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Question Joyce Summers

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Mar 5, 2017
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23
I have sometimes wondered why they killed Joyce off so soon. Why not have her stay alive long enough to sacrifice herself to close the portal? Could she not close it? What do you guys think?

She could have given Buffy and Dawn a big loving heart warming speech. Instead, she just dies on the couch. Wow. Of course her death isn't the only one in the series to seem stupid.

Anya.
Tara.
 

Fuffy Baith

2017 (and 2016) Cutest BB member
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Sineya
Well for two reasons. First, Kristen Sutherland wanted to move to Italy I think, so that's why she's not really in season 4,and Joss told her to come back for season 5 so he could kill off Joyce.

The real reason is that Joss wanted Buffy to grow up more and be an adult that has to take care of herself and Dawn. It's a big part of Buffy's arc in season 6.
 

Zenseem

Evil, skanky and kinda gay
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Black Thorn
hahahaha no, it really didn't. It was the prelude to mopey emo Buffy. Watching Weight of the World was bad enough.
i didn't say it was for the best

i really can't stand post season 6, but Joyce's death imade her realize she had double responsability with Dawn and her adult life, or at least it should
 

thrasherpix

Scooby
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Joyce wasn't meant to be a storybook death, but one that was closer to real life experience (though Joyce had a much easier death than most of us will, Joss was downright merciful to the character), and by that I mean real life experiences for those left behind (who find the body and react to the loss). It wasn't just a story, it was art that transcends the story itself (*), IMO.

And it was used to build the story as Buffy finds herself overwhelmed, shutting down so that she goes to commune with the First Slayer who tells her "Death is your gift." Buffy reacts poorly to that because she's still reeling from the death of her mother. And Joyce did give some surprisingly warm speeches before her death scene.

(* Offhand, I don't recall any other deaths in the entire Whedonverse in that was art of this nature. Some were good to move the story forward in a number of ways and/or up the stakes and introduce genuine tension while others were just clunky and bad writing, IMO. Joyce's death is the only one I consider art rather than mere storytelling. I will say I thought Tara's death was way too forced and clunky, and I though I'm a bit more conflicted on Anya, I can see why that one comes off as way too dismissive of her character, and even ignoring her genuine character up until that point anyway.)
 
Joined
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Yeah, once again it's all about Buffy. How do you think Dawn feels? I'm surprised she didn't try to kill herself again. She finds out she's the key. Her 'mom' dies and then her 'sister' dies.
 

thrasherpix

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It just seemed to me that you thought some crime against Dawn was committed, as opposed to a story where Dawn experiences death of a loved one as most of us do in life (I did at Dawn's age, though not of my mother, and it was traumatic to me). Yeah, I'm sure it was incredibly traumatic to Dawn, and good thing she had 2 witches (one an empath) to help care for her. Btw, The Death of Buffy (my version has all the comics in one book) is considered canon, and is the story that links season 5 to season 6, and explores how the death of Buffy (though not so much Joyce) affects them all, including Dawn.

'Course people die all the time in Sunnydale (with a death rate--which wouldn't include missing persons--that makes Washington DC look like Mayberry, and even the high school paper has obituaries)...but it's usually treated as no big deal. It makes me wonder why people aren't more used to it all (though it would still be a shock when it hits close to home, but not as big of a shock as it would be to the rest of us).
 
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