve was scared of Cordelia because the writers try to pass Cordy as an alpha. She's all talk. She believes her own hype, which they wouldn't even admit was her downfall. Harmon was scared of Cordelia when she held a crossbow. Ridiculous! Harmony kidnapped a Slayer's little sis. Buffy is so formidable she can catch arrows and throw a stake into a vampire's heart. Harmony was just in a previous, unhealthy relationship with Spike.

She selfishly asks Angel to get paid to do what he and his special Buffy did for free. Buffy, Giles, Xander, Willow and the rest of the Scoobies (excluding Anya), would decide against it. And Cordelia was a former Scooby considering her relationship with Xander. Doyle even thought it wasn't necessary before he even met Cordelia. All of a sudden he turns into somewhat of a Yes-Man for her. Cordelia sounds pretentious. Angel didn't really need the money considering his hairdo, his clothes, and some of the stuff that he came up with. We see him buying pig's blood in Graduation Day Pt. 1.

Cordelia:


"This is a business and we should be running it like one. We should be charging. I know Angel has been working day and night helping people fight their personal demons, but I need a raise!"

The show made it clear that Buffy and Angel will never be over each other which is proven on pretty much some episodes on both shows. I roll my eyes at the fans who say Angel & Buffy grew apart and lead different lives. They both became parents to a teenager. They both had an affair with a blonde vampire (Spike and Darla) from the Aurelius line. They both were the leader of their group of paranormal investigators. They both became the head of a powerful organization that used to antagonize them.

Another thing is that Angelus was NEVER obsessed with Cordelia in Season 4 of his show. Angelus was more obsessed with Buffy in Season 2 of her show. In fact, Angelus's attention was more on Buffy and Faith in Season 4 of his show considering he has a thing for Slayers. Evil Cordy got on Connor about his attraction to Faith by saying that Connor is his father's son.

Also the relationship is a Bangel knockoff. Waiting in the WIngs is kind of like I Only Have Eyes For You. The writers were originally intending for Angel Season 4 to have the Buffy Season 2 storyline. Cordelia was going to go evil regardless of Jasmine, and Angel had to be the one who killed her. It would be Becoming 2.0. Awakening was like Amends excluding the fact that Buffy wasn't pregnant in the dream. Cordy and Angel's training sessions were mirroring the Buffy&Angel Tai Chi in Revelations, and the Buffy&Angel workout session in Helpless. Cangel's hug in You're Welcome is like Buffy putting her arms and legs around Angel in Bad Girls.

David and Charisma never had the chemistry that David had with Sarah and Julie. David prefers Bangel and even Dangel over Cangel. The way David feels about Cangel is pretty much the way I feel about it. It was too weird, awkward, and unnatural. It was contrived just like the friendship between the two. People talk about how Cordelia is the only one who can get through to Angel and know him better than everyone else. That is incorrect. In Season 1 of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, we hardly see any Angel&Cordelia interaction. Only we see her wanting to score him in Never Kill a Boy on the First Date when his attention was towards Buffy and helping Buffy. In the beginning of Buffy the Vampire Slayer Season 2 we see Cordelia going after Angel relentless up until she finds out who he really is, and the fact he keeps on ignoring her advances for his Buffy. Angel was just trying to be polite to Cordelia in Some Assembly Required and using her to get back at Buffy for dancing with Xander in When She Was Bad. Angel wasn't wanting to date Cordelia in Halloween. He was just being polite, and was waiting for Buffy. When Buffy entered the Bronze while Cordelia was talking to Angel, he broke away from the conversation so he can talk to Buffy. When mostly everyone turned into their costumes on that night, Cordelia enters the Summers' residence to speak to Angel, but Angel gives her a blank stare. When Buffy saved Cordelia's life in Reptile Boy, the first thing Cordelia does is go up and hug/thank Angel, while his attention was on Buffy. She then gets a negative opinion of him when he goes evil. Despite him having his soul back in Season 3, she continues to not trust Buffy or Angel. We never seen Angel and Cordelia even hang out individually in that season. And I'm supposed to buy their sudden friendship and then almost relationship? No.

I removed three swear words from this post, you are allowed strong feelings on a topic, but cursing is not needed to embellish those opinions. Please try to phrase yourself without cursing next time

 

[FaithLehane16]

I removed three swear words from this post, you are allowed strong feelings on a topic, but cursing is not needed to embellish those opinions. Please try to phrase yourself without cursing next time

Okay. Sorry.

