Are vampires more fragile than humans?

nightshade

nightshade

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Given the different ways vampires have been staked are they more fragile than humans?

Non slayers have been able to stake them right from the beginning of Buffy, Buffy herself has staked one with a pencil before and we've seen vampires die by falling on stakes. Surely it can't be that easy to push wood through a chest in order to put a stake into the heart?
 
nightshade said:
push wood through a chest in order to put a stake into the heart?
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Thats a misconception it seems as Buffy have staked a lot of vampires in the stomach. When the series first started they stayed in the chest area, but they got lazy.. towards season four or so, she could just as easily stab them in the gut and they would turn to dust as well.

But, to answer your question. It depends on how they died. If it were a modern death, to which an autopsy was preformed, it would stand to reason that perhaps they would be more 'fragile' as the ribcage has already been sawed open, therefor easier to stake, as it is more or less, reopening and old wound.
 
Mr. Pole said:
...it would stand to reason that perhaps they would be more 'fragile' as the ribcage has already been sawed open, therefor easier to stake, as it is more or less, reopening and old wound.
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But don't vampires, similar to the slayer, heal/regenerate quickly? After a short time any old wounds from the corpse would be healed for a vampire.

My answer to the OP would be that, in general, vampires are much more tough and resilient than humans. They have weaknesses (e.g. cut off head, set afire, or stake through heart) but any of these things would kill a normal human just as easily, so I can't agree that vampires are more fragile. Ocassionally we see vamps get dusted with a pencil or something, but I try not to think too hard about those things or take the show too seriously when I see them. Does the show strain believability sometimes, even in the fantasy context of the show? Absolutely. Is the show sometimes inconsistent with certain things? Yes. But the people responsible for the show don't take themselves too seriously, so neither should we.
 
AnthonyCordova said:
But don't vampires, similar to the slayer, heal/regenerate quickly? After a short time any old wounds from the corpse would be healed for a vampire.
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As a vampire yes, but there is nothing to indicate vampirism healed prior human wounds, which is what that would have been.
 
maybe then you're right. When you start speculating about autopsy wounds and whether they heal or not and the vampire being weaker as a result...you're talking about things I doubt the creator/writers worked out themselves and probably didn't care to work out, because after all it is just a show and you have to stop somewhere. Total consistency and complete explanations for everything are impossible, and besides that, only complete pedants demand or expect that. That stuff isn't important really.

I don't think you're being pedantic at all @Mr. Pole, I just like offering that reminder to other readers sometimes. I guess my response to you then is that, you could very well be right, because we were never given an answer with regard to that, at least not to the best of my knowledge. But there is no way to really prove it one way or the other either, so the discussion on this issue kind of ends there.
 
I don't believe that all the turned vampires had autopsies or funerals, for example we know that Jesse wouldn't have and he just fell into Xander's stake
 
I would contend that must be a mystical reason as to why stakes work with vampires. For most part, I'd imagine that vampires are more resilient than humans, but there is something about wood and vampires that go together like a knife through hot butter.


Happy holidays everybody.
 
I wouldn't say that vampires are more fragile than humans because of beheading, staking, and such; but they are in a sense more fragile. When I try to put myself in the mind of a vampire, I always fear death more than I would if I put myself in the mind of a human character of the show. I think of vampires as fearful of death because they have already cheated death once - by becoming a vampire. Although vampires are immortal, it's because of that fact that they seem more susceptible to death. Vampires are humans that have cheated death and become immortal, yet what comes after immortality: non-existence.
Vampires are not portrayed in the verse to fear death, but I were a vampire living in the verse, I personally would. I mean there is a chosen one constantly killing vampires after all; I'd be a little fearful of that.
 
I don't think they are more fragile. Honestly, I think if you were to try to stab someone with a sharp stick, it'd be pretty dam easy. I've impaled myself on a broken piece of ceramic bowl when I was younger, just by falling on it from about 2ft (freak accident really), and it went through my arm like a sharp knife goes through butter. Not sure about going through bones though... but again human force can easily break bones.
 
