Out Of Character (OOC) Moments

[TheAnnoyingOne]

Willow threatening Giles in season 6 always seemed OOC to me. I know this was the beginning of the Dark Willow arc and they were sowing the seeds of what was to come, but it didn't really make sense to me that she'd go that far at that point of the season.

And of course, season 7 was riddled with OOC moments, they probably exceeded the number of times Giles took off his glasses.

 

[Stake fodder]

I've been watching S1, and it seems out of character for Cordelia to be pursuing Owen in "Never Kill a Boy on the First Date." One - deep, bookish Owen doesn't seem her type. (At least, not till a couple seasons into Angel.) Two, it seems like Cordy would not act desperate for the attention of any boy. She would expect them to pursue her.

 

[NotASlayer]

I have to disagree with you on just about all the acting. The only brilliant acting came from SMG, the rest were, at best, ok.

I am curious, though, as to whether SMG is even acting. From various accounts, it seems she loathed what she had to do in S6, was willing to quit mid-season and did quit after it. What was the most common emotion she displayed when Spike was abusing her? Loathing.

If the negative emotion the actor is showing is what they are truly feeling, that is not getting the best from them, that is abusing them.

I know or know of as many Spuffies who despise S6 as love it. When I visit the boards, one's Spuffiness does not seem to predict one's feelings about the quality of S6.

Those who dislike Spuffy in S6 do not dislike Spuffy so much as dislike the way Spike emotionally, psychologically, physically and sexually abuses Buffy. Those who like Spuffy in S6 tend to overlap with those who thought Spike's kidnapping and creepy stalking of Buffy in S5 was a grand romantic gesture.

Another predictor seems to be when one started one's career. Those who started well before the Great Recession seem to truly dislike S6. Those who started their careers during or after seem.to be much better disposed towards S6.

The more nihilistic the watcher is, the more they seem to enjoy S6.

Personally, I think S6 is where BTVS dropped off a cliff. The quality of the writing is way, way, way down. The stories don't really make much sense. The characters just wandering around and through various pits of despair does not make a seasonal arc. Buffy stops being Buffy and becomes trauma porn. The trauma and misery don't serve a story. They are just gratuitous and shocking just to be shocking.

I still can't explain what the point of S6 actually was. I agree that S7 was a dumpster file. But, S6 was a dumpster fire that burned much more brightly.

Even some writers on S6 seem to have admitted that it was, basically, badly-written garbage cobbled together from leftover non-Buffy plots with no plan.

And of course, season 7 was riddled with OOC moments, they probably exceeded the number of times Giles took off his glasses.

Giles takes off his glasses so he doesn't have to see what is happening. I guess he did not want to see what was happening in that season.

 

[NotASlayer]

What does seem to predict is whether or not you see your life experience protrayed in S6. Those that do, love S6. Those that don't, dislike or ignore it.

On thinking about it, I wonder if those who like S6 because it relates to their life experience would have enjoyed the show even more if it had just dumped all that dumb supernatural stuff and been your regular teen drama.

 

[hoponlilmama]

Willow threatening Giles in season 6 always seemed OOC to me. I know this was the beginning of the Dark Willow arc and they were sowing the seeds of what was to come, but it didn't really make sense to me that she'd go that far at that point of the season.

I'm not sure at that point it was out of character for Willow. Go back to s5 and her throwdown on Glory ("I owe you pain!"). We've been seeing signs earlier in the series that Willow sometimes has issues handling intense situations/emotionally charged moments.

And of course, season 7 was riddled with OOC moments, they probably exceeded the number of times Giles took off his glasses.

🤣
S7 definitely racks up a list of OOC moments.

Post automatically merged: Jul 13, 2024

I have to disagree with you on just about all the acting. The only brilliant acting came from SMG, the rest were, at best, ok. The storylines, where they existed, were predictable and kinda boring. I don't see the the complexity or "realness". To me, S6 plays like a reality tv show because everything seems completely set up, just like The Bachelor.

I know or know of as many Spuffies who despise S6 as love it. When I visit the boards, one's Spuffiness does not seem to predict one's feelings about the quality of S6.

What does seem to predict is whether or not you see your life experience protrayed in S6. Those that do, love S6. Those that don't, dislike or ignore it.

Another predictor seems to be when one started one's career. Those who started well before the Great Recession seem to truly dislike S6. Those who started their careers during or after seem.to be much better disposed towards S6.

Personally, I think S6 is where BTVS dropped off a cliff. The quality of the writing is way, way, way down. The stories don't really make much sense. The characters just wandering around and through various pits of despair does not make a seasonal arc. Buffy stops being Buffy and becomes trauma porn. The trauma and misery don't serve a story. They are just gratuitous and shocking just to be shocking.

I still can't explain what the point of S6 actually was. I agree that S7 was a dumpster file. But, S6 was a dumpster fire that burned much more brightly.

For what it's worth, I like s6 (I don't love it though), but it is riddled with problems. Towards the end, it did feel a bit soap opera-ish.

