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The War On Drugs

Ethan Reigns

Scooby
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
5,970
Location
Canada
Sineya
Canada has just made cannibis legal for recreational use. The question is why.
We had a choice between the American and the Portuguese way of handling drugs.

Portugal legalized recreational drugs. Since they could come from anywhere and there was no legal risk, prices were depressed and there was no money in it. And since no one had to establish connections to organized crime to get what they wanted, organized crime withered on the vine.

The American way was to be stupid. They didn't learn from Prohibition. If you reduce the supply, the price goes up and you attract interest from criminals and have to contend with still more drugs on the market, not less. America also has commercial prisons that are not government-run and they all demand strict enforcement and long sentences to make them profitable. We in Canada do not have that. Every election, there is another crop of political hopefuls who think the war on drugs is a certain way to get more votes, so the US never opts for what is effective but we in Canada did.

As Einstein once said, the definition of insanity is to keep doing the same thing over and over again and expect a different result. And there is no imperative for the government to get rid of drugs; if someone wants to risk death from a heroin overdose, the government does not exist to force an intervention. And the moral question of what a country should do should also consider the effectiveness of the measures they are proposing. If they are ineffective as in the American example then there is no moral reason to continue. The reason this does continue is that politicians of certain stripes can count on support from a Puritannical part of the populace that is either too stupid to look at the results or too ready to say, "We have to do something!"

If you look at the combination of federal and state / provincial laws in the US and Canada, Canada is a much freer country.
 
thrasherpix
thrasherpix
I just remembered what I think was my first chat room talk online, back in 1999 or 2000, someone from Europe asked me where I was from, and when I mentioned the USA she said she had heard of "the land of the pee." (Drug war reference.) I laughed.
Bluebird
Bluebird
Canada lives by the phrase 'land of the free' far more than the US.
The Bronze
The Bronze
Spot on. We have the same problem in the UK as the US. Political ideology over scientific evidence and reason.

Ayko

Buffyverse Ambassador
Joined
Feb 2, 2017
Messages
334
Location
Canada now located in Germany
Canada has just made cannibis legal for recreational use. The question is why.
@Bluebird: Quote "Same reason tobacco is legal."

Most tobacco products include a warning label that (smoking) tobacco is lethal and hazardous to your health.
I have no idea why tobacco exists (legally or illegally) with no health or recreational benefits (or any other) that I know of.
What are the reasons tobacco is legal (that also explains legal cannabis in Canada), Bluebird?
 

Bluebird

two by two, hands of blue
Joined
May 17, 2008
Messages
6,049
Black Thorn
@Bluebird: Quote "Same reason tobacco is legal."

Most tobacco products include a warning label that (smoking) tobacco is lethal and hazardous to your health.
I have no idea why tobacco exists (legally or illegally) with no health or recreational benefits (or any other) that I know of.
What are the reasons tobacco is legal (that also explains legal cannabis in Canada), Bluebird?
I'm not comparing them by health benefits, because they're obviously not the same. There is no reason that tobacco should be legal, as I see no benefits, though I believe people should have freedom to their own body. Tobacco, in my country, has a high tax on it, as would legalised cannabis, if that ever happens. There are states in the US who have already benefited from the increased tax revenue.
 

Octavia

My arse is not pansy!
Joined
Jan 20, 2008
Messages
6,519
Location
Australia
Sineya
Has anyone here seen "Take your pills" on netflix? I am watching it now. Its making me feel sick. The college kids are appalling. Have we already discussed rash of ADD/ADHD diagnosis in the 90's? I have spoken about my theory of meth problems being related to the drugging of unlikable children in the 90's. I am pretty sure my state had some of the highest rates of medicating of kids in the country. I know I have said it before but I cant remember if it was here (maybe cos I dont take the dexamphetamine anymore... I still have half a bottle)

I am starting to question if stigma around mental health is a good thing - to stop so many people drug seeking to keep the only the best parts of life going. Some of us are better off dead, instead of taking their toxic pills. I guess not many here feel like me yet cos they are still on the extreme drug wagon in my city circles. I have not been able to find many others with medication related dystonia. I wanted to stay off the canna oil but the dystonia seems to be permanent and maybe I need to get back on it for the spasms, cos like hell I am listening to a doctor again.

