When did Tara become gay?

[ILLYRIAN]

I did not realise she was before she got with Willow. Anyone know any different?

 

[famicommander]

You don't become gay. You either are or you aren't. It takes some people longer to realize it than others but it's not like you just flip a switch. We don't know when Tara realized she was a lesbian. All we know, from their argument in the episode Tough Love, is that Willow was insecure about Tara having been out as a lesbian longer than she had. And we know Tara was a lesbian and not bisexual because she made it clear multiple times she wasn't into guys.

 

[TheXandyman]

I once asked my (gay) sister the same question, and she gave a similar response. Her exact words were 'It's not like I woke up one morning and said 'Hey, I like girls now!'.

 

[Ethan Reigns]

A number of famously gay people have resisted the idea that they are gay to the point where they enter into traditional marriages, only to have them fall apart a few years later. Elton John and Sally Ride are two examples of this. But resisting the idea that you are gay doesn't change anything - if you are gay, you were gay from birth.

 

[AlphaFoxtrot]

Okay, that's great. I see two questions here, was Tara as introduced in Hush originally written as a lesbian, and second, was Tara involved in a homosexual relationship prior her involvement with Willow? The third question, what was Tara's Kinsley number, unanswerable.

Regarding the first, unknown. I recall some interviews where it seems like that's where they were going from the time they cast Amber, and some where the chemistry between the two actresses caught everyone off guard, and they just went with it, and this killed a "Gay Xander" story line. I don't buy the Gay Xander story line, why would you bring back Anya, if that was the case? It also doesn't help that so much of Wil and Tara were off screen, with scenes that were heavily layered in symbolism. So, I don't have an answer, but I would say no, and they hedged their bets with the character, just in case it didn't work out.

As for the second part, her and Beth were cousins, and girls too. That's a Sailor Moon joke. We know next to nothing about Tara, and what we do know is inconsistent. I'm inclined to say, no, having Tara not come out until college was "best practice" in the 90s, but, I'm still not entirely certain that Tara graduated highschool in '99. So, I assuming Tara graduated high school in May of '99, entered UC Sunnydale in fall of 99, and was not openly gay until she hooked up with Willow at some point after hush. But, that's a 30% confidence.

 

[thetopher]

I think a better interpretation of the question is 'how long has Tara been out?' and to that the only answer given in the show is 'longer than Willow' as is stated in 'Tough Love'.

But S5 seems to imply that Tara has plenty of/a few gay friends at college- see Buffy and Xander's hesitancy regarding Tara's upcoming Birthday and her 'swinging wicca lifestyle' which isn't anything to do with witches.

I would be surprised if Willow were Tara's first actual girlfriend, since she is more forthright in her feelings than Willow is, despite being also quite shy. I think the 'I am, you know', 'What?' 'Yours' is too strong and obvious a declaration of feeling to be a first time.

...But given Tara's family background its fairer to say this is Tara's first proper, open relationship away from out-and-out bigotry. We can infer that previously she would've had to be incredibly circumspect about her sexuality back home, given who she was surrounded by.

 

[famicommander]

So, I assuming Tara graduated high school in May of '99, entered UC Sunnydale in fall of 99, and was not openly gay until she hooked up with Willow at some point after hush. But, that's a 30% confidence.

I think it's very clear from this argument that Tara had, indeed, been out and possibly in more than one relationship prior to Willow

WILLOW: No, I was snippy gal. It's just ... I know I can't ... on some level ... (sighs) it's like my opinion isn't worth anything because I haven't been through ... (sighs) I didn't lose my mom, so I don't know.

TARA: Well ... I-I'm not the expert. I mean, I've only lost the one.

Willow gives a sympathetic smile. Tara looks anxious.

TARA: (uncertainly) Do ... I act like ... the big knowledge woman?

Wide shot of the two of them sitting on the bed, facing each other, with at least a foot separating them.

WILLOW: (weakly) No.

TARA: Is that no spelled Y-E-S?

WILLOW: S-O-R-T of. (Tara frowns) I mean, I just feel like the-the junior partner. You've been doing everything longer than me. You've been out longer ... you've been practicing witchcraft way longer.

TARA: Oh, but you're way beyond me there! In just a few- I mean ... it frightens me how powerful you're getting.

WILLOW: (frowns) That's a weird word.

TARA: (nervous smile) "Getting"?

