Question Are Vampires sired that descended from The Master inherently stronger than others?

A

Angelus Domini

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Darla, Angel, Drusilla, and Spike were all descended from The Master. Luke, assumable, was too.

The Master > Darla > Angel> Drusilla, Penn, & Sam Lawson

Drusilla > Spike > Holden Webster

Wishverse The Master > Wishverse Xander & Willow


Notice how all these Vampires that were descended from The Master were stronger than most vampires.

I made a former thread, that maybe it's the age, as with advanced age, vampires get stronger. Yet Lyle and Tector Gorch, which are almost the same age as Spike (100+ years) were significantly weaker compared to him. Even Wishverse Xander and Willow are stronger than the Gorches. James and Elizabeth were almost the same age as Angel as well. Yet they were easily killed and didn't seem to be strong for their age. Same case for the even older Prince of Lies and Nostroyev.

The only exception is Kakistos, who seem to be quite strong due to old age. Strangely though, Prince of Lies seem to be quite old as well but doesn't seem to be as strong as Kakistos.

So, to sum it all up, does the power of the vampire that sired you, a factor in turning you into an inherently stronger vampire compared to others?

Your thoughts?
 
M
Ms.Trick
Good points!
That's an interesting question. Initially I would say probably not but then, glancing at your helpful list above... it does actually logically speaking make sense.

Perhaps his 'aged' blood does leave trail in his descendants....

I suppose more factors could be added (not only plot convenience) but things like who they were as people, how skilled or cunning they were etc etc... but on a rudimentary level I'd say that yes, it appears that his blood held some benefits for those sire by him.
 
Kana
Kana
I think the individual strengths of the vampire could be a factor too
I think so, yes, the ones that have the Master's blood in them are stronger than normal vampires.

About the Prince of Lies. Maybe he was an old man when he was turned, so even has a vampire he wasn't all powerful.
 
Something I want to add to the discussion:

Penn was a strong vampire. Extremely fast. He beat a room full of Police men (and women).

Sam Lawson was able to capture (tie up and gag) Wesley, Gunn, Fred, and Lorne. Gunn and Wesley are skilled fighters, yet he captured them. Also, safe to assume, he beat the W&H security guards.

Both were sired by Angel, a descendant of The Master.

Also, Spike sired a couple more people when he was under The First Evil's control. And I think Spike (or was it Angel?) who sired a schoolmate of Buffy's back then. She was easily taken care of though... but maybe because she was almost instantly staked when she woke up.

As for the other people that Spike sired during season 7... they seemed to be quite regular though. Maybe because they haven't fed yet? Or was just fresh from the ground?

Or probably because they were too far down the descent line?
 
Angelus Domini said:
Sam Lawson was able to capture (tie up and gag) Wesley, Gunn, Fred, and Lorne. Gunn and Wesley are skilled fighters, yet he captured them. Also, safe to assume, he beat the W&H security guards.
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I'm more interested there whether or not having a soul affects the siring? To me logic would say no but the episode certainly suggests so.

Angelus Domini said:
And I think Spike (or was it Angel?) who sired a schoolmate of Buffy's back then. She was easily taken care of though... but maybe because she was almost instantly staked when she woke up.
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Angel sired Teresa during s2 and yes she was dusted pretty fast, she did get the better of Buffy for a bit though and was dusted by Xander.


As for the other people that Spike sired during season 7... they seemed to be quite regular though. Maybe because they haven't fed yet? Or was just fresh from the ground?

Or probably because they were too far down the descent line?
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The last line sounds probably to me. With each vampire sired you go one line/"generation" down from the Master and if his blood does have something 'special' in it then it's likely to get diluted with each step away from his direct lineage that you go.

So if say, Holden Webster would've sired a vampire it would have most likely been more or less an average run of the mill vampire no matter if it's vampiric heritage traced back to the Master.
 
Interesting points.

Though, Angel said something like "I don't think it works that way" to Sam when he asked about being sired from someone with a soul.
 
Maybe it's the whole Aurelian thing? Not sure if they really explained the vampire families, but I think being an Aurelian is supposed to be significant. It is in a lot of fics anyway, LOL.
 
I think it all depends on how smart they were. I mean, the master made the Annointed One, but in my opinion. He was a little wimp. I think Angel, Darla, Drusilla, and Spike were all stronger because they were around the master and each other and stuff. Not that it made them stronger, just smarter. I don't know if this is coming out right... Plus, Dru wasn't really that strong. She got weak from a mob in Prauge... She had Spike to brin gher back. When Spike got hurt. He had Dru and Angelus(well, sort of). If you get what I mean...
 
prophecygrrl said:
Maybe it's the whole Aurelian thing? Not sure if they really explained the vampire families, but I think being an Aurelian is supposed to be significant. It is in a lot of fics anyway, LOL.
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Hmmm... but aren't Auerlians just followers of The Master? Or are they all descendants from him?

Tillow4ever said:
I think it all depends on how smart they were. I mean, the master made the Annointed One, but in my opinion. He was a little wimp. I think Angel, Darla, Drusilla, and Spike were all stronger because they were around the master and each other and stuff. Not that it made them stronger, just smarter. I don't know if this is coming out right... Plus, Dru wasn't really that strong. She got weak from a mob in Prauge... She had Spike to brin gher back. When Spike got hurt. He had Dru and Angelus(well, sort of). If you get what I mean...
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Well, the Anointed One was really small compared to Spike. Since both were vampires, and descendants of The Master, size will be a factor. Sure, the Anointed One could beat up a macho human but Spike is an 100+ year old vampire.

Besides, Dru seemed to rely on her Psychic abilities more than her physical. Though, I assume her physical strength would be stronger than regular vampires.
 
I don't know if it's the actual siring...or the fact that when the Master sires someone, he hand-chooses them and therefore, feels a special bond with them. He nurtures their demon, personally trains them, and this is what makes his descendants strong. These vampires then sire others, train them (or they learn by observation) and so on and so forth. It's a bit of a nurture vs. nature question, isn't it?
 
Angelus Domini said:
But Sam Lawson was never trained by Angel. Though, he did have military training.
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But was he really all that strong? Penn when he was around seemed pretty strong even by vamp standards but Sam? I'm not sure... he got the drop on Fred, Wes and Gunn but I suppose that could be added up to luck or skill in extraordinary sneakiness or cleverness.

Was he all that equal on the touch of superior to Angel when they fought? (refresh my memory, I haven't seen the episode in a while.)
 
Well, no, it was a mismatch between him and Angel. Angel pawned him quick. But Angel is 200+ vamp years older than Sam. Sam is only about 50+ vamp years.

But still, Fred and Gunn would be pretty difficult to restrain (not kill). He had to tie them up, not kill them. Not to mention, the W&H security guards that had wooden stakes.
 
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