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Why the hell don't Willow and Tara get jobs?

famicommander

Townie
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Dec 26, 2016
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66
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28
I've been watching Buffy and Angel again recently, and this has always bugged me about Buffy season 6.

Buffy comes back from the dead and Willow and Tara are like, "We've been living in your house and we spent all your money while you were dead. So now that you're back, you have to get a job or we'll all be homeless."

I mean, what would Willow, Tara, and Dawn have done if Buffy hadn't been brought back? Used up all the rest of Buffy's money and then moved onto Xander's couch?
 

DeadlyDuo

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Good question. Since they were still at college, my guess is they had student loans that they only had to pay back if their income was above a certain amount. Because they didn't want to repay, they didn't get jobs. It was incredibly selfish on their part but all of the scoobies were selfish at some point during Season 6.
 

ChaseRules

When it comes to dating I the Slayer.
Joined
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6,715
Sineya
Makes you wonder how much money they spent on bringing Buffy back . I sure thy weren't cheap. Also what happened to Joyce gallery .
I thinking that she owned it myself . Anyone one know either way :confused:
 

DeadlyDuo

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I thinking that she owned it myself . Anyone one know either way :confused:
Joyce would've definitely had a high position in the gallery since she brought stock home. I can't see just any employees being allowed to do that.
 
BeckyTVS
BeckyTVS
My mother had the same profession as Joyce they were both art directors and both had galleries if you remember back in season one we learn that Joyce found a spot for the gallery so Joyce would have been the owner or manager

thrasherpix

Scooby
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This is just one of many reasons why I consider season 6 unrealistic, however it may FEEL simply by bringing up certain subjects normally ignored (but I'd rather they continue be ignored than handled as terribly as they were--I didn't even think of it as realistic, just seeing it as new plot benders they were experimenting with, until I saw an interview where the writers said this was to be the "realistic" season, and I was like "show you grew up with a silver spoon in your mouth with little experience of what you're writing about").

They not only had college and home, but also to do this magical project, and also the Buffybot. Given how glibly Willow used magic, she should've done more, and if Tara put her foot down against it, then she should've been helping get a job, which is not selfish (if magic was only for spiritual purposes divorced of this world then she should've been at some Wicca convent anyway rather than casting spells in college, at least one of which was selfish and nearly got the others killed back in season 5).

I personally have made a lot of money entertaining at birthday parties (for those with dirty minds who assume me jumping out of a cake, it's not that at all), more than Buffy made at the fast food place (though income fluctuates a lot), and know Willow could've made HUGE bucks by incorporating magic into her shows. She could potentially become a celebrity, assuming other witches didn't step in to knock her down, or that she didn't push herself too hard (so that the balloon animals actually came to life and attacked the kids, for example).

Heck, I bet they could find or create a spell finding missing persons which could help others as well as pay the bills (though Wolfram & Hart would probably hate that spell and create trouble, and one would have to be careful not to appear involved in criminal activity to know such details, but surely the pair could work something out). Heck, even just finding a grandparent's long lost watch (or deed) could get them a lot.

Another way I make a lot of money is altering clothes (for those of a size considered too irregular for big business to focus on). Tara looks like she'd know how to do that. Magic could get even more done in that regards. (And as for Willow...I'm sure she wouldn't mind making a fortune "helping people" by giving them "dieting spells" though that sounds like an episode of "beware what you wish for" begging to be made.)

On a much more mundane level, I know a guy who'd shop Goodwill, repair the items, and sell them. For example, he got a musical keyboard that didn't work for a dollar, paid about $10 and an hour's work that repaired it, and then sold it for about $300! Don't tell me that Willow who could repair and service the Buffybot couldn't figure out something similar!

But the big one that was ignored...the big computer companies were salivating to get Willow on their payroll. (Remember "What's My Line?" where they hired special people to take her to a private room and have a butler serve them special food?) Granted, that would take time, but Willow isn't against using magical shortcuts and proved she can mix magic with computers. Heck, just patent a knockoff of the Buffybot!
 
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crazysoulless

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Messages
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Many try to use the "they had school" excuse except that doesn't take into account Buffy going on nightly patrols when she was in high school and then nightly patrols when she was at university and then she went on nightly patrols when she had full-time and part-time jobs. And she did that while leader of the group.
 

