'Always Been A Loner...'

[thetopher]

This is how Faith describes herself in S7, as somebody who never really had any friends or buddy's or even close family. She also makes it sound like this is by choice.

I've also noticed how desperately friendly she is at the start of season 3, not just with Buffy but with Xander and Willow- specifically in 'Faith, Hope And Tricks', 'B&TB' and 'Homecoming' before the falling out in 'Revelations'. She really tries hard to make friends.

So which is it? Is Faith actually a badgirl loner-type or just lonely, a different type of loser/outcast to Buffy and co.
And if so, why doesn't anybody in the Scooby's actually realise that Faith just wants a hug and some pals to belong with?

 

[Blaze]

I think that Faith thinks shes a loner (the badgirl kind), but really she just wants to belong and she's lonely. She tries so hard to project that image of herself, but as soon as the Mayor takes her in, we see a whole different side of Faith. It's the same Faith we see surface from time to time, like in Who Are You when she sleeps with Riley, or at different times on Angel when we see her break down.

I agree with what you said, at the beginning, Faith was trying hard to fit in with the gang. I think Buffy might have realized that Faith wanted to fit in, or to have a friend, but she gave up on her too quick. I think Faith on her side still felt like an outcast because Buffy already had her crew, and Faith wasn't officially part of them. Willow didn't help the situation by disliking Faith so much. I think Faith felt like Buffy wasn't her true friend because her loyalty in the end really lied with her older friends and Angel.

 

[white avenger]

I think that this is part of Faith's fear of forming any sort of long term relationship, as demonstrated with her one night stands with both Xander and Wood, and however more men, we will almost certainly never know. On one side, Faith feared letting anyone get close, probably for fear of either losing them (witness her obvious grief over the loss of her original Watcher) or being rejected by them (possibly what Wood eventually did, though we don't actually know), while on the other side, she willingly gave her total devotion to Mayor Wilkins, a man who, by anyone's definition, was evil, a sociopath, and quite possibly as crazy as a bagful of monkeys, for no other reason, apparently, than that he did truly love her in his own fashion. Faith wants to be loved, appreciated, and considered a member of the team, but she has either lost people who she cared for, and had trouble handling the loss, or been rejected, rather than accepted by those whose friendship she truly desires.

Buffy and Faith should have been friends, comrades in arms, even, some might argue, lovers. They shared a bond and a legacy that chould have made them closer than the closest of friends, but circumstances, beginning with the untimely and totally accidental death of the Assistant Mayor prevented that from happening and culminating with her alliance with Mayor Wilkins and her attempt to turn Angel prevented that from ever happening, and probably always will in the future.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

I've also noticed how desperately friendly she is at the start of season 3, not just with Buffy but with Xander and Willow- specifically in 'Faith, Hope And Tricks', 'B&TB' and 'Homecoming' before the falling out in 'Revelations'. She really tries hard to make friends.

I never thought she was trying to make friends, except with Buffy maybe. I think she was just trying to impress these people that didn't know her and present herself in a better light. She was friendly, but I never thought she was trying to make friends.

 

[Aqua]

I'd describe Faith as having an independent streak rather than being a loner. She always seemed outgoing and charismatic, loners tend to be more quiet and reserved. I think she has a fear of trusting people because of bad experiences in the past, and that is why she feels alone. Like Buffy, I think she is someone who can both enjoy being around others and also likes spending time alone.

 

[bespangeled]

Faith is guarded for reasons we never really learn about. She learns who she can trust, and watches carefully

I took in a street kid when she was 15. Her mother was - as she called her - a psychotic crack whore. Her father raped her when she was nine. She live here for 7 years, then moved out with my younger daughter. I'm not saying Faith suffered this, but she had reasons to be this watchful. My youngest daughter - is now 27, and while she has changed a lot she will always have that guarded persona that you have to pass through to reach her. Angel, and later Wesley managed to make it past her walls.

Being guarded isn't about not wanting ties of affection - or always being a wild child. In fact, I think she's all three. She reminds me a lot of my kid

 

[Aud]

Yeah I think this depends on how you want to define the term "loner." With Faith, I always understood the word to refer more to her self-sufficiency rather than to some deficient ability to make friends. It's clear that Faith is charismatic and fully capable of getting into the good graces of specific people if she wants. But perhaps her unwillingness to let these friendships deepen beyond a surface-level acquaintance, and the self-awareness to realize she does this, is why she calls herself a loner.

why doesn't anybody in the Scooby's actually realise that Faith just wants a hug and some pals to belong with?

