Discussion of 8.40 "Coda" - Released 1/19/11 (Dark Horse)

Just finished it, first thing that jumped out at me was the Twilight symbol on the first page.



It's the reverse of what we were shown on issue #1.



The symbol was literally twilight. Considering all the crazy suggestions for what that symbol was over the years I just love how clearly and obviously it is laid out here. A very nice "Duh" moment.

There are a lot of reviews going around the web and I'm sure most of you have read them already so I'm just going to give you reactions to the things that stood out to me the most.

I adore this issue and the reason for that is the dialogue. It does a wonderful job in reminding me why Joss Whedon gets the praise he does. I may not be a Joss card-carrying acolyte anymore but he gave us a glorious Buffy voice in this issue and for that I thank him. In the words of Willow "You're never not you...are you?". 😀

Speaking of Willow, I'm fairly certain the person Willow claims to be in love with is Aluwyn not Tara. I think the issue makes that really clear...especially with the panel of her staring at the picture of her.

The Buffy/Dawn interactions were really lovely and Dawn pretending to have sex with Xander (at Buffy's expense) was hilarious "But Xander...will it fit?" LMFAO!

I'm not going to lie, the B/A side of it is hard to take. Buffy can't bare to look at Angel. And, honestly, that hurts. But that's the point. He's supposed to feel it, she's supposed to and so are we. I don't believe it will always be that way though. I think that for B/A, "there is a way to be good again". Although, I'm certain now then ever that the verse will end when that day comes. There is no way for them to be together and fight the good fight.

Angel is broken. There is no other way of putting it. He's catatonic...he still has the blood of the battle on his face. It's not clear if this is because he refused to wash it off (which would make perfect sense for Angel...he would wear it as an act of contrition) or because he is catatonic and Faith hasn't gotten to the stage where she can face him yet. She has taken him in but she makes it clear that she is struggling with the burden of his sins too. What we do know is that this is the absolute rock bottom for Angel and from here, he can only go up. Here's hoping (for me anyway 😉).


The last few pages focus's mainly on the threats that face Buffy in the wake of the ripples of betrayal she has sent out into the world: the not-calling-themselves-slayers slayers, the rogue slayers led by Simone, Willow, who I think is supposed to represent the magic community in general, but she is not ruled out as a threat either, the fairy from "The Chain" who I am guessing will have something to say about the fake!Buffy dying in the name of Buffy...really dying for nothing, and then there is this weird fella covered in blood. We don't know who he is but according to interviews by Allie, we'll see more of him next season.

The point is that Buffy has hurt a lot of people. People she has never met, people she doesn't even know exist. And they are going to have something to say about it and her.

The main theme of the issue is hope. Hope for Buffy, hope for everyone. It's made clear that it is something that has to be fought for, even handled with care. Was it not a form of hope that led them to this point? Added to this is Joss's letter where he acknowledges that they haven't gotten it all right with this season, in his own words "We've laughed, we've cried, we've thrown up a little in our own mouths, but most of all we've learned".
He promises a scaled back, character driven Season 9.

I hope so. 🙂

ugh!!!

i can't believe i blew off going to the comic shop because i thought nothing i wanted was coming out today!!

thanks for the breakdown!

Wilder Midnight said:

ugh!!!

i can't believe i blew off going to the comic shop because i thought nothing i wanted was coming out today!!

thanks for the breakdown!

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It's the best issue in a long while, that's for sure.

It's not much of a breakdown, I've left out a lot. I know we say it for every issue but you really need to read this one yourself. 🙂

Can anyone confirm whether this issue was released in the UK today as well? I'm struggling to find a UK release date. Sorry if this isn't the right place, didn't think it warranted a new thread.

sisterofmercy said:

Can anyone confirm whether this issue was released in the UK today as well? I'm struggling to find a UK release date. Sorry if this isn't the right place, didn't think it warranted a new thread.