Octavia

My arse is not pansy!
Joined
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Messages
6,831
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Sineya
Many try to use the "they had school" excuse except that doesn't take into account Buffy going on nightly patrols when she was in high school and then nightly patrols when she was at university and then she went on nightly patrols when she had full-time and part-time jobs. And she did that while leader of the group.
This is the excuse Ive seen used most. And it makes the most sense. Not surprisingly, I've read this most from spoilt students who also didnt work while studying. I didnt know student loans could be used for anything besides school fees! Amazing. That'd be a heavenly uni life, not to have to work to pay for food, books, clothes.

Could that have factored into Buffys mood in s6? Her friends did jack all while she supported the lesbian group as well as her teenage sister?

Could they have been betting on that they'd pay for Buffys expenses once they were earning? Sorta doubt that.
 

ChaseRules

When it comes to dating I the Slayer.
Joined
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Messages
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Sineya
Joyce would've definitely had a high position in the gallery since she brought stock home. I can't see just any employees being allowed to do that.
So what happened to all that money. from the gallery :eek:
[automerge]1521946908[/automerge]
I also like a couple of @thrasherpix ideas . One was using their magic to fix things & then sell them . Also if Willow so good at magic as she was boasting of as well as being such a great hacker why didn't she use that talent to make some money . But I guess Willow was to lazy after Buffy died to do anything . And when they did find out they were broke why didn't they get jobs instead of making Buffy do it all . Do you think Buffy would have been nicer if they had helped her out a bit instead of dumping it all on her :rolleyes:
 
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crazysoulless

Scooby
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Oct 11, 2009
Messages
1,099
Location
Las Vegas, US
So what happened to all that money. from the gallery :eek:
[automerge]1521946908[/automerge]
I also like a couple of @thrasherpix ideas . One was using their magic to fix things & then sell them . Also if Willow so good at magic as she was boasting of as well as being such a great hacker why didn't she use that talent to make some money . But I guess Willow was to lazy after Buffy died to do anything . And when they did find out they were broke why didn't they get jobs instead of making Buffy do it all . Do you think Buffy would have been nicer if they had helped her out a bit instead of dumping it all on her :rolleyes:
I don't think Buffy stopped being nice but I know I'm mostly alone with that on here.

Willow was about gaining power to prove she was the most powerful. It's similar to Cordelia saying "It's not that it's expensive, it's that it costs more." In Triangle, Willow was caught stealing Magic Box ingredients and claimed she was doing a spell that if successful could help Buffy on patrols. But she never showed it to her because it was really about proving she could do the spell--conjuring sunlight--and then moving on to the next big magical test of her prowess. It's the same reason Willow didn't go patrolling when Buffy was in town to do it.
 

ChaseRules

When it comes to dating I the Slayer.
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Sineya
I have to agree . Willow was so proud she could do magic she couldn't stop & she didn't care if it hurt other people .
The reason I say that is that when Willow & Tara had a fight Willow used magic on Tara just because she could do so .
 

GraceK

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This has always made me see red. First they bring Buffy back without any significant research into where she was, still in her coffin, no less, and expect to her buck up, smile and get over it. Then oh, by the way, sorry about your supposed hell experience, but while you were dead we spent all your money to live here free and be full time students, and now that your back can you continue to support us? Sorry Buffy, you can’t go back to college or have any kind of actual life cause your main priority besides saving the world is getting a job so we can continue to go to school and live here and Dawn can whine and bitch about being ignored. Isn’t life wonderful? Why aren’t you thrilled to be out of paradise and alive again?? Geez be grateful!

It’s rage inducing
 
DeepBlueJoy
DeepBlueJoy
Yup. Why would I be grateful to wake up in my coffin, fresh from heavenly rest, broke and once again carrying the world on my back? Yeah, no.

sosa lola

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Buffy comes back from the dead and Willow and Tara are like, "We've been living in your house and we spent all your money while you were dead. So now that you're back, you have to get a job or we'll all be homeless."
They didn't spend Buffy's money. Joyce's hospital bills sucked all the money. The Scoobies must have learned about this recently and didn't tell Buffy to spare her apparently until the disaster of the flood.

BUFFY: But I haven't spent any money. I was all ... dead and frugal.
WILLOW: I-I know, this comes as a bit of a shock after ... a bit of a shock, but ... it took us by surprise too.
TARA: Your mother prepared everything really well. She had insurance ... (nervously) life insurance.
XANDER: Which should have left you covered, but ... hospital bills.
WILLOW: Pretty much sucked up all the money.