WILLOW: It frightens you? *I* frighten you?

TARA: (jumps up from the bed) That is *so* not what I meant. I meant i-impresses - impressive.

WILLOW: Well, I took Psych 101. I mean, I took it from an evil government scientist who was skewered by her Frankenstein-like creation before the final, but I know what a Freudian slip is.

Tara looks upset.

WILLOW: D-don't you trust me?

TARA: With my life.

WILLOW: That's not what I mean.

TARA: Can't we just go to the fair?

WILLOW: I don't feel real multicultural right now. (stands up) Wh ... what is it about me that you don't trust?

TARA: It's not that. I worry, sometimes. You're, you're changing so much, so fast. I don't know where you're heading.

WILLOW: Where I'm heading?

TARA: I'm saying everything wrong.

WILLOW: No, I think you're being pretty clear. This isn't about the witchcraft. It's about the other changes in my life.

TARA: I trust you. I just ... (looks down) I don't know where I'm gonna fit in ... in your life when...

WILLOW: When ... I change back? Yeah, this is a college thing, just a, a little experimentation before I get over the thrill and head back to boys' town.

Pause.

WILLOW: You think that?

TARA: Should I?

WILLOW: I'm really sorry that I didn't establish my lesbo street cred before I got into this relationship. You're the only woman I've ever fallen in love with, so ... how on earth could you ever take me seriously?

She walks toward the door.

TARA: Willow, please!

WILLOW: Have fun at the fair.

Willow storms out. Tara stands there looking upset.

 

[fauxindigo]

I think it's very clear from this argument that Tara had, indeed, been out and possibly in more than one relationship prior to Willow

WILLOW: No, I was snippy gal. It's just ... I know I can't ... on some level ... (sighs) it's like my opinion isn't worth anything because I haven't been through ... (sighs) I didn't lose my mom, so I don't know.

TARA: Well ... I-I'm not the expert. I mean, I've only lost the one.

Willow gives a sympathetic smile. Tara looks anxious.

TARA: (uncertainly) Do ... I act like ... the big knowledge woman?

Wide shot of the two of them sitting on the bed, facing each other, with at least a foot separating them.

WILLOW: (weakly) No.

TARA: Is that no spelled Y-E-S?

WILLOW: S-O-R-T of. (Tara frowns) I mean, I just feel like the-the junior partner. You've been doing everything longer than me. You've been out longer ... you've been practicing witchcraft way longer.

TARA: Oh, but you're way beyond me there! In just a few- I mean ... it frightens me how powerful you're getting.

WILLOW: (frowns) That's a weird word.

TARA: (nervous smile) "Getting"?

WILLOW: It frightens you? *I* frighten you?

TARA: (jumps up from the bed) That is *so* not what I meant. I meant i-impresses - impressive.

WILLOW: Well, I took Psych 101. I mean, I took it from an evil government scientist who was skewered by her Frankenstein-like creation before the final, but I know what a Freudian slip is.

Tara looks upset.

WILLOW: D-don't you trust me?

TARA: With my life.

WILLOW: That's not what I mean.

TARA: Can't we just go to the fair?

WILLOW: I don't feel real multicultural right now. (stands up) Wh ... what is it about me that you don't trust?

TARA: It's not that. I worry, sometimes. You're, you're changing so much, so fast. I don't know where you're heading.

WILLOW: Where I'm heading?

TARA: I'm saying everything wrong.

WILLOW: No, I think you're being pretty clear. This isn't about the witchcraft. It's about the other changes in my life.

TARA: I trust you. I just ... (looks down) I don't know where I'm gonna fit in ... in your life when...

WILLOW: When ... I change back? Yeah, this is a college thing, just a, a little experimentation before I get over the thrill and head back to boys' town.

Pause.

WILLOW: You think that?

TARA: Should I?

WILLOW: I'm really sorry that I didn't establish my lesbo street cred before I got into this relationship. You're the only woman I've ever fallen in love with, so ... how on earth could you ever take me seriously?

She walks toward the door.

TARA: Willow, please!

WILLOW: Have fun at the fair.

Willow storms out. Tara stands there looking upset.

I did not realise she was before she got with Willow. Anyone know any different?

