Angel's Power trip???

[LostBeloved]

Angel keeps going through these things with his friends and he keep erasing their memories. What give him the right to do this? Why can he have all these memories that he takes away from others? Is this a power trip that hes on? Is it fair?

 

[Steven123]

Because in the scenario's that he has done it, he's ultimately done it to benefit someone else.

In IWRY, he did it because he knew that ultimately, if he had stayed human, Buffy,or he would more than likely have been killed, and while there is obviously a chance this could happen at any time, the chances are fewer and far between if he wasn't human. And not only would Buffy have to deal with all of the Demons etc by herself, with pretty much no help in terms of physical strength etc if she needed help in a fight, she would have to protect herself,her family,her friends, and Angel. And if anything happened to Angel as a human, she would hold herself responsible since she viewed it as her job to protect him.

Plus Angel was the one that had to live with the memories of he and Buffy being back together,and not only that, being able to have a normal relationship with her. With Buffy loseing her memory of the events, she can still hold out hope that some day it can happen, rather than be destroyed by it.


It's pretty much the same sort of question as, would you kill a million people, to save the life of someone you loved more than anything in the world.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

I assume you mean from the end of season 4? If you mean from season 1, that wasn't really a memory erase, just turning back time. Which was unfair, but it's not like the memory wipe was the goal.

Because while I think it was a misstake, to have a evil corporation that messes up a lot to try to fix everyone, I think it was either to a)make it easier for them to live without Jasmine, b)to make sure less people know about Connor, or c( both of the above. But not a power trip. Angel probably thought it was the best thing to do.

I think it was dumb. Magic is risky, and he also had no right. Connor he had to fix, there was no getting around it, but he didn't need to do it to his friends or connor's new family. He could have been a happy orphan. And making him not like older women? That's so dumb. It's not like he fell for 100 year olds, just one woman who was a few years older.

 

[Steven123]

A few years could have turned into a lot more....lol

Not that there's anything wrong with women in their 100's. lol.

 

[cordangel]

In "I Will Remember You" Angel neither erased Buffy's memories nor asked for that.
The Oracles turned the time back and declared only Angel would carry the memory of that day.

 

[white avenger]

Angel keeps going through these things with his friends and he keep erasing their memories. What give him the right to do this? Why can he have all these memories that he takes away from others? Is this a power trip that hes on? Is it fair?

What it comes down to is that Angel honestly believes that he has the right to make decisions affecting the lives of others without getting their permission or even informing them of what has happened. If any other member of the cast were to try the same thing, there would never be any doubt that what they were doing was wrong and would lead to at the very least, personal heartbreak and disaster. Willow, Giles, and Wes have all, at one time or another been guilty of this. But we must never lose track of one very important and undeniable truth: the name of the show is "Angel," which means that he can do pretty much whatever he wants to, whenever he pleases, and there will always be some "Get Out Of Jail Free" clause that will make anything that he does right and an act of heroic self sacrifice.

In other words, he may not always be right, but he will always be the star of the show, and the star of the show can never be wrong. Makes perfect sense if you look at it that way.

 

[VisionGirl]

What it comes down to is that Angel honestly believes that he has the right to make decisions affecting the lives of others without getting their permission or even informing them of what has happened. If any other member of the cast were to try the same thing, there would never be any doubt that what they were doing was wrong and would lead to at the very least, personal heartbreak and disaster. Willow, Giles, and Wes have all, at one time or another been guilty of this. But we must never lose track of one very important and undeniable truth: the name of the show is "Angel," which means that he can do pretty much whatever he wants to, whenever he pleases, and there will always be some "Get Out Of Jail Free" clause that will make anything that he does right and an act of heroic self sacrifice.

In other words, he may not always be right, but he will always be the star of the show, and the star of the show can never be wrong. Makes perfect sense if you look at it that way.