Even with this storyline, Buffy was able to live in that house and wear all the new stylish clothes for more episodes later until she gets her Doublemeat Palace job, which I'm pretty sure does not cover the electricity and water bills as well as the new, never seen clothes Buffy and Dawn wear every new episode.

So, either Willow and Tara do help out with the money, or there's a billion dollars in that check Giles gave her.
 
FaithLehane16
FaithLehane16
This is very unthoughtful and insensitive

DeadlyDuo

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So, either Willow and Tara do help out with the money, or there's a billion dollars in that check Giles gave her.
Giles should've been giving Buffy more cheques. He was being paid to be her watcher, he was still receiving a salary from the Watcher's council, he could've at least helped by giving her a stipend every month. Even if she still had to get a job, Giles' money could've at least taken some of the pressure off. It wouldn't be money for nothing either, she was the slayer, it could've been some form of salary.
 
DeepBlueJoy
DeepBlueJoy
Absolutely. She saved the world. That makes her work worth MORE than the rest of the world. She should have been paid more than everyone else, not nothing.

GraceK

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Giles should've been giving Buffy more cheques. He was being paid to be her watcher, he was still receiving a salary from the Watcher's council, he could've at least helped by giving her a stipend every month. Even if she still had to get a job, Giles' money could've at least taken some of the pressure off. It wouldn't be money for nothing either, she was the slayer, it could've been some form of salary.
Agreed. This woman is expected to sacrifice her life and until she dies in the line of duty keep working crappy jobs to support herself? Meanwhile Giles has a huge estate in England and the Watchers council are living high on the hog while contributing nothing.

I would have loved if Buffy had pulled a Jon Snow in season 6 and said “ My watch has ended. Go rehabilitate Faith if you want a slayer. I’m out of here to live my life !”. Lol
 
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DeepBlueJoy
DeepBlueJoy
I don't see her doing it, but i do think she would have been justified.

DeepBlueJoy

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I don't think Buffy stopped being nice but I know I'm mostly alone with that on here.
You are not alone.

I don't think Buffy stopped being nice. I think she stopped having energy for other people's BS. She wasn't always sweetness and light, but I don't think she was ever not nice.

She was really kind to Cassie and other troubled kids at school, and took care of everyone but herself. There's a difference between 'nice', and being tactful and uber-polite and worrying excessively about other people's feelings. When the world is burning, certain things fall away b/c most of us only have so much emotional energy. When you're exhausted and people are dying because of their own mistakes, it's easier to just say what you actually think (and probably always thought). This doesn't make you not nice. It just makes you a bit more honest.

If Buffy hadn't been nice, she might have just taken her kid sister and left town. She was used by the council, used by Giles, and had the worries of the world dumped on her while she struggled to support her kid sister (she didn't suddenly get rich after the previous year). I don't get how people could expect her to be Bubbly Fashionable Buffy when Willow's resurrection had put the world in jeopardy (and given Buffy major depression) and she was having her house invaded by a bunch of hostile, incompetent, terrified strangers who Giles .

Something else, people really don't seem to get? After 8 years of being the slayer (she was slayer before Sunnydale) she was tired. Tired, alone and without help (except for that pesky vampire everyone shamed her for needing when she was suicidal and couldn't talk to her friends because they'd resurrected her without even bothering to dig her up!). She had a job, a sister to raise, a house to run, a world to save... and 3 dozen people to train and feed and feel guilty about them dying.

I don't think people really get that Buffy was a deployed soldier EVERY day and night from the age of about 15 -- without a holiday. Multiple deployments destroy soldiers. Imagine a continuous deployment for more or less 8 years... while you had to do all the other responsibility and keep it secret from most of the people you care about (and those who can and will punish you or lock you in a mental health facility).

Buffy had the worst of both worlds -- very nearly the life of an abused/abandoned child (totally traumatized) and the role of an (unpaid child) soldier,

For 8 years, she had a secret she couldn't tell, and horrors she couldn't process... daily bruises, sometimes more. Basically, she had a traumatic, secret life she couldn't talk about and she watched human beings die on a regular basis, and felt like a failure every time that happened... add to that, she often had to finish them off when they were turned. How many school mates did she 'kill'? We know from Holden, Spike and Harmony, that even when evil, vampires have personalities of the people they'd been... How hard that must be. Being a warrior and having some of your 'enemy' be people you know and sometimes even care about.

