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Who blames Jenny as well?

AngelsCordy

Townie
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Jul 20, 2019
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This question came to mind a long time ago, who blames Jenny partly for that, that Angelus ever came to light. I mean, if she would have said something sooner, maybe it could have preventing it from happening. What do you think?
 

thrasherpix

Scooby
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Jenny only knew Angel was under a curse, not the conditions of that curse.

I like a fan theory of one of the other members here (GraceK?) in that her uncle knew the conditions and that ultimately Angel was meant to lose his soul (not necessarily with Buffy) and then kill the one he most loved, just as Angelus killed one of their beloved tribe members. At the time the gypsies probably meant to put his soul back after that happened for more memories in a never ending cycle so that his pain is eternal as theirs is, but they lost the spell (probably when Darla and the other vampires massacred them).
 

DeadlyDuo

Scooby
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Messages
9,611
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31
Jenny only knew Angel was under a curse, not the conditions of that curse.

I like a fan theory of one of the other members here (GraceK?) in that her uncle knew the conditions and that ultimately Angel was meant to lose his soul (not necessarily with Buffy) and then kill the one he most loved, just as Angelus killed one of their beloved tribe members. At the time the gypsies probably meant to put his soul back after that happened for more memories in a never ending cycle so that his pain is eternal as theirs is, but they lost the spell (probably when Darla and the other vampires massacred them).

Maybe that's why Jenny was sent to keep an eye on him, to report back once he lost his soul so the gypsies could re-curse him again?

I think Bangel sleeping together was inevitable. Their feelings for each other were so strong that, at best, Jenny might have been able to delay but not prevent.
 

WillowFromBuffy

To be or not to evil.
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I blame Jenny. Xander blames Angel for killing Jenny. Giles blames Angel for torturing him, though not for killing Jenny. After her death, everyone just forgets that Jenny was the only one who could have prevented Angel from turning, either through honesty or by simply doing the job she was sent to do.
 

thrasherpix

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I guess its time for a rewatch, because I don't remember Jenny knowing about the curse (at least any details of it). I just know she was meant to watch Angel and see to it that he suffers. How they hell she could've prevented anything with that is beyond me. I'm sure you can make a fanfic out of it, but not her sharing what she knows and Buffy and Angel therefore knowing they can't have sex (*).

Or maybe my copy is different from your copies.


(* Btw, one of the trivial annoyances I've had on the show is how much comfort and contentment characters can have over sex even when they think the world is going to end and everyone they love is going to die. Not just Buffy & Angel, but Willow & Oz, among others. I'm not even counting season 7. I'd say the power of Joss's and Marti's genitals are such that it makes perfect sense to them, and maybe most of y'all, but not to me.)
 
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sk

The Overlooked One
Joined
Jul 5, 2008
Messages
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Sweden
Sineya
I guess its time for a rewatch, because I don't remember Jenny knowing about the curse (at least any details of it). I just know she was meant to watch Angel and see to it that he suffers. How they hell she could've prevented anything with that is beyond me. I'm sure you can make a fanfic out of it, but not her sharing what she knows and Buffy and Angel therefore knowing they can't have sex (*).

Yeah, this has always been my impression too.
That Jenny had no clue what could happen.

If anything I have felt that it was unfair to blame her.

/SK
 

WillowFromBuffy

To be or not to evil.
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How they hell she could've prevented anything with that is beyond me.
There are two things she could have done. 1) She could have told the Scoobies that the people who cursed Angel had tasked her to keep Angel and Buffy apart. 2) She could have taken the time to ask her uncle about the purpose of her mission before it was to late. He tells her the full story when she finally asks.

That's the reason Buffy and Giles have a hard time forgiving Jenny.
 
D
Dora
A simple why am I watching them ?

nightshade

Your grandfather is a cat
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Black Thorn
I do and I don't, I do think that once she became part of the Scoobies and Giles told her about being a Watcher and everything, she should have told him about her family. However I do understand that beyond being told that she had to watch him, she didn't know about what the curse was.
 

Ethan Reigns

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7,512
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Canada
Sineya
Jenny was given an order by her family to monitor Angel and make sure he did not achieve that one moment of happiness. If she didn't understand why, she should have asked. This is not Caesar's legions or the Roman Catholic Church where obedience to the hierarchy supersedes all other considerations whether winning a war or connecting with God - people have a duty to explain the orders they give you and you have the duty to insist on an explanation until you understand it. (I would never make a good military man - I always question orders.) She could have talked to Buffy and warned her of the curse. There was no benefit to secrecy.
 

brinkster130

Riley's BFF
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Sineya
It's always frustrating to see a character keep info to themselves that could potentially save someone/something. While she likely didn't have all the info needed to stop the curse from being broken, her being honest with Giles could have changed things, or at least prepared/warned the team about what was coming.
 
