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Xander instead of Cordelia on Angel could it have worked ?

Btvs fan

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I saw this discussed on Passion of the Nerd about the idea of Xander going to the spin off instead of Cordy and it seems worth a chat here.

I mean with Glen Quinn already on there it would've been the Bro show but could it have worked ?

I'm not sure Cordy would've worked still on BTVS tbh. She felt a bit redundant after the Xander break up on the flip side imo
 

Ethan Reigns

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In "Enemies", Angel is walking along with Faith, sees Xander and knocks him down with one punch, saying, "That guy just bugs me."

I don't see Xander being any too willing to follow Angel anywhere. He believes the world would have been a lot safer if Buffy had just staked vampires instead of getting into a relationship with any of them. I don't see a "let bygones be bygones" moment unless Angel comes along and saves Xander at some point. There are rumours that David Boreanaz had Nicholas Brendon uninvited to the 20th anniversary photo shoot meaning maybe that scene where he punches Xander out was not acting. It certainly would have been a strained work environment if that was the case and Xander was there.
 

DeadlyDuo

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There are rumours that David Boreanaz had Nicholas Brendon uninvited to the 20th anniversary photo shoot
I think DB is letting himself be blamed by NB in order to protect someone else. After all, in a BUFFY reunion, who would be the more important character to have there: Angel who left the show after Season 3 or Xander who was there throughout the whole 7 seasons. DB got his own reunion with the Angel cast (which also included JM, AD and CC) so although he did play an important part in the first 3 seasons of Buffy, he didn't have to be there. It's more likely it was SMG who didn't want NB there, given the reports about him at the time, and DB and SMG get on really well so she is someone he would take the brunt of NB's anger for. Plus SMG would have the pulling power because you can't have a Buffy reunion without Buffy. NB was extremely bitter about it because at a con appearance with EC, they were answering a question and she said "he's going to tell you why he's all bitter". The body language between EC and NB in that appearance is quite different from some of their earlier con appearances together.

The massive group shot of them all actually has NB photoshopped in. In the video of when the group shot is being taken, you can see that NB is no where to be seen yet he's in the photo. His photos were done separately from the rest of the group.

As for the thread question, Xander would not have worked on Angel. Aside from the fact that Xander doesn't even like Angel, Willow is in Sunnydale and she's the only person Xander has truly been able to count on his entire life. Where Willow goes, Xander follows, he wouldn't just abandon her.
 

Btvs fan

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I think DB is letting himself be blamed by NB in order to protect someone else. After all, in a BUFFY reunion, who would be the more important character to have there: Angel who left the show after Season 3 or Xander who was there throughout the whole 7 seasons. DB got his own reunion with the Angel cast (which also included JM, AD and CC) so although he did play an important part in the first 3 seasons of Buffy, he didn't have to be there. It's more likely it was SMG who didn't want NB there, given the reports about him at the time, and DB and SMG get on really well so she is someone he would take the brunt of NB's anger for. Plus SMG would have the pulling power because you can't have a Buffy reunion without Buffy. NB was extremely bitter about it because at a con appearance with EC, they were answering a question and she said "he's going to tell you why he's all bitter". The body language between EC and NB in that appearance is quite different from some of their earlier con appearances together.

The massive group shot of them all actually has NB photoshopped in. In the video of when the group shot is being taken, you can see that NB is no where to be seen yet he's in the photo. His photos were done separately from the rest of the group.

As for the thread question, Xander would not have worked on Angel. Aside from the fact that Xander doesn't even like Angel, Willow is in Sunnydale and she's the only person Xander has truly been able to count on his entire life. Where Willow goes, Xander follows, he wouldn't just abandon her.
I doubt DB is covering for Sarah. A I don't think Sarah is the sort to need somone covering for her, if she dislike them.
B It would be impossible to cover up anyway, considering Entertainment Weekly and Joss would have to know. Seems more a case of sorry but David doesn't want you there than oh Sarah doesn't want you there, we need to cover it up. Why would David even agree to that.

As he was one of the 2 major love interests for Buffy on the show (Team Angel v Team Spike still happens to this day) and he got his own spin off and has had a successful TV career since, David was clearly going to have some pull

Out of interest what was the reason for not wanting him at the photo shoot anyway ?

Have you got the link to that EC/NB con appearance btw ?
 
Angel6
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Sarah and David are really close too, I would imagine they discussed it. I can imagine her not wanting to put her name to it, and him not really giving a crap.