And of course, she got into trouble for doing her 'job'.

To get back to the soldier analogy... remember (well, if you can't remember, you can read about it) just how much more screwed up the Vietnam vets were than the veterans of other wars... because they had no respect or recognition from society. Only rage and disrespect. These feed the PTSD back to the soldier in an endless pain loop.

Buffy saved the world by killing her first love. What happened? She was expelled from school (a second time), accused of murdering her fellow slayer (what a reminder of her expiration date!) and then her mother kicked her out AFTER she knew the truth.

We first see her PTSD when she returns after season one. She'd DIED and everyone was expecting 'normal'. I cannot believe it didn't get worse with time... her catatonia when Dawn was taken was not that surprising.

So, her flat affect in season seven? She actually seems pretty well adjusted for someone who had woken up in a coffin only one year earlier.

Eight years of this. It's trauma upon trauma. It might have eased up some during the summers, but it was seldom a true holiday.

If you look at any member of the military who is in a war zone, they cannot help but change... some of them change a little on the outside and internalize (like Buffy), some of them come back complete strangers to their families.

It is stressful, even if you think she was "just" a private (which is what the council certainly treated her as, and Giles was schizo about - expecting General level responsibility (and to raise Dawn on nothing, while he and the council got paid and came from money), but giving her NO training for that leadership and NO respect from him for any of her choices or all the work she did.

No, he humiliates her publicly on more than one occasion, and stabs her in the back at others, after having left her to fend for herself and Dawn on a minimum wage job, in between trying to save the world on a semi daily basis. And yeah, in retrospect she was actually right about most of it (even needing Spike), though execution was sometimes iffy. World still here, so I say she did something right.

So, IMO, Buffy was way nicer than she had any reason to be. Remember that girl in terminator? Hard as nails and no energy for anything but being the fierce protector? Think of all Blade in any of his movies... he might have had a sense of humor, but he was a grim person... and real life is not as glamorous.

Buffy had no reprieve from any real life problems or the problems of the existence of the planet. When things were at their worst, she was criticized and condemned and betrayed by her friends and family. I think she was way nicer than any of them deserved. She was the ONLY one who was held to a high moral and personal standard by everyone.

Xander killed people when he conjured a demon
Willow killed people when she tried to end the world. This is after she basically date raped Tara by magic roofie.
Giles was a heartless, gutless abandoner of ALL of them. He expected his CHILD to save the world, grind out a life of penury with no qualifications b/c her 'life's calling' meant she was dead instead of in universe! Did he ever think to get her a psychiatrist? OR PAY HER?

What price is the world worth?

And the Spike hatred? If she hadn't saved him, the world might well have ended in Sunnydale. Yes, the writing was not great, but the Buffy of season seven? She is the ONE true thing. She would probably have been worse, if it had been real. She had been BATTERED and abandoned and worked her ass off without respite. Who took care of her? No one. She internalized all her pain and it came out sideways in an unhealthy relationship (even though Spike loved her, she wasn't in a headspace for connecting with anyone.)

Who saved the world and took care of her sister, while she rested the only rest being when she was dead? Oh yes, mostly Spike.

Who dragged her back into the world when there was already a proven slayer alive and clearly penitent a few hours away. Her so called friends. When did Buffy rest after coming back? pretty much, never.

Her friends were lucky. Giles was lucky. They found their purpose in life because of her. Willow becomes an uber witch, and Xander becomes friend and competent assistant to the most important woman on the planet, who calls him 'friend'. Anya finds love. Anya calls her lucky. That's nonsense.

Who in their right mind would sign up for a thankless, painful, unpaid, uber-dangerous job you can't leave unless you die? A job you must do while you try to balance everything else everyone else has to do, and finds hard to do without a 'save the world' side gig. And do it all in secret, while your friends judge you and tell you not to sleep with the bad vampire, as if your sex life is any of their business. Xander treated both Anya and Buffy a whore after he found Anya with Spike. when it was HIS actions that facilitated Anya's lonely drunken hook up.

Buffy was really nice. Nicer than Giles deserves. Nicer than her friends and her ungrateful betraying sister deserve. Nicer than the world deserves.