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I think it was actually released in the UK, yesterday. It's definitely out anyway. 🙂

Also, mods, I've named the thread incorrectly. Could you change it to "Last Gleaming part Five". Sorry for the mis up. 🙂

I'm not sure how you can get Willow as a threat, considering what she's been through it makes sense for her both to be angry at Buffy and worried for the world. It shouldn't come as too surprising slayer wouldn't want to be called slayers anymore, slayers could be alienated for their association with Buffy who imposed such a huge price on others in the last arc, and for what, nothing seems worth what was lost. Angel has a lot to answer for and hopefully they won't gloss over all of Angel's victims's season, espcially if they want to win back sympathy. I don't see the shipping as a big deal, the scoobies have always seemed more interesting to me than the vampire triangle. It would be just disrespectful for Buffy to ever be with Angel, he has done too many evil deeds to her and others. At least Buffy admits that sleeping with him was a betrayal, at least she is coming to reality on how wrong morally it was, at least I hope that we will be seeing more of. Although Spike's and Buffy's friendship seems more interesting than the romance factor, and hey at least Spike when ensouled is someone who won't sell out himself for a suppost destiny. The witches of the world have been violated on a very personal level and its good that Buffy takes responsibilty for what she did, empowering girls can be just as violating people by stripping them of part of themselves like the witches were. Xander is Buffy's hero, and he's been my hero since the first episode, Xander's character is one of the most consist white hat he walks his talk at the end of day, there is no compromising for him, he is the watcher, and the everyday joe who saves the world, powers or no powers, he represents true heroism which is not compromising, and fighting to protect those you care about and not for rewards and destiny. Faith one of the most evolved slayers steps up along with Dawn. Simone with the gun along with the other slayers show how now that magic is gone the one with the gun has all the power again, like the general those that life by the gun die by the gun. The seed was the Earth's heart, that something that shouldn't be forgotten and its how Frayverse became what it is. The Earth is a living being like Willow learned in Lessons, so when she says the Earth still in danger she knows what she is talking about. Thats why you don't compromise because then end up with a soulless Earth. The NFA callback makes lots sense, much like Angel's victory against the Black Thorn, i couldn't care less about the villain and the win seems hardly worth the victory, its a hallow victory which will have repercussions to come.Angel literally became his enemy in NFA, and Twilight is no different, you can't pretend to do evils then start do them, and remain pretending anymore. Angel lost his way in NFA, and once again he compromised himself, harmed others who he were innocent, and won nothing that isn't worth even one innocent life. The story plays like the Jasmine arc, its different but the lesson is the same, the price is always too much for someone idea's of a perfect world that oppressives and harms others, much the way the witches are stuck in an oppressive world, that denies a part of who they are.

citiegal17 said:

I'm not sure how you can get Willow as a threat, considering what she's been through it makes sense for her both to be angry at Buffy and worried for the world.

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Well I said she could be seen as a threat. I didn't say she was a threat definitively. It could go either way with her. However, if you were to put in her the "Threat" category I think it would be a fair assessment because Dark!Willow is very much still on the table. We don't know what will happen with her. If she becomes a threat it will because her and Buffy are on opposing sides of a conflict, not because she wants revenge against Buffy.

Angel has a lot to answer for and hopefully they won't gloss over all of Angel's victims's season, espcially if they want to win back sympathy.

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If this issue is anything to go by then I would say they will be doing the opposite of glossing over what Angel did. Buffy and Faith can barely look at him. The two people who care about him the most. I think that says it all. Angel isn't going to get an easy ride.

I

don't see the shipping as a big deal

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It won't be a big deal for a lot of people. It's something I am interested in though so I mentioned my thoughts on it. It certainly isn't a big deal in the issue.

Kean said:

Well I said she could be seen as a threat. I didn't say she was a threat definitively. It could go either way with her. However, if you were to put in her the "Threat" category I think it would be a fair assessment because Dark!Willow is very much still on the table. We don't know what will happen with her. If she becomes a threat it will because her and Buffy are on opposing sides of a conflict, not because she wants revenge against Buffy.



If this issue is anything to go by then I would say they will be doing the opposite of glossing over what Angel did. Buffy and Faith can barely look at him. The two people who care about him the most. I think that says it all. Angel isn't going to get an easy ride.

I

It won't be a big deal for a lot of people. It's something I am interested in though so I mentioned my thoughts on it. It certainly isn't a big deal in the issue.

