Episode Discussion 1.05 "True Believer" - Aired 3-13-09 (FOX-US)

WhiteHat said:
* The blonde security douche knocked out Echo--presumably to let her toast. Man, I hate that guy.
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My question is... why didn't he shoot her? He had an automatic rifle in his hand. In fact, why didn't he just let the cult leader shoot her?

Either he's one crappy assassin, or... it wasn't his intention to kill her at all. He knew Boyd would rescue her.

First, he kills the man who was about to kill her... and then, he shows his face to her and knocks her out. Did he do that deliberately to try and jar her further into self-awareness?

Is he secretly working with Alpha?
 
Old Master 3.0
Old Master 3.0
Good points.
Very much liked this one. Love when Echo said "God says to move your ass." Fantastic line. Also liked the end where Echo is being carried out Langton. And the look she gives Mr. Dominic. Plus: Victor's man reaction.
 
Oh, this was a good one. 😀

More sweet interaction with Echo and Boyd, comedy duo Topher and Saunders, and more twists coming up with Ballard.

The cult storyline was a bit blah, but I got really into it by the end.
 
Yeah I agree with Bluebird that the cult storyline was a bit blah. At first I thought the women being talked about in the episode synopsis was the was with blonde curly hair until we find out nobody actually wanted help.
 
I really enjoyed this ep, it was so good.

What I'm wondering though is should it be worrying that I find Echo and her imprints to be the least enjoyable part of the show? My favourite parts of every ep so far have been the scenes without Echo in them, especially this last ep. Topher and Saunders were great, I adore Victor and Sierra and Langton is just a legend. I found myself getting annoyed when we were cutting back to her story. : erm :
 
R
Revolver
I mostly agree. Love Topher and Saunders, etc. Although I probably prefer Echo's storylines to Agent Ballards which just seem out of place at this point.
Kean said:
What I'm wondering though is should it be worrying that I find Echo and her imprints to be the least enjoyable part of the show?
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I think the "mission of the week" part of the show is probably over... she'll go on one next week, but something will happen to change everything and the show will go in a new direction.

It might wind up that Echo will find she has the ability to call up any of her past imprints whenever she wants or needs them, so she'll have her own personality and her own agenda, but a gigantic set of skills she can call on (and maybe the other memories of all those people as well).
 
It was awesome! The Claire/Topher interaction was one of my favorite parts, and I have a new ship of Victor/Sierra now! XD But honestly, it was pretty great. The right amount of action, messages, etc. Millie was kind of creepy to me, though.
 
Wow. Uh, well, I'll have to admit I found this episode quite interesting. It was obvious how Joss was trying to comment (and critique) the somewhat damaging nature of fanatical Christianity. Interesting. I know he's an athiest, but he has some sort of fascination with the themes in Christianity it seems.

Anyway. Great episode.

Paul's getting closer, eh? I'm concerned about the "attic". What is this? I assume it's not so much a place as it is a state? Possibly, this "attic" is a metaphor for shutting down a Doll, yes? Putting her in storage? Putting them out to pasture, per say? I wonder what would happen to her if she was put into the "attic"? I am constantly worried for Echo's safety it seems. She seems so much like a child. She always seems too vulnerable, what with everyone pulling her strongs every which way every episode. Poor Echo the Puppet, doomed to be hired out on absurd missions forever. God I hope not. I say a Revolution of The Dolls is in order.

And kudos to Eliza for her work in this episode. I thought she was fantastic. I'd venture to say this might be my favorite episode yet.

And yes, that was quite amusing about Victor and his erections. 😉
 
I havent seen the last 10mins of this ep yet (which might well have changed my mine, I duno) but I really didnt like it. I was bored thru it and would have turned it off earlier if it wasnt a Joss show. The "man reaction" gave me a giggle but it did seem kinda forced since Topher is a scientist, why not use the correct terms? The eye op/camera thing seemed really dumb to me, too sci fi maybe? I duno but not impressed with this ep. Hopefully it will get better next week.
 
Friendly Lurker
Friendly Lurker
I didn't like the camera thing either but I thought "man reaction" suited Topher, he's always been silly and a bit immature.
Well, the cult story didn't really interest me either.
I thought it would in the beginning, when they came in singing and with the Save Me note and all that. But as it progressed I don't know... it lost me somewhere.

No, the interesting / funny part of this story was inside the Dollhouse.
Think it was the first time I laughed out loud while watching Dollhouse. It was brilliant. 🙂

/SK
 
i give this episode a 8/10. i would have given it a higher rating but the storyline seemed a little flat to me. plus, the captain of the ATF task force was a bad actor.

anyway, ive said it before and ill say it again, i love this show and it has so much potential. i hope that FOX looks at joss's track record and allows him ample time to work his magic.

i vote: "RENEW DOLLHOUSE FOR SEASON 2 WITH 22 EPISODES!"

SO SAY WE ALL!
 
C
charmingslayer
I hope tht happens but even if DH gets renewed im thinking we're still gonna only get 13
I think I know why Claire is kinda mean to Topher and I think it's cause she blames him for what happened to her and with Alpha.
Did anyone notice that Topher and Claire we're saddended when Adelle said all that stuff about Victor and espicially when they find out while searching for "man reactions" that he likes Sierra they both seem kinda joyish in a way and saddened at the same time.
 
AndrewCrossett said:
My question is... why didn't he shoot her? He had an automatic rifle in his hand. In fact, why didn't he just let the cult leader shoot her?

Either he's one crappy assassin, or... it wasn't his intention to kill her at all. He knew Boyd would rescue her.

First, he kills the man who was about to kill her... and then, he shows his face to her and knocks her out. Did he do that deliberately to try and jar her further into self-awareness?

