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I prefer Angel over Buffy as a show

Mehansa

Townie
Joined
Sep 26, 2020
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41
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20
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UK
As I was watching Angel (I'm on season 3 episode 12 right now) I came to a realisation that I preferred Angel the series over Buffy the Vampire Slayer. I think this is mainly because I find the group dynamic more charming and familial over in Angel rather than in Buffy. In Buffy I feel like Xander and Willow can't always be counted on. For example, Xander could be seen as sneaky due his obsession of Buffy especially when he said Willow asked Buffy to kill Angel. Whereas over in Angel it seems like Cordy, Gunn and Wesley would always have Angels back at anytime. Overall, in Buffy I dislike Xander, but on Angel I love all the characters as they all have proper character development. In Buffy, I feel like Angel was highly downplayed as we didn't get to see any other side of Angel other than him being broody. I prefer the hilarious, charming and insightful Angel than the Angel in Buffy. In Buffy, I didn't like Cordy as much due to her being a snob all the time, but I liked how she was funny though. In Angel, I feel like we got to see the actual Cordy which made me fall in love with her, like she is still somewhat of a snob, but she has grown immensely. I've also come to realised that I prefer Wesley over Giles. Only because so far from what I've seen (opinions may change later) Wesley hasn't outright left Angel when he needed friends and family while Giles did (even if it was so that Buffy could learn to be independent). Overall, Angel the series is much more hilarious and at the same time it tackles serious issues too while Buffy only covers serious issues without the extra funny parts which is why I prefer Angel the series over Buffy the Vampire Slayer. (No spoilers plz)
 

WillowFromBuffy

To be or not to evil.
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Messages
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So, you're on Provider? Oh, you sweet summer child.

It's true that the group dynamic is very tight at that time and has mostly been so far.

I think Angel is often both charming and insightful on BtVS and sometimes even hilarious. Of course, he is a much bigger and layered character on his own show. AtS starts out with just Angel and two other main cast members, while BtVS has a larger cast and Angel starts out as merely recurring.
 

Btvs fan

Scooby
Joined
Feb 11, 2019
Messages
1,157
Age
39
As I was watching Angel (I'm on season 3 episode 12 right now) I came to a realisation that I preferred Angel the series over Buffy the Vampire Slayer. I think this is mainly because I find the group dynamic more charming and familial over in Angel rather than in Buffy. In Buffy I feel like Xander and Willow can't always be counted on. For example, Xander could be seen as sneaky due his obsession of Buffy especially when he said Willow asked Buffy to kill Angel. Whereas over in Angel it seems like Cordy, Gunn and Wesley would always have Angels back at anytime. Overall, in Buffy I dislike Xander, but on Angel I love all the characters as they all have proper character development. In Buffy, I feel like Angel was highly downplayed as we didn't get to see any other side of Angel other than him being broody. I prefer the hilarious, charming and insightful Angel than the Angel in Buffy. In Buffy, I didn't like Cordy as much due to her being a snob all the time, but I liked how she was funny though. In Angel, I feel like we got to see the actual Cordy which made me fall in love with her, like she is still somewhat of a snob, but she has grown immensely. I've also come to realised that I prefer Wesley over Giles. Only because so far from what I've seen (opinions may change later) Wesley hasn't outright left Angel when he needed friends and family while Giles did (even if it was so that Buffy could learn to be independent). Overall, Angel the series is much more hilarious and at the same time it tackles serious issues too while Buffy only covers serious issues without the extra funny parts which is why I prefer Angel the series over Buffy the Vampire Slayer. (No spoilers plz)
For what it's worth I'm the same when it comes shows Angel and Buffy.
Angel on Buffy was never more than the Teen Heartthrob love interest. DB was pretty much hired because of his looks.
The writers even made fun of it in S3. Its not till Angel that he eventually became his own character. That all said although he does imrove as an Actor DB was still limited. He was more an action hero on Angel, which he could do really well. Even to this day with Seal Team show he's still doing it
 

Priceless

Scooby
Joined
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Messages
7,610
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UK
(Upto season 3 as I don't want to spoil) Angel is a good show, no doubt about that. Angel is a much better character on his own show and the team dynamic works really well. I agree that Cordelia's character growth is great to see. Have you watched all of Buffy? I'm looking forward to seeing if your opinion changes once you've finished AtS.
 
Mehansa
Mehansa
Yea, I've watched all of Buffy. Just slowly watching Angel now cause I don't want it to be over

Athene

Scooby
Joined
Apr 8, 2017
Messages
2,392
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20
Sineya
I think the family dynamic on Angel is special because they're all kind of lost people and that's why I think it's really touching how they all come together with a purpose and support Angel. That's special in a different way from the Buffy family dynamic.
 