The way it was written and portrayed, I just couldn't buy the Cangel, especially when Cordelia's reflection comes to life. While I like to think the writers were actually thinking this as well, it feels like they were just making it up as they went along for the most part (they had a broad formula that Joss told them to make happen) and wrote themselves into a corner after shoehorning Cangel into it.

I think they would've came up with another, better storyline than this. I felt it was unnecessary for the entire series.

 

[NeddaSai]

No, the show started to lose me when all the inter-AI romance appeared in season 3.. I'm also including the Frunn/Fresley nonsense.

 

[FaithLehane16]

No, the show started to lose me when all the inter-AI romance appeared in season 3.. I'm also including the Frunn/Fresley nonsense.

It just seemed when Angel Season 3 started, it just became a really dark soap opera up until Season 5.

 

[thetopher]

I liked them as friends and even then, after watching the fantastic video @Taake posted, I'd rate Angel/Wesley the better, closer friendship.

I even read a fic of them by a talented writer named Yahtzee ('The Uninvited Guest' for those who want to look it up) in an effect to 'get' the couple but despite the writer being able to depict multiple characters accurately and authentically I failed to find 'them' as authentic. Neither the depth of Cordelia's understanding/feeling or Angel's emotional need for Cordelia rang true.

I honestly don't think I'll see it, although I do enjoy 'You're Welcome' as a true celebration of who Cordelia could've become if Cangel hadn't happened.

 

[FaithLehane16]

Cordelia was rude to Buffy in the past and faked liked her in Angel's show around Angel so she won't get fired because she cares about money even though she hates her boss's love of his life. Cordy and Angel aren't compatible suitors because of their different interests. Buffy is more into poetry and plays than Cordelia is. The Cangel storyline went against the reason why Angel reluctantly left Buffy, the love of his life, back in Sunnydale. Also it's canon that the only woman Angel lost his soul to was Buffy. Cordelia never triggered his soul. Not even in that one dream sequence considering that is the work of the Shaman, and he called out Buffy's name after. I don't think Cordelia would have the patience of fighting over Angel's place in his heart when Buffy lives two hours away.

David's heart wasn't in his acting when they did the ridiculous Cangel storyline. At least it looked that way. The writers literally lost their minds.

You're Welcome will never make sense to me now because it disrupts what is actually going on..

I'd rate Angel/Wesley the better, closer friendship.

Same here. It makes better sense for me. Wesley has a better understanding of Angel than Cordelia does.

 

[RachM]

Cordelia was rude to Buffy in the past and faked liked her in Angel's show around Angel so she won't get fired because she cares about money even though she hates her boss's love of his life.

To be fair, Buffy gives as good as she gets when it comes to Cordy and I think hate is too strong a term to use. Cordelia and Buffy certainly didn't like one another all that much, but they didn't outright hate each other and they shared a few moments over the series which indicated a mild respect for one another.

Cordy and Angel aren't compatible suitors because of their different interests. Buffy is more into poetry and plays than Cordelia is.

Um, there is zero indication on either show that Buffy is into either of those things. I mean, I agree that Buffy and Angel had more in common than Cordy and Angel, but plays and poetry definitely weren't things they had in common.

 

[FaithLehane16]

To be fair, Buffy gives as good as she gets when it comes to Cordy and I think hate is too strong a term to use. Cordelia and Buffy certainly didn't like one another all that much, but they didn't outright hate each other and they shared a few moments over the series which indicated a mild respect for one another.

I still don't think that scores points to me. I mean Buffy is one of my top 5 favorite characters, and I respect her too much. Cordelia doesn't really impress me all that much.

Buffy doesn't seem like the type to fall asleep on Angel's shoulder when they are at an interesting play.

 

[RachM]

I still don't think that scores points to me. I mean Buffy is one of my top 5 favorite characters, and I respect her too much. Cordelia doesn't really impress me all that much.

I don't really understand what you mean by "score points"?

Buffy doesn't seem like the type to fall asleep on Angel's shoulder when they are at an interesting play.

But what evidence are you basing this on? Where, in either show, does Buffy ever indicate that she enjoys plays/the ballet? And even if Cordelia did fall asleep, that's not a reason to automatically assume that she and Angel wouldn't be compatible. I mean, I don't believe they are compatible but this seems like a really trivial reason to not ship them. I fall asleep when my husband makes me watch anime with him but that doesn't mean we aren't compatible in other areas.