No, she was not perfect. Who amongst us is? I love Buffy.
 
crazysoulless
crazysoulless
I feel all warm and soothed inside reading this post.
Puppet
Puppet
I may not be Buffy's biggest cheerleader, but I agree with all of this.

GraceK

Grr Arrg
Joined
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Messages
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You are not alone.

I don't think Buffy stopped being nice. I think she stopped having energy for other people's BS. She wasn't always sweetness and light, but I don't think she was ever not nice.

She was really kind to Cassie and other troubled kids at school, and took care of everyone but herself. There's a difference between 'nice', and being tactful and uber-polite and worrying excessively about other people's feelings. When the world is burning, certain things fall away b/c most of us only have so much emotional energy. When you're exhausted and people are dying because of their own mistakes, it's easier to just say what you actually think (and probably always thought). This doesn't make you not nice. It just makes you a bit more honest.

If Buffy hadn't been nice, she might have just taken her kid sister and left town. She was used by the council, used by Giles, and had the worries of the world dumped on her while she struggled to support her kid sister (she didn't suddenly get rich after the previous year). I don't get how people could expect her to be Bubbly Fashionable Buffy when Willow's resurrection had put the world in jeopardy (and given Buffy major depression) and she was having her house invaded by a bunch of hostile, incompetent, terrified strangers who Giles .

Something else, people really don't seem to get? After 8 years of being the slayer (she was slayer before Sunnydale) she was tired. Tired, alone and without help (except for that pesky vampire everyone shamed her for needing when she was suicidal and couldn't talk to her friends because they'd resurrected her without even bothering to dig her up!). She had a job, a sister to raise, a house to run, a world to save... and 3 dozen people to train and feed and feel guilty about them dying.

I don't think people really get that Buffy was a deployed soldier EVERY day and night from the age of about 15 -- without a holiday. Multiple deployments destroy soldiers. Imagine a continuous deployment for more or less 8 years... while you had to do all the other responsibility and keep it secret from most of the people you care about (and those who can and will punish you or lock you in a mental health facility).

Buffy had the worst of both worlds -- very nearly the life of an abused/abandoned child (totally traumatized) and the role of an (unpaid child) soldier,

For 8 years, she had a secret she couldn't tell, and horrors she couldn't process... daily bruises, sometimes more. Basically, she had a traumatic, secret life she couldn't talk about and she watched human beings die on a regular basis, and felt like a failure every time that happened... add to that, she often had to finish them off when they were turned. How many school mates did she 'kill'? We know from Holden, Spike and Harmony, that even when evil, vampires have personalities of the people they'd been... How hard that must be. Being a warrior and having some of your 'enemy' be people you know and sometimes even care about.

And of course, she got into trouble for doing her 'job'.

To get back to the soldier analogy... remember (well, if you can't remember, you can read about it) just how much more screwed up the Vietnam vets were than the veterans of other wars... because they had no respect or recognition from society. Only rage and disrespect. These feed the PTSD back to the soldier in an endless pain loop.

Buffy saved the world by killing her first love. What happened? She was expelled from school (a second time), accused of murdering her fellow slayer (what a reminder of her expiration date!) and then her mother kicked her out AFTER she knew the truth.

We first see her PTSD when she returns after season one. She'd DIED and everyone was expecting 'normal'. I cannot believe it didn't get worse with time... her catatonia when Dawn was taken was not that surprising.

So, her flat affect in season seven? She actually seems pretty well adjusted for someone who had woken up in a coffin only one year earlier.

Eight years of this. It's trauma upon trauma. It might have eased up some during the summers, but it was seldom a true holiday.

If you look at any member of the military who is in a war zone, they cannot help but change... some of them change a little on the outside and internalize (like Buffy), some of them come back complete strangers to their families.

It is stressful, even if you think she was "just" a private (which is what the council certainly treated her as, and Giles was schizo about - expecting General level responsibility (and to raise Dawn on nothing, while he and the council got paid and came from money), but giving her NO training for that leadership and NO respect from him for any of her choices or all the work she did.

No, he humiliates her publicly on more than one occasion, and stabs her in the back at others, after having left her to fend for herself and Dawn on a minimum wage job, in between trying to save the world on a semi daily basis. And yeah, in retrospect she was actually right about most of it (even needing Spike), though execution was sometimes iffy. World still here, so I say she did something right.