Is he secretly working with Alpha?
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I don't think so.
He works for Adelle; his job is to take over and protect Echo if Boyd can't.
If they'd been able to get out Echo's body, and found she had a bullet in her head...well...how would he explain that? "Yeah, sorry, I let the guy shoot her"? "I shot her"? "I didn't get there in time"? No matter what, he'd be blamed, and probably lose his job.
By knocking her out, and letting her toast, he could simply pretend he hadn't been able to find her through all the smoke, etc. Or that he had to leave because he was dying, too..Adelle would still be pissed, but he would be less to blame.

Sorry if anybody already said all of this, I haven't read the last page or so. 😛

---------- Post added at 07:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:29 PM ----------

charmingslayer said:
I think I know why Claire is kinda mean to Topher and I think it's cause she blames him for what happened to her and with Alpha.
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Well plus, they both have totally different opinions about the Dolls and how they should be treated.
Claire is very careful, very organized. This is probably because of what happened with Alpha. Perhaps she learned a lesson from it.
But we know Topher isn't very careful. He relies too much on his "abilities." He has a God complex. Even when faced with mistake after mistake and glitch after glitch, he's stubborn.
This makes them naturally clash.
I don't know if Claire actually blames him for what happened with Alpha...but if anything else Alpha-ish happened, I think she would.
 
I have to say that even though the plot of the episode didn't interest me that much; the development of all of the characters was fantastic.

Some pretty good moment with Claire & Topher and their roll inside of the dollhouse as well as the side they "play" for, it seems to me that Claire is more and more fond to Echo somehow and many inside of the organization protect her in their own way. I particularly love the way that Boyd overprotects Echo (kinda reminds me to Giles sometime 🙂 ) and I particularly find Topher very very funny 😀

But what I loved the most about the epi was the end, how we get to see, as clear as the day, Echo's awakening!
 
TRUE BELIEVER

The good;
Pretty good story and some nice political campaigning from Adele. The start of Victor and Sierra's relationship is sweet and Topher's reaction to it hilarious. Also like the gag where Ballard asks Mellie to describe the guy who gave her the letter only for her to describe the mailman. Also love Echo/Esther hitting the cult leader with the candlestick.

The bad;
Rather odd that Boyd uses his real name when dealing with the ATF?

Best line;
Topher (on the phone, upon seeing Victor's 'man reaction' to naked Sierra) "I gotta go, somethings come up"
also like
Echo/Esther "God brought me here with a message. That message is MOVE YOUR ASS!"

Packing heat; Boyd/Dominic with an SMG. Oddly in an ep full of guns Echo never uses one
Echo;3
Boyd; 6
Dominic; 4
Sierra; 1

Kinky dinky;
Victor and Sierra, some impulses obviously stronger than brain wiping

Notches on the Dollhouse bedpost;
Echo; 2

How'd they get away with that?
Can't watch Echoes eye surgery, very Clockwork Orange. The cult leader has a penchant for underage girls.

This weeks fantasy;
Echo is a blind religious zealot

Total number personalitites;
Echo; 11
Sierra; 4
Victor; 1

Total dolls;3
Echo, Sierra and Victor

Addy is a bit British;

Topher is a bit geeky;
Prefers the term 'man reaction' to errection.

Subverting the Hollywood cliche

Bondage;
Sierra tied up; 1

Knocked out;
Echo by Dominic

Kills;
Sierra; 2 kills
Echo; 1

Dolls injured;
Echo roughed up and slapped around again

Capt subtext;

Happy hookers

Know the face?
5 Whedon alumni-Mark Shepherd, Amy Acker, walking action figure, Eliza Dushku, Jim Piddock

Guantanamo;
Big goverment kicking in the door and storming inside...to discover enough illegal weaponry to take Iwo Jima in the hands of those seeking the end of the world. Hard to know who's right or wrong?

Fanfic;

Missing scenes;
Very nice dinner scene on the deleted scenes, actually makes the cult members much more likeable.

Reminds me off;

Questions and observations;
Hard to know what to make of the rights and wrongs of this ep, the ATF agent plays a dirty trick although ultimately he's proven to 100% right and avoids another Waco. The irony that the cult members have sacrificed their free will much more by choice than the Dolls have (or have they?). The difference is that the cultists pose a threat to the outside with their arsenal whilst the Dollhouse doesn't...yet? Dominic shows his dislike of Echo whilst the affection developing between her and Adele also becomes evident
In many ways these eps remind me of early eps of Angel, that it was supposed to be an anthology show with the case of the week but eventually became more a story of Angel Investigations themselves with the cases as incidental. The problem is that with the Doll's wiped every week it's difficult for the characters to develop. Also whilst it's a slick series it lacks the humour and and joi de vive of Buffy and Angel (and even Firefly) it feels too sterile.
Marks out of 10; 7/10, again, enjoyed this more in the rewatch than I thought I would
 
"I gotta go, somethings come up" <----- Haha, I never thought of that. 😀 And I love "Move your ass" quote too.

I enjoyed this episode a lot. The cult leader guy was so scary when he crawls on the floor to Echo. I love his eyes. He played that weird Terminator in TSCC too.

It's good to see new location in Dollhouse. I mean, wow, a village.
 
MinwaraYana said:
"I gotta go, somethings come up" <----- Haha, I never thought of that. 😀 And I love "Move your ass" quote too.

I enjoyed this episode a lot. The cult leader guy was so scary when he crawls on the floor to Echo. I love his eyes. He played that weird Terminator in TSCC too.

It's good to see new location in Dollhouse. I mean, wow, a village.
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Which Terminator did he play?
 
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