Vampires would actually be considered more durable than humans, with the exception of a few specific things, those things being holy artifacts and the sun. Beyond that, as has been noted, a stake through the heart, beheading, and being burned completely to ashes, are just as lethal to humans as they are to vampires. Beyond that, they don't age, they can potentially live forever, they heal at a far more rapid rate than mortals, they are apparently immune to any disease, and they have what borders on superhuman strength, speed, and senses. That doesn't seem very fragile to me.

As for vampires most fearing death, well, most humans do, too. The main differences, I would think, is that humans have the option of believing in religious Salvation and a happy afterlife, whereas vampires, for all we know, having no souls, cannot achieve that state of Grace. That does bring up the cases of Angel and Spike, however. Having regained their souls, would they now be able to achieve Grace and earn a Heavenly reward for their deeds after being ensouled?
 
nightshade said:
I don't believe that all the turned vampires had autopsies or funerals, for example we know that Jesse wouldn't have and he just fell into Xander's stake
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I tend to agree. Given the age of some vampires, the possibility of any postmortem testing would be minimal. If staking them is simple - even the master was staked - then I would assume there is something about the rib cage that changes after turning making the area more fragile. I do agree with Anthony that all of the things that can kill vamps would also kill humans, except for sunlight. Far from being more fragile, I tend to see them as less fragile. The have speed, quick healing, and a unique ability to kill humans by feeding off them. 
I can't see waiting until roughly 2000 AD for the objects listed to take effect. The mathematics alone would eliminate humans, or reduce them to small groups in hiding.

Of course, the same applies to non-Christian countries, a problem that has always annoyed me. Would a star of David, a Ganesh, or a crescent moon with star have the same effect as a cross? If not, most of the world is in deep doo-doo.
 
bespangeled said:
Of course, the same applies to non-Christian countries, a problem that has always annoyed me. Would a star of David, a Ganesh, or a crescent moon with star have the same effect as a cross? If not, most of the world is in deep doo-doo.
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In the novel "Seal Team 13," (which I highly recommend, by the way) it is explained that it isn't the Christian Crucifix that repels vampires, it's the cross, itself, which is an ancient symbol for the sun.

Another explanation that I have read, though I can't find a source at the moment, is that Judas was actually the first vampire, and the cross, as a symbol of his betrayal of Christ, as well as silver, from the 30 pieces of silver that was his bribe for doing so, are deadly to vampires.

Neither of those would be considered canon in the Buffyverse, where Joss pretty much takes whatever vampire/demon lore he wants to use and ignores the rest, and, as far as we know, silver has no more effect on vampires than any other metal, and it could be argued that vampires far predate Judas (another legend is that Adam's first wife, Lilith, was expelled from Eden and was the mother of all vampires and demons on Earth) but I just thought that it would be worth mentioning.
 
white avenger said:
In the novel "Seal Team 13," (which I highly recommend, by the way) it is explained that it isn't the Christian Crucifix that repels vampires, it's the cross, itself, which is an ancient symbol for the sun.

Another explanation that I have read, though I can't find a source at the moment, is that Judas was actually the first vampire, and the cross, as a symbol of his betrayal of Christ, as well as silver, from the 30 pieces of silver that was his bribe for doing so, are deadly to vampires.

Neither of those would be considered canon in the Buffyverse, where Joss pretty much takes whatever vampire/demon lore he wants to use and ignores the rest, and, as far as we know, silver has no more effect on vampires than any other metal, and it could be argued that vampires far predate Judas (another legend is that Adam's first wife, Lilith, was expelled from Eden and was the mother of all vampires and demons on Earth) but I just thought that it would be worth mentioning.
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Good info! Lilith was divorced/banished because she refused to be subordinate to Adam - or as is frequently interpreted, refused to be on the bottom during sex. The Chritian church had such a stake in devaluing women, and destroying/ incorporating pagan rituals! Did you know there was a Germanic goddess named Eostre whose symbols were colored eggs and hares?And suddenly the easter bunny makes sense. 🙄

Like you, I love religious history!
 
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