Faded90

Potential
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Apr 2, 2020
Messages
275
Age
62
I think the AI team seems closer because being part of Team Angel is pretty much their whole life whereas the scoobies have other things going on like college and jobs etc nobody seems to have outside friends or date etc. Despite how the dynamics are meant to be I actually find the scoobies are more ‘grown up’ at times than Team Angel. The scoobies largely talk about their problems and communicate, Team Angel at times feel like they are completely incapable of communicating to each other like adults

Regarding character development (and I’m really trying not to spoil anything!) I actually think character development on Buffy is a lot more gradual and organic, the characters largely retain who they are at their core but gradually grow and develop over the seasons whereas I feel like on Angel it tends to be some huge event happens and suddenly a character is wildly different.Angel’s characters probably have a wider scope ofdevelopment but I find it’s because of a contrived event that suddenly changes their characters rather than a gradual change

I like Angel as a show enough but I’ve always thought Buffy was head and shoulders above it. Each to their own though of course!
 
Kratos
Kratos
Agree, even though I prefer Angel over Buffy.

Myheadsgonenumb

Potential
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Oct 23, 2018
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35
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England
I think Angel maybe explores some deeper ideas than Buffy, and when they get that right then it's magic. When they get it wrong, though, it's painful. And the low points are so very very low. Buffy may be considered the less 'grownup' of the two but I think it is the stronger in terms of story arc and structure by quite a wide margin. I think maybe Angel is more experimental ... but with the high risk comes a high failure rate.

As for the teams, the scoobies are definitely better bonded - they keep the same core all the way through and they grow together. Whereas Angel's team is more transient (it's first incarnation only lasting 9 episodes) and they are always only an episode or two away from Angel going off the deep end or them being blow apart. Plus a lot of character growth in Angel seems to be achieved through misery which can get pretty wearing the longer it goes on.
There are sentences in that opening post that are not going to age well. Really really not age well.
 

RachM

I'm busy. I'm brooding.
Joined
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Messages
1,468
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Australia
I'm in the camp that prefers Angel over BtVS. Like OP, I prefer the group dynamic on Angel more plus I find Angel as a protagonist more likable and endearing than Buffy. I also love every season of Angel (yes, even Season 4) and find positives in every seasons and storylines I love in every season, whereas with Buffy I really dislike the final two seasons and that hinders my overall enjoyment of the show. And lastly, I think Angel has better/stronger characterisation than Buffy and that characters on Angel have more room to grow and change and become better versions of themselves.
 

sk

The Overlooked One
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Sweden
Sineya
I have never quite been able to feel that feel that group dynamic on Angel. At least not after season 1.
Always come across more like a some people that just works together to me rather than that deep friendship feeling I get from the scoobies on Buffy.

/SK
 

CHK DeWilSon

A BAngel fan. Always.
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London
I love BTVS. I really do and absolutely feel in terms of the storylines, characters arc and certain episodes, it has the more bigger impact in terms of cult following and legacy and will continually be viewed as a exceptional show.

So this is where my head is at HOWEVER my heart just has a little more love for ATS. Maybe because it will always be viewed as the underdog and least popular, maybe just because I ended up ever so slightly loving the character of Angel more than Buffy.

Now I doubt I would have felt this way IF Angel had stayed on BTVS but to my surprise my love for him grew as he grew as a character on his own show and believe me when I say that I would never have thought this possible given that I am a massive BAngler and also that I was one of those that was hopping mad that Buffy and Angel were separating at the end of series three.

But somehow it work for me even with the various love interests they tried to give Angel on the show. Admittedly at the time when it was first shown on tv, I pretty much resisted them all but now can see and enjoy most for what they were. I'm have got to like seeing Kate and now think it's a shame that her time was cut short but am SO glad her character arc didn't turn into any others.

I'm now very much in the mix of watching ATS on E4 as I've mention before and am excited in a way I'm not with BTVS in getting to see all of the show (But that is also because of BTVS having repeatedly being shown numerous times over the years on various channels). I'm looking forward to seeing series 3,4 and yes even 5 to see if my thoughts and feelings have changed since I last saw them.
 