S
SpikeOrAngel

thrasherpix

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There are two things she could have done. 1) She could have told the Scoobies that the people who cursed Angel had tasked her to keep Angel and Buffy apart. 2) She could have taken the time to ask her uncle about the purpose of her mission before it was to late. He tells her the full story when she finally asks.

That's the reason Buffy and Giles have a hard time forgiving Jenny.


I can at least follow that reasoning, so now I can talk about. :)


I personally don't blame her because other than making sure Angel suffers she didn't know what she was to do, and didn't have much time to think about it once she gets the order to keep them apart, and even then that he'd lose his soul wasn't something she knew (or even thought to ask) until too late.

Her tribe and family isn't some military unit she joined, like the Initiative, it's her family who likely raised her to believe the world is the enemy and her tribe are the only ones she can count on in a world of madness (which the Jossverse is). Her defying them should be about as dramatic as when Tara defied her family.

I do understand divided loyalties, and even if she told them what little she did know I don't think it would've changed anything other than she'd be cut off so they'd have even less info to work with and they wouldn't hold such a grudge against her.



But thinking about it now, it could've added some spice after say Angel saves Jenny from that demon Giles called up in his youth that once she shook it off if she did volunteer something, perhaps her challenging her uncle first. This could be a dramatic tease, or it could fleshed out on how the Elder Woman (or whatever) saw the signs said a demon had taken her, and her heartbroken uncle came to bury her or put her to rest, only to be heartbroken for a different reason as he finds she has been keeping secrets (both have their pros and cons writing style, maybe they could split it into 2-3 scenes or more). She could be ordered back so someone whose feelings and loyalties less divided (a good time to introduce how Jenny was raised with the idea that she can only trust them, the tribe, the world and all the horrors in it prey on all of them, and by herself she has no one watching her back, which in turn can drive her more to Giles, not only out of attraction, but also fear, and maybe Giles has a chance encounter with Jenny's uncle to ratchet up the tension).

And then the final scene with Jenny and her uncle...he says he must prove that she remembers who she is and separate Angel and Buffy. She could refuse this, even tell the others, but given what she knows it's still futile. They'd blame her less and Jenny's death would be all the more tragic for it.

Giles could even wonder if Jenny is right. He's researched everything there is about Angel's curse (could even interview Angel himself) and though they don't know why, maybe the curse is threatened and that would be tragic. Angel himself says those gypsies aren't the most honest people (oh that would go over well today... :D ) and lost many of their magicks so it could all be a bluff. Joss can add in all the tension as Angel himself talks about leaving (something he'll eventually do anyway for real), but ultimately Angel says his love is stronger than any curse (and gives Buffy his ring at this time instead of later, which gives its symbolic meaning all the more power when Angel returns in season 3), not knowing the nature of it, and so proves he can be as wrong as the Elder Woman.

You know, the more I think about it the more I wish they went down this path. There would've been a lot more substance to her character. Still, I don't blame her in the version we got.
 

GreyWalker1958

Potential
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Jan 25, 2020
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215
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32
Only her uncle is to blame. Though I kinda wish Jenny let Giles in on the curse detail sooner to where he'd at least would've helped derail the the bday sex.

Though in a sense, had that succeeded, I'd easily see Angelus popping up as end of season/next season tease
 

FaithLehane16

"Tact is not saying true stuff. I'll pass."
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Put yourself in Jenny's shoes, if you heard some story about some creature attacking your family members and the creature was still alive, wouldn't you be keeping it a secret amongst the family despite of your beau and friends, or would you go behind your family's back?
 

AlphaFoxtrot

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Giles has his own secrets, and he probably doesn't entirely trust Angel. We know the council doesn't. Xander never liked or trusted Angel, and clearly has a thing for brunettes in their late twenties. Willow likes Angel, but retroactively has a thing for brunettes in their late twenties. Oz is only marginally aware of who Jenny and Angel are, like if you ask him he'd probably try to figure out if Jenny falls within Giles's
Locker-Lampson number. Cordelia does know, but depending on how she's characterized that week, may or may not care. Ilona Costa Bianchi would have told you that "Gypsies are miserable piles of secrets, let us never speak of them again." She then spit. Amy didn't know, despite eating lunch with the Scoobies, and was cross with Willow for holding out on the Techno-Pagan computer teacher.
 
FaithLehane16
FaithLehane16
What do you mean that Xander/Willow have a thing for brunettes in their late 20s?

AlphaFoxtrot

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Sep 11, 2017
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@ FaithLehane16 ; Xander's crush on Miss French, and Anya and Cordelia, I suppose, if you want to go by actress age. If I recall, Willow was retconed into having a crush on Jenny via ascended fanon. It's clever, but I don't believe that the character was originally written or played that way.
 
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