This world is mental, not me! Its so distressing. I can see why so many people choose to live in the bush. I shouldn't have put this show on cos now I've upset myself.
 
Bluebird
Bluebird
The world is definitely mental... can I come live in the bush too?

Octavia

My arse is not pansy!
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6,519
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Australia
Sineya
Oh now they are talking Meditation. What a GREAT idea. Thankyou tv for giving me the cure to media induced stress :D
 

Octavia

My arse is not pansy!
Joined
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Messages
6,519
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Australia
Sineya
Every box I unpack has yet more medical paperwork in it. Today I found more hospital discharge papers. I hadnt even signed them. The drug list was mental. 3 different pain meds, 2 different benzos, 2 for stomach problems/chronic vomiting, high dose SSRI. Diagnosis "Chronic PTSD". I've curled up in bed now. I didnt have ptsd before "seeking help". I had real physical pain from a rotational horse fall.

I was coping ok the last couple weeks drug-free in the garden but then to see that paperwork, the druglist :eek: Ugh i have to hide in a dark room. It makes me a criminal to say I'd prefer one rice sized drop of the oil of a plant than to use those neurotoxic drugs. I am nothing but a dirty no good drug addict for begging the goverment to allow plants for personal use. Obesity is a disease in this county (not a lifestyle choice) and using cannabis for (medically diagnosed) ptsd and chronic pain is a crime. Obviously I have no oil or I wouldnt be whinging on a tiny electronic device under the covers on a matress on the floor.


I was googling how to cope and the pages all said "seek treatement". Treatment is what did this to me. The pages say "reach out" but every single person recommends doctors and drugs and "get help". The pages say "dont isolate" but I cannot seem to communicate in a way people understand me.

I was so productive for a couple weeks, but that silly bundle of papers just wiped me out. Here I am again, back in my safe place, cos I duno where else to go, and too nausous to sit up and distract myself.

I still have so much to do
 
Ayko
Ayko
Paperwork brings the best of us down..take it slow & feel better after its done :)

Octavia

My arse is not pansy!
Joined
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6,519
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Australia
Sineya
I havent stopped reading and learning what I can to make sense of what happened and find words to assist others in similar situations confused by it all. I have been reading the parts of Szasz writings I have found online in the abscence of having his actual books. This is from his wiki page which isnt what i read originally when I found him, but says the same thing.

In Ceremonial Chemistry (1973), he argued that the same persecution that targeted witches, Jews, gypsies, and homosexuals now targets "drug addicts" and "insane" people. Szasz argued that all these categories of people were taken as scapegoats of the community in ritual ceremonies. To underscore this continuation of religion through medicine, he even takes as example obesity: instead of concentrating on junk food (ill-nutrition), physicians denounced hypernutrition. According to Szasz, despite their scientific appearance, the diets imposed were a moral substitute to the former fasts, and the social injunction not to be overweight is to be considered as a moral order, not as a scientific advice as it claims to be. As with those thought bad (insane people), and those who took the wrong drugs (drug addicts), medicine created a category for those who had the wrong weight (obesity).
It is impossible for me to express the relief in finding writings that have the words that explain what I can see but cant explain...
 

Octavia

My arse is not pansy!
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6,519
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Sineya
Truths are surfacing here. I wonder if they will in other countries too. Or are we really just that much worse than the rest of the world?

Shame is, those most injured by treatment live in absolute fear of the next locked ward and treatement orders. We can't present to doctors without med history, we cant gain access to disability services without doctors...