HowiMetdaSlayer

Occasionally, I am callous and strange 🐶
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midwest
I'm in the camp that prefers Angel over BtVS. Like OP, I prefer the group dynamic on Angel more plus I find Angel as a protagonist more likable and endearing than Buffy. I also love every season of Angel (yes, even Season 4) and find positives in every seasons and storylines I love in every season, whereas with Buffy I really dislike the final two seasons and that hinders my overall enjoyment of the show. And lastly, I think Angel has better/stronger characterisation than Buffy and that characters on Angel have more room to grow and change and become better versions of themselves.
I feel pretty much the opposite of this. To me Angel the character was enigmatic. Hence the less we know about him the better. So basing an entire series around him was already a bad idea. Then throw in a bunch of Buffy cast offs. No thank you very much!
 
RachM
RachM
Ouch!
thrasherpix
thrasherpix
The big, bad Free Will Gang is coming for you...as soon as they get some gas.

Phrebie

Townie
Joined
Oct 19, 2020
Messages
6
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37
Meh, I got sick of hearing about it from an ex friend who wouldn't stop talking about it every day
I watched it once when it came out never again after, always a Buffy fan
 

Oromous

Socially Awkward
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Sineya
Meh. Up 'till season 2 so far, and I still prefer Buffy for now. Buffster S5 > Angel S2
 

BaskingINBangel

I'm a little bit bison
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You know, after my last re-watch, I'm starting to think that I do like Angel the Series more than Buffy at this point in my life. I kind of hate to admit that because I just have so much nostalgia for Buffy, having been a teen when it was first airing, and being absolutely crazy about the show at that time. I only watched some of Angel when it was airing and then later saw it in it's entirety as an adult.

I just think that I enjoy my favorite seasons of Angel way more than my favorite seasons of Buffy now, and for me, Angel ends on a high note since seasons 4 and 5 are my absolute favorites, whereas with Buffy, I could live without season 6 and I really don't care for season 7 very much at all, so the series kind of ends on a low note for me. I also prefer many of the major and minor characters on Angel more than I do on Buffy. And as a fan of Angel (the character) I really love and appreciate the character development that he gets on his own show. I also really like a lot of the big bads on Angel, like The Circle of the Black Thorn, Wolfram & Hart, and the Beast.
 

Btvs fan

Scooby
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Messages
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Buffy > Angel³
There's less cop outs on Angel (though there are some) than Buffy.
On Buffy she gets to do something and she's right because she is Buffy. Especially during S7 where the Writers give her not 1 but 3 Ex Machinas.
Also the comics did the huge cop out with the abortion storyline where its not really Buffy but a robot because Andrew roofied and kidnapped her. Now that was all Joss no one else so I say it counts.

With Angel things never got that bad. Angel was actually called out on things like Cordy mentioning how he mind raped his friends minds etc. Youd never get that on Buffy, she'd simply be right and that's it
 
Reason: Added spoiler tags
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Oromous

Socially Awkward
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Singapore
Sineya
While writing my review for X-Files: Fight the Future, I remember trying to reference how toxic the mystical pregnancy trope is among '90s television, and I almost named Buffy.

It's not Buffy. It's Angel. Specifically Cordelia and how she's often used in the first two seasons as a plot-device, literal or otherwise. Not to mention its many problematic sexual abuse tropes.

Buffy may have problematic men, but Angel embraced the sexual abuse tropes so much more ostentatiously due to its more "adult" nature, so this mature tone is very much a double-edged sword. Also might have to do with the fact that Angel, specifically Angel season 1, is largely about a white muscular man coming to save the day for many damsels. At least Buffy season 1's main flaw is that it was too campy. Both were created by a self-proclaimed feminist, but at least with Buffy, the feminist tones were more refreshing and less creepy. One became a feminist pop culture phenomenon that inspired an entire generation of women and feminist scholars (not to mention having an entire forum board named after it... wonder which one), while the other didn't, so 'nuff said.
 
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B
Btvs fan
Cough Buffy comic cough

Taake

Keeper of the Continuum Transfunctioner
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Black Thorn
(No spoilers plz)
Just as a reminder, as this thread goes on, please respect it when someone asks for no spoilers ^^

Personally I'm with @RachM on this. I prefer Ats over BtVS, and yes, that includes Angel s4 which happens to be one of my favorite seasons. I just think it does a lot of things better than BtVS does, especially as the show goes on and faces the type of problems all shows face (keeping things fresh, evolving group dynamics, going to daring places). I don't think everything is golden, but I appreciate what they were trying to do and think they did it well. As for the group dynamics I enjoy the AI team more because it is a group of adults who come together and become friends, or friendly, and it is a different kind of challenge than the Scoobies face which I think makes it more interesting, even if the Scoobies are more endearing.
 
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