So, IMO, Buffy was way nicer than she had any reason to be. Remember that girl in terminator? Hard as nails and no energy for anything but being the fierce protector? Think of all Blade in any of his movies... he might have had a sense of humor, but he was a grim person... and real life is not as glamorous.

Buffy had no reprieve from any real life problems or the problems of the existence of the planet. When things were at their worst, she was criticized and condemned and betrayed by her friends and family. I think she was way nicer than any of them deserved. She was the ONLY one who was held to a high moral and personal standard by everyone.

Xander killed people when he conjured a demon
Willow killed people when she tried to end the world. This is after she basically date raped Tara by magic roofie.
Giles was a heartless, gutless abandoner of ALL of them. He expected his CHILD to save the world, grind out a life of penury with no qualifications b/c her 'life's calling' meant she was dead instead of in universe! Did he ever think to get her a psychiatrist? OR PAY HER?

What price is the world worth?

And the Spike hatred? If she hadn't saved him, the world might well have ended in Sunnydale. Yes, the writing was not great, but the Buffy of season seven? She is the ONE true thing. She would probably have been worse, if it had been real. She had been BATTERED and abandoned and worked her ass off without respite. Who took care of her? No one. She internalized all her pain and it came out sideways in an unhealthy relationship (even though Spike loved her, she wasn't in a headspace for connecting with anyone.)

Who saved the world and took care of her sister, while she rested the only rest being when she was dead? Oh yes, mostly Spike.

Who dragged her back into the world when there was already a proven slayer alive and clearly penitent a few hours away. Her so called friends. When did Buffy rest after coming back? pretty much, never.

Her friends were lucky. Giles was lucky. They found their purpose in life because of her. Willow becomes an uber witch, and Xander becomes friend and competent assistant to the most important woman on the planet, who calls him 'friend'. Anya finds love. Anya calls her lucky. That's nonsense.

Who in their right mind would sign up for a thankless, painful, unpaid, uber-dangerous job you can't leave unless you die? A job you must do while you try to balance everything else everyone else has to do, and finds hard to do without a 'save the world' side gig. And do it all in secret, while your friends judge you and tell you not to sleep with the bad vampire, as if your sex life is any of their business. Xander treated both Anya and Buffy a whore after he found Anya with Spike. when it was HIS actions that facilitated Anya's lonely drunken hook up.

Buffy was really nice. Nicer than Giles deserves. Nicer than her friends and her ungrateful betraying sister deserve. Nicer than the world deserves.

No, she was not perfect. Who amongst us is? I love Buffy.
I love this post but did you mean to post it in the thread about Buffy season 7? This seems like a really in depth response to that other thread. Either way I love it! :)
 

DeepBlueJoy

Lion Faced Kitteh
Joined
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Messages
737
Location
East of Trouble
I have to agree . Willow was so proud she could do magic she couldn't stop & she didn't care if it hurt other people .
The reason I say that is that when Willow & Tara had a fight Willow used magic on Tara just because she could do so .
  • Willow was on a power trip. She wanted to raise the dead. Why do you think she gave Dawn the book about raising her mother? I believe she expected Dawn to come to her for help. It was only blind luck that made Dawn turn to Spike instead or we might have had zombie Joyce.
  • Willow also was utterly enmeshed with her vision of Buffy the hero, she couldn't let go. (maybe she, like Xander, was a little in love with the romance of and the idea of Buffy). She didn't stop for a minute to think of consequences, because she didn't want to have those pesky possibilities to contend with... What she did was to lie to the others about what was entailed... I think she left a lot out.
Both Tara and Xander were stunned by the spell she did.

Willow didn't know where Buffy was because she didn't want to know. IMO, in spite of liking Willow a lot, I think she's one of the least nice people in Buffy's circle. That mantle is often thrust onto Xander because he overtly does unpleasant things. The truth is that Willow is sneakier. She does things with malice, forethought and plain, almost sociopathic, wilfulness. She's really, really smart... but she is utterly insecure. She is also arrogant at the same time, which is a hallmark addict characteristic... High arrogance and Low self-esteem. It can lead to fear, but often leads to recklessness in the pursuit of recognition and self validation. Even if the world recognizes you, you never really see yourself as worthy or able, so you keep pushing the boundaries as far as you can.