To be honest, I can't recall ever thinking of any of the core Scoobies as possessing any particularly insight into human nature (maybe Xander, because he "sees" things). Maybe part of it was because they were also growing up and figuring life out and just couldn't be bothered. Who knows. Core Scoobies aside, I always thought Tara and Angel were two of the most thoughtful and insightful secondary Scoobies ever. Tara was very intuitive and noticed things about people that others didn't, and Angel, perhaps because he was 2.5 centuries old (3.5 if you count his century in hell) seemed to really understand people (using this gift both to help people as Angel and to torment them as Angelus). It's probably why Angel seemed to come closest to understanding Faith in S3. None of the core members really seemed very concerned with understanding human behavior, or interested in getting to know what motivated the people/creatures they encountered to do the things they did. Maybe this is a more elaborate response to this portion of the question, but to me it helps explain why none of the Scoobies understood Faith, and why they couldn't really be bothered to try to understand her.

 

[thetopher]

Thanks for all the replies.
I agree that it's mainly Faith's trust issues that prevent her from getting close to people. With sexual encounters/romantic relationships I guess that hse's had so many bad experiences that she doen't even give them a chance to get close- she rejects them first. Which speaks to classic intimacy issues.

When it comes to friendships I think Faith gives everybody 'one chance' and then that's it. She's friendly enough with everybody to being with, then after 'Revelations' she cuts herself off from everybody (or Buffy, but then everybody else follows her lead). Then hse takes a big risk (for her) and gives Buffy a second chance in 'Amends', but she doesn't get close to anybody else. Because Buffy is another slayer Faith feels that she can share that bond with her.

Then 'Bad Girls' happens and Faith's trust issues flair up when Buffy (understandably) freaks. The Angel gets his 'one chance' to win her trust but Wesley barges in a ruins it.
After that there's no-one left that Faith feels that she can trust- so she goes to the enemy and offers her services. Then, ironically, it's the Mayor's lack of moral judgement that wins Faith over. Faith gives him her loyalty and he never lets her down, as she sees it.

Faith doesn't want to be a loner, but because of her distorted view of the world, she doesn't let that many people get close to her.

Sidenote: I would be sort of interested to know why she and Wood broke up after a while- I suspect from inferences in the comics that it was he who dumped her.

 

[Mr Trick]

I think that Buffy could have been more welcoming to Faith. But then I just think that she saw something cynical in her and felt like she was trying too hard to be cool and the certain of attention. Maybe it was just a case of two very different personalities clashing. Still she does make the effort later at least.

 

[Fuffy Baith]

With Faith I think she means loner in the sense that she feels alone and on her own. Cordelia in "Out of Mind, Out of Sight" talks about how she feels alone even though she's popular and surrounds herself with people. She does it because it's better than feeling alone by yourself. Faith can be friendly and make friends and socialize, with men at least, but that doesn't men that she doesn't feel alone or isn't lonely. She really does just need a hug, which she does get from Angel a few times. And that's when she changes, so maybe they should have hugged her earlier. lol. As far as Faith and Buffy goes, it was definitely her trust issues that partly got in the way, but Buffy also didn't help. She refused to talk about Angel with Faith, and this lack of opening up on Buffy's part is what makes Faith, not open up either. And then things just sort of spiral out of control after Bad Girls and she just doesn't know how to handle it.

 

[PassionBecoming]

My guess is that Faith was rejected and/or let down by so many people along her journey that she was trying to convince herself that she was a loner. She didn't want to "need" anyone because that just opens up opportunities for hurt and disappointment. When she got to Sunnydale she was probably feeling more friendly because here was this other girl who was in the same position she was, and hey, she has friends, family, and a life. Which she did want, even if she didn't want to admit it.

I never liked how easily the Scoobies just kind of brushed Faith off, even in the beginning. They could have done a bit better job assimilating her into the group. I think part of that was led by Buffy feeling like her turf was being invaded, and then of course Willow's jealousy. It really is too bad, because things could have ended up on a much happier note. (Of course, we wouldn't have all the fun evil S3/S4 stuff, though!)

