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Faith and Buffy's last scene in Revelations

r2dh2

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One more question about Revelations. When Buffy goes to Faith's motel and tries to apologize, we all know that Faith is too hurt to hear or trust anyone. But right before Buffy leaves, Faith is about to say something and then changes her mind, letting Buffy go... what do you think that Faith was going to say? Honestly, I have no imagination, not much comes to mind. What are your thoughts? Did Buffy get to her for a second? Was she going to open up about how she feels? Was she going to tell her not to come back? How do you read this very last scene and Faith's hesitation towards the end of it?
 

Bop

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I think Faith felt instant regret over being difficult so it seemed like she was going to say sorry to Buffy for that but then realised she didn't even want to be that vulnerable so said "Nothing" instead. I got that from the look on her face when Buffy turned around to leave because Faith wasn't accepting her attempt at an apology, it definitely didn't look like she was going to take it further and tell Buffy not to come back because she didn't seem angry at all.
 
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KaitKat

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I think the fight is done and the anger is gone, Faith looked so vulnerable in this scene. I honestly think she was going to tell Buffy that she forgave her but decided that after being manipulated by Gwendolyn Post, being lied to by Buffy, being blown off my Buffy, feeling rejected by the Scoobies, and used by Xander, she just can’t bring herself to keep putting herself out there and keep trying so she says nevermind.

Revelations is a great episode
 

Priceless

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I think Faith is still carrying a lot of anger at the start of the scene. She's obviously still annoyed with Buffy, but also with herself, for being taken in and not learning the lesson 'you can't trust people, I shoulda learnt that by now'.

When Buffy suggests Faith can trust her, Faith puts down the magazine, crosses her arms and her legs. She is so closed off to this overture of friendship and basically gives Buffy the brush off. It's only as Buffy is turning to leave, that I think Faith wants to say 'thank you', for at least trying, for coming to see her and see if she's okay.

But when Buffy turns and Faith sees that hopeful look on her face and I think something in Faith is hurting so much, she wants to make Buffy hurt just as much, so she says 'nothing'.

I wonder if the metaphor continues because Buffy walks outside into the world of 'not-nothing', and Faith is left in the motel room, only looking out of the brightly lit window, but she's trapped in this small space, which is made even smaller because she's confined to the bed. And Buffy walks down some steps, as though the bed is upstairs, and Buffy goes down . . . not sure if that means anything, but it's interesting.
 

Faded90

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‘I love you’

No seriously I think she was about to say ‘I’m sorry too’ but then when Buffy actually looked at her she realised her anger and distrust were more than her feelings of feeling sorry
 

thetopher

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How about 'you did have a choice, and you made it'.

What's amazing about the scene is that Buffy doesn't really attempt any kind of apology towards Faith, she simply states 'I didn't have a choice'.
In Buffyverse parlance that is pretty much the opposite of apology because it implies that she could not have acted differently, that there was no other outcome to this other than their slayer-fight.
Buffy could've offered more of an olive branch but in that absence Faith instead just focuses on Post's terrible advice; she remarks that her place is 'real spartan' and that she has to rely solely on herself ('for a true warrior needs nothing else'); info imparted to her by Post's manipulations.
 
T
thrasherpix
And season 2 Buffy says "there's always a choice" even if none of the choices are good. Presumably she lived that when she ran Angel through with the sword.

KaitKat

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How about 'you did have a choice, and you made it'.

What's amazing about the scene is that Buffy doesn't really attempt any kind of apology towards Faith, she simply states 'I didn't have a choice'.
In Buffyverse parlance that is pretty much the opposite of apology because it implies that she could not have acted differently, that there was no other outcome to this other than their slayer-fight.
Buffy could've offered more of an olive branch but in that absence Faith instead just focuses on Post's terrible advice; she remarks that her place is 'real spartan' and that she has to rely solely on herself ('for a true warrior needs nothing else'); info imparted to her by Post's manipulations.


I agree I hated that line so much because of shows that Buffy learned nothing. I can even understand saying “I felt like I didn’t have a choice,” because as humans when faced with two choices we don’t like and when we pick the easier option, keeping secrets, that is how we felt at the time. I’d like to think that Buffy is smart enough that after the events of this episode played out she would have understood that her choice to hide Angel and keep secrets led to a lot of problems.
 
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thetopher

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I agree I hated that line so much because of shows that Buffy learned nothing.

I think that Buffy feels this rather than thinks it; she feels like she didn't have a choice and so that's how she explains things. Buffy is never the bestest communicator but with Giles and Xander that didn't really matter; they understood what with the past being painful and complicated and other things matter more, etc etc.

But her relationship with Faith is too fragile for a non-apology to be acceptable. Faith (apart from Giles) was the only one in the episode who was acting 'in good faith' throughout; she was doing her job with no agendas.
Post was evil and manipulative, Xander was angry and vengeful, and Buffy was lying to everybody, and yet in the end Faith is the one left out in the cold whilst everyone else carries on regardless.
If I'm not mistaken part of the next episode is devoted to the question of whether Buffy can leave Sunnydale and have a happy normal life in college somewhere. Faith's name never comes up, which is telling.


I’d like to think that Buffy is smart enough that after the events of this episode played out she would have understood that her choice to hide Angel and keep secrets led to a lot of problems.

Well, she's 18 years old and still figuring stuff out. I don't think she wants to bask in more 'I could've handled that better', especially after the previous year. Mostly she's just relieved that there are no more secrets and pressure and wants to move on, devoting a minimal amount of effort to mending fences, which I guess is understandable.
 
KaitKat
KaitKat
I don’t disagree with anything you say and I don’t hate Buffy in this episode that line has always bothered me though and probably always will.

Bop

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I agree I hated that line so much because of shows that Buffy learned nothing. I can even understand saying “I felt like I didn’t have a choice,” because as humans when faced with two choices we don’t like and when we pick the easier option, keeping secrets, that is how we felt at the time. I’d like to think that Buffy is smart enough that after the events of this episode played out she would have understood that her choice to hide Angel and keep secrets led to a lot of problems.
I just think if you imagine someone apologising to you they would rarely just say 'I didn't have a choice'. They would probably say 'I just felt like I didn't have a choice' and then give at least one reason why. I don't think Buffy would have had to bare her soul out to give just a reason for why she chose to lie.

Of course TV dialogue isn't known to be really believable but at the same time it felt weird to leave it at that.
 

thetopher

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I just think if you imagine someone apologising to you they would rarely just say 'I didn't have a choice'. They would probably say 'I just felt like I didn't have a choice' and then give at least one reason why. I don't think Buffy would have had to bare her soul out to give just a reason for why she chose to lie.

Thinking about it I think that 'I didn't have a choice' is the 'I'm sorry you feel that way' of the Buffyverse. It's a total non-apology that makes the speaker feel better without having to compromise anything, whereas the person listening just feels talked down to.
 
Bop
Bop
Exactly because by saying you didn't have a choice you're saying it was out of your control so how can you be apologising for something that you're saying isn't your fault.
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