As You Were...thoughts on Mrs. Finn?

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it was good to see Agent Finn again, finally got a proper closure scene with him and Buffy. Really liked Sam, a strong woman in her own right.

Better suited for Riley.

Hot as Spuffy are, ending it was the right thing for Buffy to do. All the things Riley said were exactly what she needed to hear.


pretty good episode overall.
 
I like the episode. And I like Sam. Strangely enough As You Were was the only time I truly liked Riley. Must be the scar.

Again, I think the audience needed a reminder that Spike wasn't good. He does evil buisness, and we forget it because we don't see him doing evil deeds.
 
F
Fake Shemp
/me agrees spike is bad oh so bad (sw)
I also like the episode and I was very sorry for Buffy, because everything in her life just seems to be broked and doesn't work. First Riley appeared when she worked in a fast food restaurant and then she found out that he is married. All in all a very horrible and sad situation for her. And besides his wife is very nice, and they just fit together which is good for them but not for buffy
 
I adored Sam. I thought she was beautiful, strong, understanding and wise. What happened was for the best IMO. It gave Buffy the wake up call she needed.
 
I really liked this episode. I think it helped to justify Riley as a character. And I think it showed that Riley needed to be with someone who was mature and knew herself, which is exactly what Sam was.

And like everyone else has said, it took someone who was once close to Buffy to give her a few home truths!
 
R
Rayne
[No message]
I really liked this episode. I think it helped to justify Riley as a character. And I think it showed that Riley needed to be with someone who was mature and knew herself, which is exactly what Sam was.

And like everyone else has said, it took someone who was once close to Buffy to give her a few home truths!



Plus Sam didn't get Riley by default or him settling.

He worked thru the pain and moved on.

Buffy was his 1st love and will always have a place in his heart. But he's IN L0VE with Sam.
 
Flannen
Flannen
[No message]
I really liked this episode. I think it helped to justify Riley as a character. And I think it showed that Riley needed to be with someone who was mature and knew herself, which is exactly what Sam was.

And like everyone else has said, it took someone who was once close to Buffy to give her a few home truths!

I completely agree. As much as I really liked Riley and rooted for him and Buffy to be together, this episode showed that Riley followed the right path for him, and it kinda kicked Buffy in the ass and let her know she had to move on with her life and be a grown up.
 
Flannen
Flannen
[No message]
I can honestly not tell from this epsiode if Riley should be with Buffy or Sam.

For all I know, if Buffy had caught up with Riley before he left in season 5, they would still be together. You know, if Buffy got more time to be his girlfriend(not leaving him out of stuff) and he didn't "cheat" again.

I'm happy that Buffy got some Riley-closure, but I think things are still unresolved. Hopefully they'll be resolved in Season 8.

I'm also happy that we, and Buffy, got a reminder that even tough Spike is in love with Buffy and willing to be relatively nice for her, he is still Spike, William the bloody, the slayer of slayer, murderer, torture-fan, probably a rapist and as it turns out, really bad at doing business(since the merchandise was hatching).
 
I didn't like her. I didn't trust her. Anyone that sweet and friendly to the woman who, supposedly, less than a year before broke her new husband's heart and caused him to seek solace in the arms of blood sucking ladies of easy virtue, HAS to have a hidden agenda. Far more likely, Riley found out about what was going on between Buffy and Spike, cooked up some sort of set up designed to destroy all the trust that Buffy had come to feel towards Spike, and maybe even trick Buffy into dusting him.

As for Sam's REAL reason for being in Sunnydale, it was probably a field test. At some point while working for the Initiative, Buffy MUST have given the scientists at least one blood sample. Military medical facilities can't function without taking quarts of blood from anyone within reach of a needle. With that blood sample, an elixar was developed. Riley wasn't Sam's husband, he was her handler. She wasn't his wife, she was his new secret weapon. Sam. S...A...M. Slayer Augmented Metabolism. The Army was trying to create their own army of Slayers.

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.
 
S
Summerlilly
Wow. Talk about overanalyzing! LOL
LittleMissLikesToFight
LittleMissLikesToFight
love it! Cuz I hated Sam too!
G
GATEGOD
<3 you
BuffyElevated
BuffyElevated
[No message]
^^ NOW I wish I hadn't repped you on the Entropy thread, LOL! You have an active imagination, but your theory is entirely plausible for all that! Love it!
 
white avenger
white avenger
Yeah, that imagination has gotten me into a lot of trouble over the years, but I've had a lot of fun with it, too. Did you ever hear the one about a wolf that got bitten and turns into a human every full moon night?
The episode is okay in terms of entertainment, but is really, really not one of the better written episodes of Buffy.

hmmm...really? Why is that? I feel like there probably have been worse. At least one major thing happened, Buffy realized why she really had to end it with Spike.

I liked this episode. It felt like the timing was right. We really needed something to happen to get us out of Double Meat Hell. Who better to do that then Riley?

Sam has got to be the best wife ever. God! I just couldn't find one thing wrong with her! And it was nice that Buffy and Riley got to have some sort of closure. Buffy needed to be reminded that she was strong and beautiful women by someone on the outside.
 
Sam has got to be the best wife ever. God! I just couldn't find one thing wrong with her!