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I'm worried about them glossing over Angel's victims considering how Angel still hasn't owned up to the murders of the slayers, soliders, and others who were killed because of his scheme prior to the reveal. Also I don't think FDW was evil, I just didn't get the vibe, I don't think everything in TOYL was as it seemed. I don't think Willow would want to harm Buffy, I think she would want to fix the slayer line, scythe, and keep the world from suffering because it was soulless, I think she at least understands Buffy desperate reaction, but is upset for good reason, the death of magic impacts her on a huge level, and others. If someone is a fan of the triangle more power to them, but I find the scoobies more interesting because they are at the heart of the story and why I started watching the show in the first place.

citiegal17 said:

I'm worried about them glossing over Angel's victims considering how Angel still hasn't owned up to the murders of the slayers, soliders, and others who were killed because of his scheme prior to the reveal. Also I don't think FDW was evil, I just didn't get the vibe, I don't think everything in TOYL was as it seemed. I don't think Willow would want to harm Buffy, I think she would want to fix the slayer line, scythe, and keep the world from suffering because it was soulless, I think she at least understands Buffy desperate reaction, but is upset for good reason, the death of magic impacts her on a huge level, and others. If someone is a fan of the triangle more power to them, but I find the scoobies more interesting because they are at the heart of the story and why I started watching the show in the first place.

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I think his catatonia speaks volumes but I didn't expect to see any sort of comment on what he has done from him, or anyone else, until we see him in his own title.

There's been a few interviews flying around the place today and I think in one of them there was allusions made to Willow seeking out magic again, or trying to undo what's happened. As for FDW there is nothing to suggest she was good either. The fact that she was aligned with Harth isn't exactly helping her White Hat Application. I'd wager though that if she ends up as FDW, it won't be from good deeds.

Believe me, I would much rather that the triangle be addressed once and for all. But at the end of the day it is all relationships and I find the romantic ones as interesting as the Scooby ones.

Actually, one of the sadder notes of this issue is Buffy and Dawn acknowledging that the Scooby Gang is no more. 🙁

Kean said:

I think his catatonia speaks volumes but I didn't expect to see any sort of comment on what he has done from him, or anyone else, until we see him in his own title.

There's been a few interviews flying around the place today and I think in one of them there was allusions made to Willow seeking out magic again, or trying to undo what's happened. As for FDW there is nothing to suggest she was good either. The fact that she was aligned with Harth isn't exactly helping her White Hat Application. I'd wager though that if she ends up as FDW, it won't be from good deeds.

Believe me, I would much rather that the triangle be addressed once and for all. But at the end of the day it is all relationships and I find the romantic ones as interesting as the Scooby ones.

Actually, one of the sadder notes of this issue is Buffy and Dawn acknowledging that the Scooby Gang is no more. 🙁

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Kean, I think if Willow really gone evil the first thing she would do is to harm Buffy, she had the oppurtunity in TOYL, but she didn't take it. Why would anyone who was evil care about victims who were being ignored in TOYL? Mainly its the evil guys who think sacrificing innnocents is okay, hence the callback to Jasmine or Angel being a Jasmine type villian this season. FDW let Buffy get back without a fight, season 6 Willow wouldn't do that. I think Joss is trying to fool everyone into thinking FDW was evil, she was black in apparence, but apparences are decieving. FDW deliberately put Fray in place to help the innocents, much like she played both Harth, Fray, Garth, and Buffy, I would bet it was a act for something very important.

citiegal17 said:

Kean, I think if Willow really gone evil the first thing she would do is to harm Buffy, she had the oppurtunity in TOYL, but she didn't take it. Why would anyone who was evil care about victims who were being ignored in TOYL? Mainly its the evil guys who think sacrificing innnocents is okay, hence the callback to Jasmine or Angel being a Jasmine type villian this season. FDW let Buffy get back without a fight, season 6 Willow wouldn't do that. I think Joss is trying to fool everyone into thinking FDW was evil, she was black in apparence, but apparences are decieving. FDW deliberately put Fray in place to help the innocents, much like she played both Harth, Fray, Garth, and Buffy, I would bet it was a act for something very important.

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Hey, I'm not attached to the idea one way or another, I'm just saying it is an option. Which it is. And I'm not saying Willow is a threat now, I'm saying she could be down the line. Could being the operative word here.

Also, you don't have to be evil to hurt people. Case in point: Angel this season.