Ethan Reigns

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I'm not sure Sarah would have been behind it - another rumour is that Sarah went to Joss with the idea that Buffy and Xander should be a couple rather than Buffy and Spike. I doubt she would want a lot of scenes with she disliked enough to ban from a photo shoot.
 
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Out of interest what was the reason for not wanting him at the photo shoot anyway ?
Probably about the thinks he had done he's had problems with alcoholism and domestic violence. I don't know how DB dare to be the one to get him removed (although if it was any of the other cast I would have understood) from the photoshoot, it's not like he's had a great past with women either.
 

DeadlyDuo

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I doubt DB is covering for Sarah. A I don't think Sarah is the sort to need somone covering for her, if she dislike them.
B It would be impossible to cover up anyway, considering Entertainment Weekly and Joss would have to know. Seems more a case of sorry but David doesn't want you there than oh Sarah doesn't want you there, we need to cover it up. Why would David even agree to that.

As he was one of the 2 major love interests for Buffy on the show (Team Angel v Team Spike still happens to this day) and he got his own spin off and has had a successful TV career since, David was clearly going to have some pull
Whilst that is true about DB, I don't think he would be able to dictate not having NB there. If only one person had an issue with NB, then they could just keep the two separate by sitting them as far apart as possible, but if more than one person had an issue then it is probably easier just to exclude NB completely.

It is totally possible that there was dislike between DB and NB anyway so when NB was told he wasn't welcome and DB's name was mentioned, he just assumed it was all his fault rather than there being someone else also involved in the decision. DB wouldn't throw SMG under a bus. If her name wasn't brought up, he wasn't going to go "Sarah didn't want you there either."

Out of interest what was the reason for not wanting him at the photo shoot anyway ?
I don't know. NB got a later call time for photos (they couldn't completely exclude him) but he only had photos with Joss. He was completely absent from the big group interview and the big group photo, though there was a backstage photo taken with some of the others and he did have an interview with EC. Here's some of the backstage photos- apologies for the size of some pics:



Interestingly enough, there is also this photo:



Notice how everyone's name cards are separate with the exception of NB's which is attached to Joss'

Have you got the link to that EC/NB con appearance btw ?
I skipped to the part where someone asks a question about the reunion.

 
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nightshade

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Can we get back to the topic, the reunion talk is for a different thread.
 

Btvs fan

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I do think he could have worked, but not in season one. Angel and Cordelia barely had a relationship in Buffy, so it was almost a fresh start for them, whereas Xander would have to get over his hostility towards Angel first
It's not like Angel had much history with either Cordy or Wesley either but both were written into the shows. Characters can change, Wesley is proof of that. He wasn't even a character on BtVS just a straw man for the group to rebel against and the audience to dislike. On Ats he has arguably the greatest arc of any character on either show. Thats a long winded way of they could found a way to write Xander on the show if they'd wanted too
 

AlphaFoxtrot

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No. While I think Angel is one of those shows that can work with an all male cast, I don't think season 1 could. But then again, Wes. So, I don't know.
 
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I do believe hearing that Nick asked Joss if he could go onto AtS in S5 and Joss said no because they already had Spike filling the role of giving Angel shit.

Cordy and Wes fit S1 because they were also looking for redemption. I'm sure the writers could have come up with some reason for Xander to turn up, but why?
Why make Angel carry a character that has hated him from the get go. I see no point.
 

sosa lola

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Cordy and Wes fit S1 because they were also looking for redemption. I'm sure the writers could have come up with some reason for Xander to turn up, but why?
Redemption, too. Xander is no saint and has made plenty of mistakes in the first three seasons: The Lie, cheating on Cordelia, breaking up Oz and Willow, the love spell, being a dick to Buffy about Angel, being insensitive in regards to Willow's feelings for him, being such a hot-headed angry teenager...

Why make Angel carry a character that has hated him from the get go. I see no point.
Enemies becoming frienmies becoming friends is a very popular storyline. It would have been interesting if Angel knew that Xander played a role in him getting tortured in hell for years, the dynamic would be fun to see. Xander wouldn't live with Angel from the get-go. He'd have his own crappy apartment, perhaps he could be part of Gunn's gang, and we get introduced to them early in the show.