She doesn't just want to do well, she wants to do what no one has ever done before... even if it is insane and hurts others. She's meek in appearance, but she's very, very selfish... Even back in season one, she's a law breaker, hacking into government files.... files that may not have been that well protected, but were, nevertheless NOT public. It turned out to be a useful skill to have, but it's at heart an antisocial act. And a sign of willfulness... and a willingness to do WHATEVER she can get away with, just to prove she can. To prove she's better.

And we see it over and over. My will be done, anyone? Who even THINKS that is a good thing to consider? It was such a masterfully bad thing, the head of a powerful demon order offered her a gig doing vengeance!!

Willow honestly thinks her will is better because she is smart. It's a mistake some smart people make that hurts people around them a lot. She substitutes her will for the laws of nature, and often subverts those laws. Sometimes to good ends, but sometimes, she just hurts others and puts lives of people she LOVED in jeopardy.

I believe if she hadn't met Buffy, it is quite possible she'd probably have ended up in prison for hacking. There is a reason those computer companies had flown execs into town to meet her and Oz during the career day. They WERE that good.

That much ability and NO restraint are never a good combination.
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I love this post but did you mean to post it in the thread about Buffy season 7? This seems like a really in depth response to that other thread. Either way I love it! :)
Thank you!!

My post below (edited for brevity) is a response to a comment in this thread... Yes, it sort of responds to stuff in the other thread too, but it responded to @crazysoulless' earlier comment in this thread about Buffy still being nice. (that was a brief comment in a longer post)

You are not alone.
I don't think Buffy stopped being nice. I think she stopped having energy for other people's BS. She wasn't always sweetness and light, but I don't think she was ever not nice. (SNIP!!)
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sosa lola

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I do believe that Buffy gets help, but we were not shown that, because if she really was broke, I don't see how she was able to still live in that house with new wardrobe from October to the end of January without a job.
 
W

WillowFromBuffy

Guest
Buffy comes back from the dead and Willow and Tara are like, "We've been living in your house and we spent all your money while you were dead. So now that you're back, you have to get a job or we'll all be homeless."
It's not like they took her inheritance and went to Vegas. They paid Joyce's medical bills, paid the down payments on the mortgage on the house, managed Buffy's other affairs and took care of Dawn. It is never implied that they spent anything on themselves. Also, they fixed the robot to keep Dawn away from the social services and brought Buffy back from the dead without having to explain her absence. They did what they assumed Buffy would want. After that, Tara left and Willow had a break down.
 

DeepBlueJoy

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I do believe that Buffy gets help, but we were not shown that, because if she really was broke, I don't see how she was able to still live in that house with new wardrobe from October to the end of January without a job.
Where do you get the idea that Buffy gets help? Nothing in canon supports it, and mostly, she seems almost suicidally depressed. Her only on screen confidant in season 6 is Spike (and for a short conversation, Tara). The only counselor we ever see her talk to is Platt, who is murdered back in season 3. She would have needed a special 'in the know' counselor, to really benefit from counseling, but there's no canon evidence that ever happened.

About the house: often, insurance pays off a house. We don't know there's a mortgage on the house, and it was definitely her mothers, so no rent. It's very possible the house was only generating operating expenses and repair expenses. I know lots of people who are 'house rich and cash poor' - you tend to see this a lot with old people - they have a paid off house that slowly falls to bits around them, but they live there til they die.

I suspect Joyce had a savings account that Buffy accessed after she returned, but after several months, it was running low. (and of course, Giles did give her SOME money, we don't know how much.) People who are house rich can eventually lose their houses for things like back taxes or other liens, but that tends to take time, sometimes, especially in bad housing markets, it can take years.

It was never mentioned that Tara or Willow paid rent.

Even if they were in college and poor, they would have had to pay rent somewhere or for dorm living, so they should have paid it to Buffy.

Living free would not be the act of a friend.

Where did you get the idea Buffy had the new wardrobe from? It's not supported in canon. If we see her for a couple of days a week, we don't know anything she has is new... so even if we never see her wear the same item twice, it doesn't mean she hasn't had all those clothes for years. That's a function of it being a TV show... but we don't see her buy ANY clothing in season six. The only person who gets new stuff is Dawn, and much of that is stolen. Buffy's not big spender.
 
crazysoulless
crazysoulless
Next fans are gonna accuse Buffy of shopping at Prada since that's where the wardrobe dept bought her clothes.
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