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Spike or Angel.

thetopher

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Sineya
if you found it unpleasant enough to adress then you should’ve reported it rather than policed another member yourself.
I wasn't aware staff members could police the specific comments section of any post, only the posts themselves. In any case I apologise for my response but the said comment seemed mean spirited and uncalled for. I'll leave it at that.
 
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Angel. Always Angel.
(I'm mainly talking about BTVS and ATS Angel as I've not read the comics)

I find him such a compelling and complexing character. Yes he broody. A lot. But there is more to him than that.

Angelus makes it more complicated HOWEVER he has never been a reason for me to love Angel. If he had never appeared again after being in the 2nd series, I would not miss him. He served his purpose for that season's arc.

I love Angel for his deep and enduring love for Buffy but I discovered upon watching ATS, I grew to love him even more without her being there with him.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a BAngel fan through and through and in my heart they are endgame but I come to realisation that I want this for them but I don't need it for them. (although I absolutely need for Buffy to NOT end up forever with Spike!)

Angel grew as a character on his own show. Buffy did inspire him but his journey became about what his life meant for him. His drive to help even coming to the point where it's not the total focus of his ultimate dream but more so for the greater good.

Angel makes mistakes and does at times give into the darkness in himself but he has proven that he is strong character that can find himself. A few times with others helping him along the way but also doing so just with himself having to deal with his emotions in the situation.

Angel's love for Buffy was inspiration in giving meaning and purpose but it won't be all that his life is about. He will love her to the end of his days but he can live a life without her and it can be just as rewarding, just as fulfilling.

His love for his son and for Connor's peace of mind makes him do pretty much the same thing like he did with Buffy and give him up and carry the loss and heartbreak and knowledge of their history and how it virtually destroyed Connor. And yet he does so believing it's the right thing even if he loses out in the end.

Angel's burdens weigh heavily on him but he still continues the battle.
The only time he wanted to give up completely was because he was so scared about hurting the one person (at that time) that meant more to him than even himself.

I've not like some of the decisions that Angel has made but I have understood his reasons even when I'd completely disagree with how he handled the situation.

Angel needs to be with others just to feel like he's not alone in the world where no one cares for him but he strong enough that he can live his life on his own. After getting his soul back and giving up on being with his vampire family or anyone, he was still strong enough to live even if it was with no regards towards himself. Living on the streets and scourging for blood by killing rats, still tortured by the memories of all his deeds and destruction as a soulless vampire and yet never having got to the point were he gives up and just let the sunlight take him. He's of stronger mind then, even more than he comprehend.

I feel like he's on his own unique path where he doesn't have the luxury of seeing anyone do it before him to guide him in his decision making.


Which brings me to Spike.
I'm not (usually) a fan of wisecracking, arrogant and over confident bad boy characters like Spike, Damon, Pacey, etc, etc.
And for me he served his purpose in series two with Drusilla.

What I find about his story in BTVS is basically it's virtually Angel's story. It may have come about in different circumstances but it's still about a vampire falling in love with the slayer and how she loves him because he has a soul.

And my feeling was the the BAngel love story never overrides the other characters or their stories. Especially in the first series when I've read complaints about how the relationship of Angel and Buffy was played out. And yet particularly the last two series became a show literally about spuffy (IMO) to the point that it was it's main focus.

I find that they made Spike a character that couldn't cope on his own in the long term. I mean he got with Harmony and it never came across to me that he really like or respect her. But he rather be with her than be by himself. He's just a little too clingy and obsessive. His main purpose for his life is just about living for the person he is in love with. No thought or ambitious for himself in his own life but what his life means for and with his love one. If he can't have that love then there is nothing left for him so what can he do to get that love back. It comes over to me as unhealthy way to love.

However I'm not saying that Spike should have been killed off when he was suppose to. I'm now at a place where I'm indifferent to him continuing on in the show. Series 1-5 is the best of BVTS for me so I'll put up with him.

But I will forever rage about him coming over to ATS.
He wasn't needed.
 
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And yet particularly the last two series became a show literally about spuffy (IMO) to the point that it was it's main focus.
I agree. I'd say from Season 5 onwards, Spike ceased to be a character in his own right and was there purely to serve Spuffy since that became his sole storyline.

I find that they made Spike a character that couldn't cope on his own in the long term. I mean he got with Harmony and it never came across to me that he really like or respect her. But he rather be with her than be by himself. He's just a little too clingy and obsessive. His main purpose for his life is just about living for the person he is in love with. No thought or ambitious for himself in his own life but what his life means for and with his love one. If he can't have that love then there is nothing left for him so what can he do to get that love back. It comes over to me as unhealthy way to love.
Spike was doing okay in Season 4 post-chip. The problem started in Season 5 when Spuffy became his sole storyline.

His reaction to Drusilla breaking up with him in Lovers Walk is understandable. They'd been together for over a century and she broke up with him because of the truce with Buffy which he partially did to save Dru (which was actually necessary since Buffy had intended on killing her). Fool for Love then tried to retcon this break up to be all about Spuffy, continuing the way Spuffy tried to take over the series.

It's very telling when a ship has to try and destroy another (superior IMO) ship in order to fly rather than standing on its own two feet. The writers had Drusilla appear in Season 5 literally just so Spike could reject her for Spuffy because there was no chance of Spuffy ever being a thing whilst there was still the ghost of Sprusilla hanging around.

But I will forever rage about him coming over to ATS.
He wasn't needed.
Angel only got a Season 5 on the proviso that Spike was brought over to the show, hence why his return was so heavily publicised by the network despite the writers intending for it to be a surprise for the audience.
 
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