Kean said:

Hey, I'm not attached to the idea one way or another, I'm just saying it is an option. Which it is. And I'm not saying Willow is a threat now, I'm saying she could be down the line. Could being the operative word here.

Also, you don't have to be evil to hurt people. Case in point: Angel this season.

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Kean, I think Jasmine's arc establishes what Angel did was evil, there are different kinds of evil, there is pure evil like Angelus and the Master, and gray evil like Jasmine and Angel. FDW just doesn't seem to me the type to hurt others, but its my opinon though, she didn't seem to keen about how Buffy's and Fray's lurks have cost other so much either even after 200 years.

Giles left Buffy the "Vampyr" book, oh my god it's so beautiful I'm crying everywhere.

Does anyone else know if this is out for us Aussies? Thanks for the break down Kean.

This is a really good issue. Really good. I love that they're going a more centralized, character-driven way in Season 9. Even if I didn't necessarily like everything that led to this new world, lol. Everything just made sense to me, finally! Faith taking care of Angel, Giles leaving Faith all his possessions and leaving Buffy the Vampyr book (okay, didn't see that coming, but it makes total sense and you just know Giles has his reasons), Willow dumping Kennedy, Spike and Buffy as good friends (even though my shipper heart is saying something else 😀), Dawn and Xander living together like that. I love the dialogue too. It's classic Buffy, and seeing as how this issue was all Joss, of course it would be.

And Joss's letter at the end, damn. I'm not even a huge fan of the guy, but he made me feel really sympathetic towards him? IDK. I am generally pretty satisfied with this ending to Season 8. And I really like that Joss is finally listening to the fans, given that he's usually Mr. Pretentious "I don't give the fandom what they want; I give them what they need".

prophecygrrl said:

This is a really good issue. Really good. I love that they're going a more centralized, character-driven way in Season 9. Even if I didn't necessarily like everything that led to this new world, lol. Everything just made sense to me, finally! Faith taking care of Angel, Giles leaving Faith all his possessions and leaving Buffy the Vampyr book (okay, didn't see that coming, but it makes total sense and you just know Giles has his reasons), Willow dumping Kennedy, Spike and Buffy as good friends (even though my shipper heart is saying something else 😀), Dawn and Xander living together like that. I love the dialogue too. It's classic Buffy, and seeing as how this issue was all Joss, of course it would be.

And Joss's letter at the end, damn. I'm not even a huge fan of the guy, but he made me feel really sympathetic towards him? IDK. I am generally pretty satisfied with this ending to Season 8. And I really like that Joss is finally listening to the fans, given that he's usually Mr. Pretentious "I don't give the fandom what they want; I give them what they need".

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Willow dumped Kennedy? How and why? Details please! This has truly made my day and hopefully we've seen the last of her.

My #40 Review:


Buffy/Kennedy: Kennedy's anger is understandable, she holds Buffy the blame for breaking her and Willow up. If Willow was still powerful, Kennedy wouldn't have been dumped. Buffy's support to Kennedy is touching. She proves once again what a great person she is. Kennedy has always been hostile to her, especially in this scene where she blames her for all the crap they'd gone through, and Buffy brushes on her shoulder and tries to make her feel better.

Buffy/Willow: Willow broke up with Kennedy because "she didn't really love her". That's the real reason and something I've known since S7. I have no doubt that Kennedy's feelings for Willow are more than just lusting after her powers, Kennedy's tears when she reveals that Willow was the one who dumped her proves this, Kennedy staying with Willow even though she knew that Willow still thinks of Tara proves this, Kennedy doing whatever Willow asks her without a question not only proves that she loves her, but proves that she blindly trusts her. Like Tara used to.

Willow believes that Kennedy is only attracted to her because of her magic. And that's not true. It's what Willow thinks. It's not a fact. Besides, Willow dumped her for Snake Lady, which proves again that she was never in love with her. I'm surprised at Buffy is making a big deal out of rooting for Kennedy, she's always approved of her, like in #10.

As for Willow blaming Buffy, obviously she does. She's trying hard not to show it, but she can't. I love the way Jeanty drew Willow's expression in every panel, her expression describes how she really feels more than her words do. I'm gonna really miss Jeanty, he draws expressions the best out of all the artists I've seen.