Yes, I love the juicy pulp of this scene in Tough Love (even though it's sad) and it feels to me like Tara is 100% gay and worried that Willow may not be (maybe bisexual); then get tired of her eventually and want to be with a man again... can't blame Tara for feeling like that after Willow being with Oz. So Tara was probably always identifying as gay (a witch)... Willow just brought it out of her the same way that Tara brought it out of Willow.

 

[AlphaFoxtrot]

Re: Tara's Chastity; Good sourcing and analysis. I was only thinking of Hush Tara. I wonder if there's a way to reconcile "Hush's" Non-verbal Tara with "Tough Love's" Tara with a past?

Re: Gay Scoobies: That's the thing, Anya was with the show before Oz left the series.

 

[famicommander]

Re: Tara's Chastity; Good sourcing and analysis. I was only thinking of Hush Tara. I wonder if there's a way to reconcile "Hush's" Non-verbal Tara with "Tough Love's" Tara with a past?

Re: Gay Scoobies: That's the thing, Anya was with the show before Oz left the series.

I think Tara was simply intimidated by the unfamiliar college setting and group of strangers. She would probably have been more confident in a one on one situation with a girl from her hometown.

 

[NotASlayer]

Tara made a comment in season six's Halloween episode about "never having had much interest in timber." That's probably misquoted a bit, and it was regards to Anya mentioning a game of 'shiver me timbers' she and Xander were going to play, but I think there's some fairly obvious subtext that Tara had known for a long time she had little/no interest in men.

 

[AlphaFoxtrot]

I agree, there's no evidence that Tara has ever enjoyed physical or emotional intimacy with a man.

Although, I would contend that although we find Anya's openly licentious ways to be totally amusing, in universe that could get really old, really quick, even for college age kids.

 

[famicommander]

Tara made a comment in season six's Halloween episode about "never having had much interest in timber." That's probably misquoted a bit, and it was regards to Anya mentioning a game of 'shiver me timbers' she and Xander were going to play, but I think there's some fairly obvious subtext that Tara had known for a long time she had little/no interest in men.

She also jokes that "she's changed" in the musical episode when the boys notice her and she pretends to chase after them. This implies that she never had any interest in chasing after boys before. It's beyond clear that Tara was never into men.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

She also jokes that "she's changed" in the musical episode when the boys notice her and she pretends to chase after them. This implies that she never had any interest in chasing after boys before. It's beyond clear that Tara was never into men.

"The boys really thought I was hot? Oh, my god, I'm cured" I always took it to mean that due to her family issues and self-esteem problems she just figured there was something wrong with herself when boys were not attracted to her. I never took it as she didn't have any interest in chasing boys as much as it was fruitless as they found her (maybe because of her family curse) unattractive. The term cured was in relation to her attractiveness from/by boys.

 

[famicommander]

"The boys really thought I was hot? Oh, my god, I'm cured" I always took it to mean that due to her family issues and self-esteem problems she just figured there was something wrong with herself when boys were not attracted to her. I never took it as she didn't have any interest in chasing boys as much as it was fruitless as they found her (maybe because of her family curse) unattractive. The term cured was in relation to her attractiveness from/by boys.

That wasn't my read at all. My read was that she was joking that she was only a lesbian because the boys had never noticed her before, and now that they had, she was cured.

 

[TriBel]

That wasn't my read at all. My read was that she was joking that she was only a lesbian because the boys had never noticed her before, and now that they had, she was cured.

Yeah - I thought "cured" was a sarcastic reference to something akin to Conversion Therapy.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

Yeah - I thought "cured" was a sarcastic reference to something akin to Conversion Therapy.

If it hadn't just transpired after Willow said they thought she was hot I might agree with you. They were talking about how boring Tara was and she didn't want to get out she wanted to go home and read books.

 

[famicommander]

Yeah - I thought "cured" was a sarcastic reference to something akin to Conversion Therapy.

That's definitely what it was.

 

[TriBel]

If it hadn't just transpired after Willow said they thought she was hot I might agree with you. They were talking about how boring Tara was and she didn't want to get out she wanted to go home and read books.

I think she was surprised and (probably) flattered (in an "ugly duckling becomes a swan" kinda way) but I never read it as a comment on how she feels about her sexuality. I always thought it was the one thing she felt secure about.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

I never read it as a comment on how she feels about her sexuality.

Nor did I. Which is why I never saw it as commentary on conversion therapy.

an "ugly duckling becomes a swan"

Exactly. Boys finally thought she was hot. She was cured of being an ugly duckling.