Anti-gay reference in Angel??? (5x20)

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Raine

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Wow, it's hard to believe Angel would be anti anything, except for stuff like terrorism. I get to school today and one of my friends pulls me aside to go on about how she got so upset near the end of the episode, stating that it was "anti-gay". Let's see why...

It was made pretty clear on Buffy that Andrew was gay. It was never said but was hinted at to the extreme!! At the end of "The Girl in Question", Andrew gives Spike and Angel a speech on how people change, move on, and whatever... He's implying that he has changed for the better when he comes out all slick and cool in his tux. Afterwards he goes to open the door to greet his two extremely attractive female dates. The scene was boldly stating that Andrew has changed for the better, going from "gay" to "straight".

I'm not sure whether or not to agree with my friend, but she does bring up good points...
 
I don't think that they meant that Andrew going from gay to straight was changing for the better. I think they meant Andrew going from nerdy to suave was changing for the better.
 
slayerpower said:
I think they meant Andrew going from nerdy to suave was changing for the better.
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That's exactly what I thought at first. But as Tracy (my friends name) kept going on and on about this, I started to see her point.
 
It wasnt anti-gay, they never said that Andrew was gay so we cant say that he went from gay to straight. Their are males out their who act very feminine(sp) and are not gay, Andrew may be one of them. And the females didnt make that bold of a statement, it just showed how much Andrew has changed from his S7 Buffy years from Nerd to somewhat of a hero/man.
 
Primal Slayer said:
It wasnt anti-gay, they never said that Andrew was gay so we cant say that he went from gay to straight.
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I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. True they never said that he was gay but there were so many instances in the show where it was more than obvious. Scenes that come to mind are when Andrew is mouthing Anya's dialogue as he's watching the video he recoreded of Xander and Anya expressing their love (I can't remember exactly what Anya and Xander were talking about, but it was definetly about their feelings for one another). Also, I think it was in "Two to Go", Andrew let's slip that Warren lied to him saying that he loved him. But he stops himself before fully finishing the sentence.
 
Bisexual anyone?

And also, this episode was laden with gay innuendos, Darla and Dru bathing together, Angel hugging Spike (in a way) and a whole load of Spangleness.

Andews' things change thing just meant he had changed, Buffy had changed and so should Spike and Angel. For all we know they could be Andrews fag hags.
 
slayerpower said:
I don't think that they meant that Andrew going from gay to straight was changing for the better. I think they meant Andrew going from nerdy to suave was changing for the better.
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This is the impression I got...and even though many of you believe that Andrew was gay (I did too)...they never outright said it, so you can't really say that he was...
 
I never thought Andrew was gay. He does tend to hero worship though. He idolized Warren and later Xander and his world did tend to focus around them. For all the indications that he might be gay there were also ones indicating he was straight.

I mean common folks if Joss was "anti-gay" would he of had Willow and Kennedy get together in the last season instead of Willow and a guy? Stop reading into stuff further then it needs to be.
 
He could be camp. You know Lawrence Llewlyn Bowen (Americans probably wont but Brits might) he acts like he's gay but in fact he has a wife and two kids.
 
Hahahah oh my hell. Andrew was NOT gay, nor did they EVER hint to that. He is a nerd. A wimpy nerd. That's what they threw at us. There was in no way, any anti-gay messages in the end of that episode. His "changing for the better" was going from evil geek to hero suave.
 
AshSan said:
Bisexual anyone?

And also, this episode was laden with gay innuendos, Darla and Dru bathing together, Angel hugging Spike (in a way) and a whole load of Spangleness.
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Very good point indeed. And its for that reason that I can't see why people can see this episode and think that its anti gay.

Yes it was hinted at in the past that Andrew was in love with Warren and his reaction towards Spike in Angel gave the impression that he may have liked him to. But its simply open to people's interpretations.
 
I certainly didn't think it was anti-gay..I agree that Andrew changed into someone more dependand,but I guess people can interpret this the way they want to
 
I only read the first post cuz I'm at school and I cna't lose time,dunno what you guys said...Well,I'l say one word: SPANGEL!...Well,not just one word,lol😛...maybe they didn't show Angelus and Spike kissing each other but thre was so much subtext!...anti-gay?,gosh,not at all!😛...Make 'er watch Destiny😀
 
I don't believe it for a second. That was not the implied meaning at all. It was just showing how Andrew the super geek changed into a slick cool guy. Gay to straight?? Not at all!
 
slayerpower said:
I don't think that they meant that Andrew going from gay to straight was changing for the better. I think they meant Andrew going from nerdy to suave was changing for the better.
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I completely agree. I have faith in the writers of Angel and I'm sure that they would never intentionally make such an anti-gay statement as your friend suggests.
 
I do see what you mean, but it being anti-gay, but I really think they meant him going from all "geeky" to being a cool and suave.
 
AshSan said:
Bisexual anyone?

And also, this episode was laden with gay innuendos, Darla and Dru bathing together, Angel hugging Spike (in a way) and a whole load of Spangleness.

Andews' things change thing just meant he had changed, Buffy had changed and so should Spike and Angel. For all we know they could be Andrews fag hags.
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sweet, lol

i never really thought that andrew was gay... i just thought he was soft... i have a friend that acts just like him, but he is as straight as all out doors. he just has 7 sisters, and he acts like them a lil!

i thought just as others have stated that it was a statement about change. because as we all know, andrew is 80% more manly LOL
 
Joe said:
I think it was more a lack of continuity. They completely forgot what he had been before.

I really didn't like this episode.
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Its deffinatly not a lack of continuity, Andrew said in Damage that he was like 40% more manly now, he has grown up from the nerd he was on Buffy, like how Willow went from nerd to super witch.
 
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