Question About Season 5

[VisionGirl]

Was season 5 begun with the idea that it would be the last season of Buffy? When was the decision made to continue on another network? The WB treated The Gift as if it were the series finale. So, was the decision made between seasons 5 and 6 & was a surprise to Buffy fans, or did the WB just want to milk their last episode for all its worth?

 

[NL197]

It was always going to be Buffy dying at the end of the season, and the fallout from that would be season 6, but The WB didn't want to pay for the show's rising costs anymore and canceled it. It wasn't meant to be the end of the series, no. They played up the "series" finale angle a lot in the media, but Whedon and Co. shopped around for a new home and UPN, essentially The WB's rival network, jumped at the chance to get the show. Ultimately UPN lost money on it because the ratings weren't there, but they did give the show more money and more promotion than The WB did.

Still, Buffy was never a good fit for UPN. It was at its core, a WB show.

In a weird sort of retaliation, The WB implemented a ban on crossovers between Buffy and ANGEL, and made it clear that even though they had to address the issue of Buffy's death, the less said about the show which was no longer on the network, the better. That got lifted only because Buffy was ending and both shows needed each other one last time for the ANGEL season 4 / Buffy season 7 storylines.

 

[zobothehobo]

Well screw the WB. I was kind of pissed we didn't hear more about Buffy's death on Angel.

 

[NL197]

Well screw the WB. I was kind of pissed we didn't hear more about Buffy's death on Angel.

We didn't really need to, though. It wouldn't have done anyone any good to have that be a focus of the show for a while. Ultimately I think it worked in the show's favor that Buffy be kept out of the topic of conversation, because it gave the show the opportunity to finally emerge from being just "the Buffy spin-off", to its own strong, unique series on its own. Even if they weren't split apart on networks, it was still important that they split up, just like the characters themselves, in order to be independent of each other.

 

[VisionGirl]

It was always going to be Buffy dying at the end of the season, and the fallout from that would be season 6, but The WB didn't want to pay for the show's rising costs anymore and canceled it. It wasn't meant to be the end of the series, no. They played up the "series" finale angle a lot in the media, but Whedon and Co. shopped around for a new home and UPN, essentially The WB's rival network, jumped at the chance to get the show. Ultimately UPN lost money on it because the ratings weren't there, but they did give the show more money and more promotion than The WB did.

So, I just don't get how they were "allowed" to bill it as a series finale, when everyone (the network, show creators, fans), knew that it wasn't.

In a weird sort of retaliation, The WB implemented a ban on crossovers between Buffy and ANGEL, and made it clear that even though they had to address the issue of Buffy's death, the less said about the show which was no longer on the network, the better. That got lifted only because Buffy was ending and both shows needed each other one last time for the ANGEL season 4 / Buffy season 7 storylines.

Yeah, I did know about that. I'm with Zobo, that was stupid. I esp hate that there is this Angel/Buffy reunion in A season 3/B season 6 that we get to hear very little of, and see none of. I guess the WB didn't realize that seeing SMG on Angel would've boosted Angel's ratings that season?

Oh, well, at least we get those cool "Buffy Lives" promos out of the UPN.

 

[Chosen Enemy]

Oh, well, at least we get those cool "Buffy Lives" promos out of the UPN.

Oh, yeah! I loved those. Too bad they didn't invest as much with the final season, being the last season and all.... (not even promo pics, those fools!) I do remember that in the last episodes there were promos of "Goodbye to you", where they put the song from "Tabula Rasa", as in saying goodbye to Buffy forever. That was harsh for me, though, it made me cry even harder that the show ends.

 

[NL197]

So, I just don't get how they were "allowed" to bill it as a series finale, when everyone (the network, show creators, fans), knew that it wasn't.

Simple. It was the series finale for The WB. It didn't matter that another network was picking it up. It wasn't a case of them being allowed to do something or not - they're the network airing the show and they could do whatever they wanted to, and they did just that by canceling it.

Yeah, I did know about that. I'm with Zobo, that was stupid. I esp hate that there is this Angel/Buffy reunion in A season 3/B season 6 that we get to hear very little of, and see none of. I guess the WB didn't realize that seeing SMG on Angel would've boosted Angel's ratings that season?

You do realize that by saying (the part in bold) that you have completely ignored everything I said, right?

I wasn't just giving my own opinion on it either. Everything I said about the show needing to stand on its own, the lack of crossovers, and everything else came from what David Greenwalt (co-creator of the show), David Boreanaz and the other writers all said at the time in old print and on-the-set interviews, and a bit on the DVD extras. It was the right thing to do for ANGEL as a show to get out of Buffy's shadow. It wasn't stupid at all, and it definitely wasn't about boosting ratings, which have usually been the worst things for a lot of shows to do, just to try to appeal to a group of fans instead of doing what's right for the show, and the characters. It was right to move on.

---------- Post added at 03:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:35 PM ----------

Edited to add:

I always look at this issue in the larger, "bigger picture" sense, and not from the perspective of "but I like seeing Buffy and Angel together...." sense.

 

[VisionGirl]

I do get that (in the larger sense), but I can't help as a fan wanting to see more crossovers, and not necessarily just Buffy. I've enjoyed the crossovers with other characters just as much if not more (because yes, Buffy and Angel were moving on with their respective lives). But not to show the Bangel reunion after she's brought back?! Or at least talk about it more than one sentence?! I do love Cordy & Wes' version of Bangel though- probably better than the real thing LOL.

Oh, and while you think it was necessary in the larger sense (& I kind of agree), that certainly wasn't the network's motivation. It seemed that they disallowed crossovers simply out of spite, which I think is stupid.

---------- Post added at 06:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:43 PM ----------

Oh, yeah! I loved those. Too bad they didn't invest as much with the final season, being the last season and all.... (not even promo pics, those fools!) I do remember that in the last episodes there were promos of "Goodbye to you", where they put the song from "Tabula Rasa", as in saying goodbye to Buffy forever. That was harsh for me, though, it made me cry even harder that the show ends.

But did you know (if you were indeed watching it when it originally aired) that this was indeed NOT the end of Buffy? Or were you led to believe that it was?

 

[buffyprops]

I recalled that right about the time it aired we were all scratching our heads wondering if Buffy was coming back. Shortly after I saw an interview with Joss where they asked him if the show was returning and he said the show had moved to another network but that Buffy herself was
"rotting in the ground as we speak."
I want to say that Joss was just having fun with it but it was rather cryptic in a way...

I alway's heard too that Boreanaz was FURIOUS that SMG refused to appear in the Angel Finale' in Season Five as he had appeared in the Buffy Finale' upon request...

---------- Post added at 10:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:53 PM ----------

I doubt the reason SMG turned it down was that it didn't make sense.

The writers would have made it make sense but she just flat refused the offer...she had her own reason's for not wanting to portray Buffy again and as I've said elsewhere, I believe it had a lot to do with Marni Noxon.

 

[Zeppo]

I thought that she was supposed to be in episode 100, but couldn't because of scheduling but told them she was free to do the finale if they wanted to use her. But they wanted the show to end without Buffy being in it. They wanted it to be about Angel, not Buffy. At least, that's what I've always heard.