Buffy/Dawn: Dawn confesses that she's never been a real member in the Scooby gang, or at least a wanted member, which is in a way true and not true. In S7, Dawn took Willow's old role as a researcher and computer nerd, she was a watcher junior and she translated foreign books. Then she left for college and came back as a giant, and she was able to save her friends through her transformations. She went back to being Research Girl after she came to her normal size. But Dawn can have a future, she's a normal girl, and so she put herself before the fight. Especially since there isn't any fight anymore, just vampires Buffy can dust easily on her own.

Dawn taking Buffy in and giving her pep talks is a reverse to their old dynamic: Buffy being the one taking care of Dawn and putting a roof over her head.

Dawn pretending to have sex is the boost Buffy needed to get up and be the Slayer. Dawn knows what Buffy wants more than anyone else and she helps her get it with tough (disturbing) love. Actually, Dawn has done this before in S7 "“even though I don't think anyone would agree with me- when she asked Buffy to leave the house, that was done out of tough love to make Buffy see things clearly. Dawn's tears that time showed how hard it was on her, but she knew at the moment that Buffy needed it.

Buffy/Xander: I'm not gonna pretend to be all cool about Xander not getting a scene with Buffy like every other character did in the final issue of S8. Especially since he was her closest friend all season. I wanna quote Sarah Michael Geller but I can't find the quote, about Xander not getting his well-deserved screen time in Chosen. BUT this isn't the very last chapter of the story, like Chosen used to be, and there will be another season. So, Xander will hopefully get a storyline next season.

Also, Buffy and Dawn consider him their hero. So, aww.

About Xander working again in construction, I thought what with having a one eye he can only do desk work. But I'm not familiar with the rules of employment in construction, so if anyone has information on this, fill me in.

Buffy/Faith: Buffy is crushed that Giles left everything to Faith - Jeanty did a perfect job with Buffy's expression at the news - and everybody else seems to be upset about this. Xander was casting Faith hate looks, I don't know if it's because Giles left him nothing or he was doing it on Buffy's behalf. Faith herself is so surprised.

However, Giles seemed to have left Buffy, Xander, Willow and Dawn something. Because in his will, he said that he's leaving everything "save those listed above" to Faith.

Giles does love Buffy, but she's not his daughter anymore. She's a fellow fighter, someone above him, she's a protector, "The Slayer". Faith now is the girl Buffy used to be, she needs Giles like Buffy used to, and she needs his money, flat, farm and horses more than anybody else, moreover she needs love more than any of them. And Giles gave her that.

Faith taking Angel in shows a lot of forgiveness, because no one wants anything to do with him and Buffy can't look at him. Faith is the ideal choice to help Angel. She's returning the favor.


Buffy/Spike: Buffy can't invite Spike because she doesn't have the authority to do so. It's not her apartment. Only Xander and Dawn can invite him, and they are not there. They probably don't know he visits Buffy occasionally. Spike seems to have taken Angel's old role in S1 and S2. He's the one bringing bad info and warning Buffy about something he doesn't know. Buffy has issues with Spike that aren't solved yet, which will make for an interesting Spuffy story for next season.

I don't like Spike's "no one watches your back but me" argument, because obviously Xander and Dawn still do. They're giving her a place to stay and they're not blaming her for ruining the world like everyone else does. Actually, they seem to love this new world, they fit in it so perfectly. Faith also doesn't seem to blame Buffy and is very supportive and understanding of Buffy's pain over Giles.

Perhaps what Spike meant is that he's the only one helping her in slayer-like activities and preventing apocalypses, which is true at this point because Xander and Dawn chose to have a normal life and Faith chose to help Angel get back on his feet.

Kean said:

I adore this issue and the reason for that is the dialogue. It does a wonderful job in reminding me why Joss Whedon gets the praise he does. I may not be a Joss card-carrying acolyte anymore but he gave us a glorious Buffy voice in this issue and for that I thank him. In the words of Willow "You're never not you...are you?". 😀

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Yes, this was definitely the Jossiest issue of the season, and probably one of the best. I didn't like everything that happened in it, but it was a great story and told very well.