Im layed up with a bad ankle but the fear of seeking treatment means that I wont. I know what happens when you have a flashback in a doctors office.


Mental health patients fear being raped and assaulted while receiving care, have been forced to urinate in ward gardens, and are spending days chemically sedated or shackled in emergency departments while waiting for a bed.
https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/health/wa-mental-health-advocacy-service-report-details-horror-stories-ng-b881071488z
 

ILLYRIAN

Druish Pervonian Wizard
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Black Thorn
Don't get me started about locked wards after having a brain tumour removed the Royal Perth Hospital that did the operation let me wander about in the hospital, once I had learnt how to walk, talk and eat again. When I was moved to another hospital I was placed in a locked ward. I can believe what those mental patients endured as I had them make up lies about me. Then I had to face the so called experts in the field of Neurosurgery, experts who didn't know how to recognize logical comments.
I blame the stupidity of the nurses and specialists on the government cutbacks that have been made the only nurses kept seemed to be those that didn't have higher wages, those nurses that had proved themselves worthy.
 
Octavia
Octavia
Yep, you are right about the neuros and nurses. There is a major language barrier with the cheap imported staff, only leads to further miscommunication and patient suffering. Glad you survived with your sense of humour.

Ayko

Buffyverse Ambassador
Joined
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Canada now located in Germany
I have noticed with meditation and self-healing methods that drug resin in the arteries clings to places where my Tattoos are... Now I know the reason many women (and girls) have foot Tattoos. For me that is a cheat and it disturbs the Aura which cannot be good, I am sure.
 

Octavia

My arse is not pansy!
Joined
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Messages
6,519
Location
Australia
Sineya
I have noticed with meditation and self-healing methods that drug resin in the arteries clings to places where my Tattoos are... Now I know the reason many women (and girls) have foot Tattoos. For me that is a cheat and it disturbs the Aura which cannot be good, I am sure.
Tattoos were on my mind today too - interesting!

My groceries were loaded by a woman who had used tattoos to cover self harm scars on her arm. I wondered if that worked for her. She obviously gained employment by hiding it. I don't have any tattoos but pondered on the drive home, would it be less offensive to people if I did have tattoos to cover my scars? I don't think I ever will, I prefer the constantly changing colour of my own skin over artificial colouring. I am lucky now to live somewhere cooler where long sleaves and pants are not as strange to wear in summer. Although I got a comment today from some teenage girls about being hot when I was in a long sleaves, it was under 20C, totally jumper weather :p

My sacral is blocked, I did ok clearing it over the last full moon but its no good again today.
 

ILLYRIAN

Druish Pervonian Wizard
Joined
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Toodyay
Black Thorn
Ayko.
Which type of meditation and what self healing methods have any form of resin?
 
Ayko
Ayko
You misunderstood my compact message...get back to you when I have more time :)

Octavia

My arse is not pansy!
Joined
Jan 20, 2008
Messages
6,519
Location
Australia
Sineya
She found out two things after Keegan’s his death on October 23, 2015, that she wishes she had known beforehand.

The first was that during a visit to the doctor two days earlier for antibiotics to treat tonsillitis, Mr McAlpine underwent a mental health assessment and was prescribed antidepressants.

Media has noticed. Next they need a hashtag and the tide will have turned :)

Sad that the doctors target teenagers, we didn't know any better. This will be seen as abusive practice in the future.

So pleased to be med free. No longer numbed to the world, nor blinded and guided by the money hungry medical industry. It is so nice to be free in thought and movement! Life unlocked :D
 

thrasherpix

Scooby
Joined
Mar 13, 2016
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36
Next they need a hashtag and the tide will have turned :)
It has happened before (like the "recovered memories" method of the 80s), though they didn't have hashtags back then. And while looking for a Dilbert comic for the LAWL thread, I found a bunch like this one that I thought you'd like:

 
Octavia
Octavia
Man history does repeat!
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