 

[Cangel1987]

Cordelia was rude to Buffy in the past and faked liked her in Angel's show around Angel so she won't get fired because she cares about money even though she hates her boss's love of his life. Cordy and Angel aren't compatible suitors because of their different interests. Buffy is more into poetry and plays than Cordelia is. The Cangel storyline went against the reason why Angel reluctantly left Buffy, the love of his life, back in Sunnydale. Also it's canon that the only woman Angel lost his soul to was Buffy. Cordelia never triggered his soul. Not even in that one dream sequence considering that is the work of the Shaman, and he called out Buffy's name after. I don't think Cordelia would have the patience of fighting over Angel's place in his heart when Buffy lives two hours away.

David's heart wasn't in his acting when they did the ridiculous Cangel storyline. At least it looked that way. The writers literally lost their minds.

You're Welcome will never make sense to me now because it disrupts what is actually going on..


Same here. It makes better sense for me. Wesley has a better understanding of Angel than Cordelia does.

Yes, Cordelia was rude to Buffy - as well as to Willow and Xander. She was really rude and naughty and she did says things, she shouldnt have - but who didn't do it ??? But did not Cordelia pay enough for her boyfriend (Xander) to cheat on her with his childhood friend? Was it not enought that she was pierced with wood??

We never will know if Cordelia would have been capable to remove his soul - because we did not get that far!

I also think that he called for Buffy was a help scream because he know she was the only one who could stop him.

I dont get why some are upset with Angel that he have left Buffy. It was Joyce who told him to leave her daughter - but I have never hear someone complain about Joyce. Only Angel he is damned to stay alone...Ridiculous just ridiculous!

Well he played it well enought that I have buy the story telling

 

[FaithLehane16]

But what evidence are you basing this on?

Helpless.

I don't really understand what you mean by "score points"?

Score points (with someone): to do something that will make someone like you.
Example sentence: He tried really hard to be funny and cool to try to score points with Amanda.

 

[Holden Webster]

Buffy likes ice shows, so I am sure she appreciates ballet. As for very interesting plays, she is somehow familiar with both Waiting for Godot and The Death of a Salesman.

 

[RachM]

Helpless.

So, Angel gives her one book of poems (in a language she can't read) and you decided that she love poetry? That's kind of thin. Especially since in Season 1 she didn't even know who Emily Dickinson was.

Score points (with someone): to do something that will make someone like you.
Example sentence: He tried really hard to be funny and cool to try to score points with Amanda.

I know what "score points" means in general, I don't understand why you were using it in the context you did. I wasn't trying to make Cordelia "score points" with you, I was simply pointing out that she and Buffy were equally antagonistic towards one another.

 

[FaithLehane16]

I know what "score points" means in general, I don't understand why you were using it in the context you did. I wasn't trying to make Cordelia "score points" with you, I was simply pointing out that she and Buffy were equally antagonistic towards one another.

Cordelia deserves it more than Cordelia ever did. There wasn't an excuse in Cordelia's behavior. I understand Buffy pretty well. I don't like getting bullied for no apparent reason. Cordelia antagonizes Buffy more than Buffy does her. That makes her look worse in my eyes.

Buffy likes ice shows, so I am sure she appreciates ballet. As for very interesting plays, she is somehow familiar with both Waiting for Godot and The Death of a Salesman.

Exactly!! Thank you very much!

I mean Cordelia deserves it more Buffy ever did.

 

[Ceadsearc03]

MOO but the issues I have with Cangel working (aside from the chemistry and them being better as friends etc.) is the entire Angel and his soul and why he left Buffy. I know after Connor his soul may no longer be an issue but the way I see it, it’s one of the following:

1. Soul is an issue and Cangel has the same issues as Bangel.
2. Soul is an issue but not with Cordelia and therefore she always knows she is second to Buffy, which I can’t see her being ok with.
3. Soul is not an issue, in which case hard to believe he wouldn’t go to Buffy.
4. Soul is not an issue but he also left Buffy so she could have a normal life so he doesn’t go back to her, in which case we are back to him caring about Buffy more and Cordelia being second choice.
5. Soul is not an issue and he suddenly loves Cordelia more than Buffy (which I assume is the Cangel fan mindset) but doesn’t mesh at all with Angel in Chosen or the end of AtS S5 or anything really. Basically, majorly OOC.

 

[FaithLehane16]

Soul is an issue but not with Cordelia and therefore she always knows she is second to Buffy, which I can’t see her being ok with.

Technically, she would be number 3 if you consider Darla into the equation.