Kean said:

Speaking of Willow, I'm fairly certain the person Willow claims to be in love with is Aluwyn not Tara. I think the issue makes that really clear...especially with the panel of her staring at the picture of her.

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Yes, I think it's Aluwyn. Willow already dealt with her feelings for Tara in "Goddesses & Monsters."

But... for Willow to dump her real live girlfriend so she can stare at a picture in a book is pretty much indicative of her state of mind now. Everyone else in the story looks to be recovering and moving onward and upward (or soon will start to, in Angel's case). But not Willow. She's sinking.

Kean said:

I'm not going to lie, the B/A side of it is hard to take. Buffy can't bare to look at Angel. And, honestly, that hurts. But that's the point. He's supposed to feel it, she's supposed to and so are we. I don't believe it will always be that way though. I think that for B/A, "there is a way to be good again". Although, I'm certain now then ever that the verse will end when that day comes. There is no way for them to be together and fight the good fight.

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I think they will ultimately be together only when they die in each other's arms at the very end of the story.

I don't know if there is any Fangel romance coming up next season, but I really kind of hope not. Those two should stay platonic, even though Angel's curse is probably no longer in effect.

Kean said:

Angel is broken. There is no other way of putting it. He's catatonic...he still has the blood of the battle on his face. It's not clear if this is because he refused to wash it off (which would make perfect sense for Angel...he would wear it as an act of contrition) or because he is catatonic and Faith hasn't gotten to the stage where she can face him yet.

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This is quite some time after the Hellmouth battle, though. They've already buried Giles, read his will, and Faith has moved into his flat. That would be a loooong time for Angel not to get cleaned up, catatonic or not. I think by this point he'd be getting a lot smellier than Faith would like to live with.

I actually considered the possibility that Faith had given him an uncontested beating to vent her rage over losing Giles... we see him sitting there all bloody, with Faith saying "I'm all about forgiveness." That would give it a pretty ironic context, as if to say "I've forgiven him, now that I've punished him." Forgiveness without consequences is the last thing Angel needs.

Kean said:

The last few pages focus's mainly on the threats that face Buffy in the wake of the ripples of betrayal she has sent out into the world: the not-calling-themselves-slayers slayers, the rogue slayers led by Simone, Willow, who I think is supposed to represent the magic community in general, but she is not ruled out as a threat either, the fairy from "The Chain" who I am guessing will have something to say about the fake!Buffy dying in the name of Buffy...really dying for nothing, and then there is this weird fella covered in blood. We don't know who he is but according to interviews by Allie, we'll see more of him next season.

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I was surprised to see that Fairy. I had assumed "The Chain" was a set-piece and wouldn't be referenced again in the story.

I guess we'll find out what consequences the death of magic has had down in the world below. Especially since their main problem is not vampires but demons, and most demons (unlike vamps) can go on reproducing without magic. For them, the situation is "as many demons as ever, but no Slayers or magic to fight them with anymore."

Kean said:

The point is that Buffy has hurt a lot of people. People she has never met, people she doesn't even know exist. And they are going to have something to say about it and her.

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And well they should. But there must be some people who understand. I hope Satsu will still be there for her in some way, along with Leah and Rowena.

sosa lola said:

I don't like Spike's "no one watches your back but me" argument, because obviously Xander and Dawn still do.

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Buffy herself said the exact same thing in Season 7. Spike is the one person whose support she has absolute trust in, because he, unlike Giles, Willow, Dawn, and Xander, has never betrayed her. I won't go so far as to say that she considers him "the one," but she has no doubt that he sees her that way, and not just in a romantic sense. He is almost like the old knights, sworn to defend her honor and protect his lady from all harm. Once more, that doesn't necessarily have any sort of romantic connotation as much as he recognizes that, literally, everything that he now is, the hero, the Champion, and simply the Better Man, he owes to her.

(And, incidentally, Xander would be able to work in construction the same as he would be able to drive a car. His lack of depth perception might restrict him from certain specific tasks, but for general construction work, there wouldn't be any problem. At least, that's the way that it works in Georgia, and I can't imagine that it would be any different in Califirnia)

This has to me my favorite issue of the series. So glad to see them get back down to earth with everything. And glad that Joss admitted they went a little overboard this season and plan on toning down Season 9.