 

[Mr Trick]

My guess is that Faith was rejected and/or let down by so many people along her journey that she was trying to convince herself that she was a loner. She didn't want to "need" anyone because that just opens up opportunities for hurt and disappointment. When she got to Sunnydale she was probably feeling more friendly because here was this other girl who was in the same position she was, and hey, she has friends, family, and a life. Which she did want, even if she didn't want to admit it.

I never liked how easily the Scoobies just kind of brushed Faith off, even in the beginning. They could have done a bit better job assimilating her into the group. I think part of that was led by Buffy feeling like her turf was being invaded, and then of course Willow's jealousy. It really is too bad, because things could have ended up on a much happier note. (Of course, we wouldn't have all the fun evil S3/S4 stuff, though!)

Think that is a little unfair on Willow. Thought most of her oppisistion towards Faith was out of loyality to Buffy. There was only really an issue when she found out about her sleeping with Xander.

 

[thetopher]

Think that is a little unfair on Willow. Thought most of her oppisistion towards Faith was out of loyality to Buffy. There was only really an issue when she found out about her sleeping with Xander.

Willow started resenting Faith all through 'Bad Girls' and into 'Consequences' long before any of the events surrounding Finch or finding out about Xander. That isn't being protective, that's being jealous. Jealous that your friend is spending time with somebody other than you.

Willow's pettiness towards Faith in 'Consequences' is evedent when she equates Faith 'using her people' with the slaying of Finch. She's the first to use the term 'murder' in relation to an accidental killing and also to say basically 'to hell with Faith', even when Buffy still wants to help the other slayer.

 

[PassionBecoming]

Think that is a little unfair on Willow. Thought most of her oppisistion towards Faith was out of loyality to Buffy. There was only really an issue when she found out about her sleeping with Xander.

Yes, I am with @thetopher and have to disagree with this. Willow was pretty hostile towards Faith almost from the very beginning. She could tell Xander was attracted to her (as he is to all Slayers, apparently) and thought she was invading her turf. She was very jealous, but didn't go much further than making snipping comments until later on.

 

[Mr Trick]

Yes, I am with @thetopher and have to disagree with this. Willow was pretty hostile towards Faith almost from the very beginning. She could tell Xander was attracted to her (as he is to all Slayers, apparently) and thought she was invading her turf. She was very jealous, but didn't go much further than making snipping comments until later on.

Fair enough on the first, but I don't know if I would say that Xander was attracted to Faith. Think it was just it was a fresh face on the scene for him to talk to and maybe their sense humors matched a little more. I know you can all rearch for the vomit bags now!😛

 

[RoxySilver]

I never really understood why the Scoobies couldn't try and welcome Faith in a better way. All they could see is the "competitive slayer" and not another human being.
But ultimately, I believe it is somehow Buffy's fault. After all, Xander and Willow were friends before Buffy moved to Sunnydale, and they welcomed her so easily, and upon discovering her secret, made her quite naturally the leader. Then Cordelia and Oz. And Giles. All were around Buffy and never even thought for a second that Faith could need someone because she was so good at pretending she was fine on her own. How could she trust them?

Also, this is one of the downfall of picking teenagers to save the world. Girls are petty per nature. Buffy was told how exceptional and unique she was repetitively. Faith came along, she wasn't the one and only Chose One anymore and little was took off between Faith and her. In my opinion.
But Faith could have been a great friend, one that needed attention and control, granted, but great friend. After all, she tells off Scott pretty efficiently Homecoming. She had Buffy's back, it could have worked.
I believe that the most insightful characters are not the Scoobies, nor even Giles, but Tara, Angel and Spike, and all of them could have understood Faith. But Faith turned bad before it happened.

 

[thetopher]

Fair enough on the first, but I don't know if I would say that Xander was attracted to Faith. Think it was just it was a fresh face on the scene for him to talk to and maybe their sense humors matched a little more. I know you can all rearch for the vomit bags now!😛

From their very first meeting:

XANDER: (regarding Faith's 'naked' slayer story) They should film that story and show it every Christmas.

Plus-
XANDER: (to Faith, interrupting) What was that about the alligator? You said something before --

FAITH: Oh, this big daddy vampire out of Missouri kept 'em as pets. He's got me rasslin' one of 'em, must of been twelve feet long --

XANDER: Now, was this also naked?

FAITH: (smiles) Well, the alligator was...