I disagree. Angel is one of my favorite Buffyverse characters, but it's not because he is never wrong IMO. First of all, things are more complex than that on these shows. Secondly, I love him because he keeps trying in spite of his failings, the big dumb sexy oaf! Not you, WA. 😉

 

[Skytteflickan88]

[MENTION=6758]white avenger[/MENTION]

I meant "Skytteflickan88 agrees: That's taking it a bit far. Angel is often held responsible for his missdeads, and other characters have also done wrong and been held responsible for it."

 

[LostBeloved]

How would Angel feel if Buffy were to erase his memories of his family or having a soul so that he wouldnt feel pain? We (as people in real life and in Buffy/Angel) go through things and we have to grow and learn from them. Robbing someone of their memories is taking away something very sacred and valuable from them. I love Angel to death (proven fact, I named my son Angel) but he has to stop making decisions that affect everyones lives, because by being "self sacrificing" he is also in fact harming them by robbing them of those experiences.

 

[white avenger]

[MENTION=6758]white avenger[/MENTION]

Angel is often held responsible for his missdeads, and other characters have also done wrong and been held responsible for it."

Angel may own up to the fact that what he did, though for the "greater good" disregarded the free will of others, but he has never actually been held responsible or penalized for anything. And, before everyone jumps to Angel's defense, most of the other characters get cut the same amount of slack. Even when someone's actions, or lack of actions, has cost the lives of others, the only one to actually pay any kind of penalty for their actions has been Faith, and even she didn't have to either serve her entire sentence or turn herself back in after Season 7.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

[MENTION=6758]white avenger[/MENTION]

I still don't get what you mean when you say he's held less responsible than other characters. I mean, he won't go to prison and be held responsible that way, (I more meant if he's faced by the people he wronged or his friends), and sometimes he commits big time duchebaggery and no one says anything, but he's often called on it by his friends. So is it really more often he gets away with anything than the other characters?

 

[white avenger]

[MENTION=6758]white avenger[/MENTION]

I still don't get what you mean when you say he's held less responsible than other characters. I mean, he won't go to prison and be held responsible that way, (I more meant if he's faced by the people he wronged or his friends), and sometimes he commits big time duchebaggery and no one says anything, but he's often called on it by his friends. So is it really more often he gets away with anything than the other characters?

I meant this:

"And, before everyone jumps to Angel's defense, most of the other characters get cut the same amount of slack. Even when someone's actions, or lack of actions, has cost the lives of others, the only one to actually pay any kind of penalty for their actions has been Faith, and even she didn't have to either serve her entire sentence or turn herself back in after Season 7."

from my original statement.

Angel doesn't get away with a whole lot, if any, more than anyone else, they ALL seem to have a Joss-issued "Get Out Of Jail Free" card that keeps them from having to pay any penalty for whatever their wrong doings are and how much damage that might have been brought about because of it. It's just Angel is the title character and center focus of his series, so it becomes more obvious when he screws up and pretty much gets away with it.

Being told, "Angel (Willow, Xander, Wes, Giles, Buffy, Spike) you screwed up back there," and answering, "Yeah, I see that now, but I'm gonna really try to do better from here on out," may work the first or second offense, but after awhile, it gets kinda old. Joss just uses the "forgive and forget" thing way too often for my taste.

 

[Skytteflickan88]

Angel doesn't get away with a whole lot, if any, more than anyone else, they ALL seem to have a Joss-issued "Get Out Of Jail Free" card that keeps them from having to pay any penalty for whatever their wrong doings are and how much damage that might have been brought about because of it. It's just Angel is the title character and center focus of his series, so it becomes more obvious when he screws up and pretty much gets away with it.

That's not really how I read your first post where you wrote:

If any other member of the cast were to try the same thing, there would never be any doubt that what they were doing was wrong and would lead to at the very least, personal heartbreak and disaster.

Seemed like you were annoyed that Angel got off more easy. Did I misunderstand?

 

[BuffyElevated]

"I Will Remember You" was not Angel's idea... The Oracles chose to take back the day and erase Buffy's memory of it.
However, in Season 4 of "Angel", I think Angel acted a bit rashly. It wasn't fair for him to make the decision to wipe everyone's memories to sort of choose what they did and did not remember about all their pasts.