I can understand how folks relate to the season (myself included) - Buffy particularly. Because people have felt like they've been "going through the motions" or asking, "give me something to sing about".

The writing didn't tackle her depression and agony properly - we don't see Buffy really working through her issues. Other characters were made miserable for the sake of it (Anya and Xander not going through with the wedding). Out of character moments (Giles leaving Buffy, and leaving Willow when he sees she's got a problem with magic). The Giles we know wouldn't abandon the people he basically considers his children.

But overall, I agree, there is a drop in the quality of the series in s6 + s7.

 

[AlphaFoxtrot]

Re: Tax Evasion; You can only be put into jail for a crime, most tax issues are treated as civil matters. The crimes are usually going out of your way to hide a lot of money from the government. Although, there are situations where the government will want to make an example of you, cost benefits be damned. Given that the Chase's weren't able to protect their primary residence from seizure, had to be pretty bad.

 

[silvermoon]

For me in 7 Buffy became pretty humourless. I felt like SMG looked bored sometimes and I read she was pretty tired of the show by then. and apparently even before that. the writers seemed to magnify her more self-righteous traits. ill never forgive them for giving the scoobies the shaft by and large . spike and buffy, though im still a fan, had taken up too much airtime by then. i remember reading an article by a writer saying spike was like the fonz and had ruined the show. i wouldnt go that far though. i just wish they had forgotten the stupid slayer wannabes .

 

[TheAnnoyingOne]

I'm not sure at that point it was out of character for Willow. Go back to s5 and her throwdown on Glory ("I owe you pain!"). We've been seeing signs earlier in the series that Willow sometimes has issues handling intense situations/emotionally charged moments.

I don't think that's really comparable. Glory was evil and had just sucked Tara's brain, whereas Giles was her friend and mentor and she threatened him only because he scolded her for her recklessness. It's not like she was consumed by dark magic at that point, I think it was way too early for her to go as far as threatening a friend and father figure. I don't find that believable.

 

[garfan]

I don't think that's really comparable. Glory was evil and had just sucked Tara's brain, whereas Giles was her friend and mentor and she threatened him only because he scolded her for her recklessness. It's not like she was consumed by dark magic at that point, I think it was way too early for her to go as far as threatening a friend and father figure. I don't find that believable.

the thing is Willow lashing out is perfectly reasonable or in character, this is different because of a few things

1. Willow's anger is normally louder
2. When she says it to a person's face it's usually defending someone else, see her she's 16 going on 40 speech
3. When it's about her it's not to the person's face, see Giles doesn't see anything moment in something blue

It didn't work for me. I'm not going to be upset the main character of the show is alive. I didn't respect Giles decision to leave so him coming back and talking to anyone like that made me want to hit him myself. And I don't consider his opinion valid. The ritual Willow used with the Urn of Osiris is a known ritual. That means it has worked without his stupid "concerns" happening.

 

[hoponlilmama]

I don't think that's really comparable. Glory was evil and had just sucked Tara's brain, whereas Giles was her friend and mentor and she threatened him only because he scolded her for her recklessness. It's not like she was consumed by dark magic at that point, I think it was way too early for her to go as far as threatening a friend and father figure. I don't find that believable.

You make a fair point!
I just mean in difficult times she tends to lash out. Giles was angry with her and Willow didn't like it. It's just showing the audience that she isn't fully in control.

We've been seeing signs since s3, but I get what you're saying.

 

[NoShip]

Those who dislike Spuffy in S6 do not dislike Spuffy so much as dislike the way Spike emotionally, psychologically, physically and sexually abuses Buffy. Those who like Spuffy in S6 tend to overlap with those who thought Spike's kidnapping and creepy stalking of Buffy in S5 was a grand romantic gesture.

Interesting! 😀 I never thought of it this way!!! 🤩

 

[Tome]

Here are some of mine from the early seasons:

- Buffy 'dancing' with Xander in 'When She Was Bad'
Totally out of character if you consider Buffy's character in the rest of the show. Sure, she was suffering from some sort of PTSD, but I don't see how this would lead her to try and hurt Willow, Xander, and Angel... all at the same time. Honestly, I don't think I can think of a more OOC action made by Buffy in the show.

- Spike turning Ford at the end of 'Lie to Me'
I really don't think Spike would care about fulfilling his 'promise' to Ford, especially after he didn't get what he wanted. I think it played out that way so that we could get the scene where Buffy has to kill Ford at the cemetary.

- Giles telling Buffy not to worry about Angelus being able to enter her house whenever he wants to in 'Passion'
One of the most ridiculous moments in the show for me. Giles going "Oh you know, Angelus is just trying to keep you on the edge, to stress you out". Hum, Giles, your adoptive daughter, your Slayer, is at the mercy of a confirmed sadistical, murderous vampire who could kill her and her mom in their sleep at any point, and you berate Buffy for being worried? How about doing your job as a Watcher and finding a way to stop Angelus from entering the Summers' house as soon as possible? How about offering to Buffy and Joyce to come stay at your place until you find a solution? I couldn't believe how casual he was about the whole thing. I guess it's fitting that he ended up losing his lover in the same episode where he made light of Angelus as a potential threat.