Maybe when Buffy visits in I Will Remember You, she'd swing by Xander's place, see how horrible it is and asks Angel if Xander could stay at his apartment. Angel would not agree with this idea at first but after erasing Buffy's memories of their time together, we see him in the end of the episode offering Xander a place to stay at his apartment, out of guilt for what happened with Buffy.
 

telperion66

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I love Xander in the first season of Buffy, but with each subsequent season, I find that his appeal and energy fades.

In terms of being on Angel, I don't feel its something that Joss would ever have supported, however I could be wrong.

My own feeling is that Xander is so instrinsically tied to Buffy's world that it would have been difficult to see him fitting into the life that Angel made for himself in LA, however, I'm the sure the writers could have made it work if push came to shove.
 
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Redemption, too. Xander is no saint and has made plenty of mistakes in the first three seasons: The Lie, cheating on Cordelia, breaking up Oz and Willow, the love spell, being a dick to Buffy about Angel, being insensitive in regards to Willow's feelings for him, being such a hot-headed angry teenager...
If Xander was going to have a redemption story it would involve his actual friends, not dumped on the shoulders of the guy he cheered on to be killed.

Enemies becoming frienmies becoming friends is a very popular storyline. It would have been interesting if Angel knew that Xander played a role in him getting tortured in hell for years, the dynamic would be fun to see. Xander wouldn't live with Angel from the get-go. He'd have his own crappy apartment, perhaps he could be part of Gunn's gang, and we get introduced to them early in the show.
AtS was a slapstick comedy? It would have to be to give Xander any reason to be around.

Maybe when Buffy visits in I Will Remember You, she'd swing by Xander's place, see how horrible it is and asks Angel if Xander could stay at his apartment. Angel would not agree with this idea at first but after erasing Buffy's memories of their time together, we see him in the end of the episode offering Xander a place to stay at his apartment, out of guilt for what happened with Buffy.
So Buffy just ignores how Xander treated Angel for 3 years (including that time he egged her on to kill Angel) and tells Angel he should help her friend because reasons... that's so like her.

Also, Angel has no (IWRY) guilt. He didn't erase Buffy's memories. He made a life choice to live as a vampire. TPTB made it happen.
 

Btvs fan

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I do believe hearing that Nick asked Joss if he could go onto AtS in S5 and Joss said no because they already had Spike filling the role of giving Angel shit.

Cordy and Wes fit S1 because they were also looking for redemption. I'm sure the writers could have come up with some reason for Xander to turn up, but why?
Why make Angel carry a character that has hated him from the get go. I see no point.
Cordy didn't need redemption, she was a cartoon character ie high school bitch who'd lost everything by S3 and who then made up with Xander. She was only on the show because Greenwalt was a fan and pushed for her.
 
Thieving gypsy
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Look at you banging on your i hate cordy drum.

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No, I don't think it would've worked. Angel started out a much "darker" show than Buffy, or bleak if you will. It doesn't have bright Sunnydale scenery or a colorful and bubbly Willow/Buffy character and it's not going to have the same kind of cutesy episodes that BtVS can pull off, at least not at the start.

Basically, s1 of Angel needed a Cordy character - or anyone else - who was a big bright smile and a warm personality (compared to Angel, Wes or Doyle). Xander could not give a balance to the show, he couldn't bring it warmth and levity like Cordelia could. As his character already had a spotty past with Angel odds are they would have to spend some time on even making the two remotely friendly with each other, which means that a big part of Xander's journey would be somewhat oppositional to Angel. I fail to see how that could've served the show, or the characters, very well. Besides, they wrote Doyle off due to Glenn Quinn's substance abuse (I believe), odds are under those conditions that NB wouldn't have lasted too long either as Xander could never be as essential to the AI team as he was to the Scooby team.

And yeah, I can't see a continued purpose for Cordy on BtVS either. And also, yeah, it would've been the bro show, I can just imagine the flack it would be catching today for a lack of gender balance *eye roll*, it's tiresome enough to read the "blah blah Angel saves another white female again".

I may not be a big Cordy fan, but she made a lot more sense on Angel than Xander did. Xander was a good fit for BtVS, I just wish they would've given his character more material.
 

DeadlyDuo

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@Thieving gypsy How the hell do you interpret that as I hate Cordelia 🤷‍♂️
My guess is because you referred to Cordelia as a "cartoon character" and that "She was only on the show because Greenwalt was a fan and pushed for her."

Tell you what; you bring your Cordelia drum, I'll bring my Kennedy drum, someone else can bring their Connor drum and we can start a band. We'll be the " I hate Cordorennedy drummers" (working title). :p
 
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