And Cordelia' sitting right there. Oh, yeah I think he was smitten...😀

 

[Mr Trick]

From their very first meeting:

XANDER: (regarding Faith's 'naked' slayer story) They should film that story and show it every Christmas.

Plus-
XANDER: (to Faith, interrupting) What was that about the alligator? You said something before --

FAITH: Oh, this big daddy vampire out of Missouri kept 'em as pets. He's got me rasslin' one of 'em, must of been twelve feet long --

XANDER: Now, was this also naked?

FAITH: (smiles) Well, the alligator was...

And Cordelia' sitting right there. Oh, yeah I think he was smitten...😀

That was a joke😀

Xander's an inmature young man they tend to joke about that kind of stuff. How if you took everything he said at face value then he would be one ****ed up dude😉 

I never really understood why the Scoobies couldn't try and welcome Faith in a better way. All they could see is the "competitive slayer" and not another human being.
But ultimately, I believe it is somehow Buffy's fault. After all, Xander and Willow were friends before Buffy moved to Sunnydale, and they welcomed her so easily, and upon discovering her secret, made her quite naturally the leader. Then Cordelia and Oz. And Giles. All were around Buffy and never even thought for a second that Faith could need someone because she was so good at pretending she was fine on her own. How could she trust them?

Also, this is one of the downfall of picking teenagers to save the world. Girls are petty per nature. Buffy was told how exceptional and unique she was repetitively. Faith came along, she wasn't the one and only Chose One anymore and little was took off between Faith and her. In my opinion.
But Faith could have been a great friend, one that needed attention and control, granted, but great friend. After all, she tells off Scott pretty efficiently Homecoming. She had Buffy's back, it could have worked.
I believe that the most insightful characters are not the Scoobies, nor even Giles, but Tara, Angel and Spike, and all of them could have understood Faith. But Faith turned bad before it happened.

Ok.... Did feminism skip your country?🙁

 

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

This is how Faith describes herself in S7, as somebody who never really had any friends or buddy's or even close family. She also makes it sound like this is by choice.

I've also noticed how desperately friendly she is at the start of season 3, not just with Buffy but with Xander and Willow- specifically in 'Faith, Hope And Tricks', 'B&TB' and 'Homecoming' before the falling out in 'Revelations'. She really tries hard to make friends.

So which is it? Is Faith actually a badgirl loner-type or just lonely, a different type of loser/outcast to Buffy and co.
And if so, why doesn't anybody in the Scooby's actually realise that Faith just wants a hug and some pals to belong with?

Faith is a complicated character. She is afraid of intimacy (maybe not now, but definitely at that point) so she pulls away from people who could potentially hurt her. Her "toughness" is just a defense mechanism to prevent her from getting close to people. I don't think her loner comment was insinuating it was by choice. I get the feeling that as a slayer, always having to move around, and not being encouraged to have friends and with no family it just happened naturally, meaning she was alone a lot and just got used to it. Also, Faith was really dedicated to her slaying, and I imagine she was always out doing that and training. When her Watcher died, and she was sent to Sunnydale, maybe she thought of it as a new beginning, and wanted to make friends. Also, at that point, it's worth noting that Faith was quite manipulative - it's possible she was trying so hard to be friends because she thought it would benefit her in some way, rather than a genuine desire to get to know the gang. We don't see her trying to make friends with anyone else except for the Scoobies, do we? And her only interactions with men are fleeting at best. Like I said, Faith is complicated, and I think she is a bit of both of those types you described. Just my two cents.

 

[thetopher]

That was a joke😀

Xander's an inmature young man they tend to joke about that kind of stuff. How if you took everything he said at face value then he would be one ****ed up dude😉

Indeed it was a joke, but Xander only jokes to relieve tension in a situation, whether it's fear/horror, social awkwardness/embarrasment or (as in this case) attraction. Humour is often used to illustrate actual characteisation on the show.

Also, if you watch the scene Xander's certainly getting very 'dreamy-eyed' looking at Faith, until Cordelia tells him to 'find a new theme'.
I see real attraction on his part (not so much with Oz) and genuine interest. That's the appeal of Faith in this episode:

Later on, when he and Willow have given Faith the tour:

XANDER: She's got something, doesn't she?

Also there's the fact that they don't spend that much time together after this episode until 'The Zeppo', and then suddenly Xander is 'very up' for whatever Faith wants. 😀
Where does that attraction come from if not from their initial encounter?