- Giles playing along with the Council in 'Helpless'
Now, I know that it was his job, but this was taking place in S3. He had become really close with Buffy by that point, and you'd assume his actions in this episode would have been eating him inside. However, for the first half of the episode, he doesn't seem concerned much at all. I always found that out of character. Imo, they should have showed from the GET GO that this was a very difficult decision for him. Not wait until the end of the episode to demonstrate it.

- Buffy's behavior after getting tricked by Parker in early S4
I just don't buy that Buffy, the strong character we've been following for more than three years, would act like such a lovesick, abandoned puppy. Especially not considering she was smart enough to realize what had gone down and had her friends clarifying it for her over and over. There was nothing about Parker that would make me believe that Buffy would care so much about being 'rejected' by him. Buffy being angry, or even acting petty, would have been a lot more believable for me.

- Buffy's behavior in 'Pangs'
Now, I know this was done for comedic effect, but come on! Buffy was being so silly throughout most of this episode. 🤣 OVERLY SO! She cared more about the mushy peas than Xander slowly dying from a combination of diseases!

 

[DeepBlueJoy]

Regarding Parker:
Anyone can be hurt. She was hurt and humiliated Buffy was just fledging her adult wings and got cruelly used. Played!

First semester of university and away from home is HARD. Add emotional whiplash and you have a toxic combo. Being smart and strong does not mean we don't FEEL.

Sometimes the strongest and most self-reliant people have the hardest times dealing with emotional pain (as i think Buffy often does)

-------

I do wonder if Giles had not turned up and incited Willow into trying to destroy the world, something even Tara's death did not do - well done Giles! - if she would have just killed Andrew (a pleasant thought) and Jonathan, then just given up. Especially if the Scoobies had simply got out of the way.

Had she done that; Willow probably would have ended up comitting or at least attempting suicide.which actually might have been more human scale devastation. Had she succeeded in killing Andrew and Jonathan, the show would have had to have her face real life consequences.

Warren was a true villain. Killing him was excusable even if horrible. (Just watched that scene a couple days ago; forgot how devastating & viscerally gross it was. Andrew and Jonathan would not have been viewed as true villains in spite of some of their actions.

How it played required serious action but not (for example) prison and/or the psych ward. Wish Andrew and Jonsthan had stayed gone tho'!

 

[Tome]

Regarding Parker:
Anyone can be hurt. She was hurt and humiliated Buffy was just fledging her adult wings and got cruelly used. Played!

First semester of university and away from home is HARD. Add emotional whiplash and you have a toxic combo. Being smart and strong does not mean we don't FEEL.

Sometimes the strongest and most self-reliant people have the hardest times dealing with emotional pain (as i think Buffy often does)

Buffy dealt with a lot more serious emotional pain before Parker. I just don't buy this argument at all.

It wasn't even like she had been in a long relationship with him and he was kind and then suddenly dumped her. This literally was a one night stand. The only type of emotions I could see Buffy having after that are embarrassment and anger.

 

[AlphaFoxtrot]

Re😛arker; I agree it's out of character for the Buffy we saw in Welcome to the Hellmouth. But, the problem with Buffy is that you can't write her like Sarah Connor in T-2. She is supposed to be relatable to the type of girl who is going through her own Parker situation. She needs to be relatable and grounded.

 

[garfan]

The thing about Ford being turned? There were a lot of vampires in there. Someone other than Spike could have turned him and I doubt Spike would have cared to stop them

 

[hoponlilmama]

The thing about Ford being turned? There were a lot of vampires in there. Someone other than Spike could have turned him and I doubt Spike would have cared to stop them

I agree, garfan. I don't think Spike would've sired him.

 

[NotASlayer]

This is perhaps a subtle one, but Spike not turning on Adam until Adam turned on him. Now, Spike agreeing to help Adam to get the chip removed makes sense. But S2 Spike sided with Buffy because Angelus wanted to destroy the world, and Spike loves the world and what's in it, not just the Happy Meals on legs. So, I think Spike would have turned on Adam when he discovered Adam's plans were to start an end game war (and this would nicely have solved the problem as to why Spike was allowed to remain in Sunnydale in S5).

 

[thetopher]

But Spike only allied with Buffy until he got what he wanted- Drusilla- and then walked off even when Acathla had been a woken and the world was in peril. So it tracks with the events of S4, Spike can compromise on immediate self-interest in the moment, but ultimately he's still really out for himself.

Another example is when he's been tortured by Glory; sure, he can tell himself he's doing it to protect Buffy, and even convince himself (because he's a romantic who will suffer for love), but ultimately he also realizes that if he tells Glory what she wants to know then she'd kill him all the quicker. After all Spike knows what its like to be a torturer, or do we think he would've simply let Angel go if he'd given up the Gem Of Amara?