That's what made me suspicious of her in the first place. She's TOO perfect. She claims to be a former Peace Corps worker who had been rescued by Riley and his team (if you recall, that was why Riley left Sunnydale in the first place. To join an Army unit that was going to South America to rescue the group) Then, just a few months later, that little Peace Corps girl is GI Jane, who somehow outranks Riley (Buffy: "So, you take orders from him?" Sam: "He wishes!" The only way that Sam could not be required to obey Riley's orders would be if she had equal or greater rank than his own, which would be impossible if she were the new recruit that she claims to be.

Then Peace Corps/GI Jane comes to Sunnydale and meets the girl who basically turned her new husband into an emotional basket case and she's all smiles and charm. ("There's no bad guys in this, Buffy...") She's the military version of a Stepford Wife.

My greatest problem with this episode is that everything "just" happened too quickly and too conveniently. Just when Buffy is at her emotional rock bottom from the combined responsibilities of being a parent and having to do minimum wage work just to pay her bills while Dawn, Willow, and Tara all sit comfortably under her roof contributing nothing. Just when Captain Cardboard shows up unannounced at her workplace with a demon emergency and a full set of BDU's. including boots, body armor, and even gloves in just her size. Just at the precise moment when the dreaded Suvolte beast arrives in Sunnydale (except that, despite the fact that Riley and Sam have been in hot pursuit of said beast, it has been in Sunnydale long enough to lay a cave full of eggs which are already to the point of hatching which, coincidentally, have already been found and stolen by a mysterious character named the Doctor, who has clients waiting to buy them. Just when Buffy begins to realize that her relationship with Spike is destroying her because she "can't love him" (not shouldn't or doesn't want to, but CAN'T. Does that mean that she doesn't feel anything for him, or that she IS beginning to feel something, and can't allow those feelings to fully develop, because he is supposedly a soulless monster?) Just when she and Spike are enjoying the aftermath of a passionate interlude. Just when Riley comes bursting into Spike's crypt. Just at the precise moment that the dreaded eggs are beginning to hatch prematurely.

This whole story should have been the subject of at least two, or even better, four episodes, giving things time to play out in some logical manner without having to rely so much on a mountain of coincidence and just in the nick of time action, but there obviously wasn't time for that, because the Three Nerd Corps was doing too good a job of disrupting the demon community and robbing museums. As it was, one of the major elements, the real identity of the mysterious "Doctor" was never revealed, or even mentioned again. If it wasn't Spike, then who was it? If it WAS Spike, why did Buffy allow him to remain in a non-dusty condition. It couldn't be because she had ant feelings for him, of course, because she had already denied any and all such feelings. And whoever it was, why did he, she, or it pose no further threat?

"As You Were," to me, just depended entirely too much on coincidence, a crutch for good story telling at best. It was too much story to develop properly in a single episode. The return of a former lover; the former lover's new wife; the advent of a new demonic threat;the introduction of a new, mysterious villain. All of that serving no real purpose than to herald the end of a love affair ("I can't love you, and it's killing me.") Okay, not a love affair, more of an exercise in self destruction. But still, something that could have been handled perfectly well without the whole Return Of Riley story to clutter it up.
 
"hmmm...really? Why is that? I feel like there probably have been worse. At least one major thing happened, Buffy realized why she really had to end it with Spike."


Exactly why did she have to end it with him?
 
Exactly why did she have to end it with him?

Because she was using him and eschewing her responsibilities and getting on with her life. It was relationship based upon addiction and dependence.

As I said before, I don't judge her but respond to her emotional state. For whatever reason she couldn't reconcile herself with her behaviour. It's actually less about how 'horrible' Spike is supposed to be (in fact I care little about his duplicity because whether it happened or not, it doesn't change the fact she was using him because of her existential depression. Even if he's ok with it, she's clearly not.) it's actually about Buffy's state of mind at the time. Her disgust with herself is evident in Dead Things. If Buffy is to kill soulless vampires because there are soulless vampires, what happens if she sleeps with one? What are the moral consequences? She is clearly not at home with this grey area. If he is a creature worthy of respect then is it right that's she's using him simply 'to feel'?

For whatever reason Buffy couldn't love him. I support this. Buffy needed to be strong for herself. Seeing Riley again reminded her of how life used to be and I'd always contend she was happier in her own skin a few years ago. The dysfuction is clear when she sees Riley and it hurts and she then uses Spike for sex and comfort. A relationship shouldn't be used as crutch to make oneself feel better, that should be there anyway and she lost that for some reason. Using Spike didn't help, she realised that in the end and that's why she ended it. She even, uh, you know like said it. The whole egg thing was not the main point, the point was she can't use someone soulless or not who has feelings for her.

As for Sam? I liked her. Some people have the emotional intelligence to deal with such complex relationships. Despite people thinking she was too perfect, she was right. Ruffy was more a 's*** happens' kind of deal. Neither of them was really the bad guy.
 
I couldn't stand the actress at all!!! Her "acting" was terrible!

The character was a great idea. Just couldn't get over the actress. BLECH!
 
LOL Yeah she did have a couple moments when I thought "Wow, the way she delivered that line was crappy"... But overall I didn't mind her.
 
I hate that bitca. I really liked Riley (i know, i know, thats like blasphemous) and I thought he was great for Buffy and that she screwed it up. Sam came in to the picture and i was like...oh hell no! Something about her just rubs me the wrong way.
 
I couldn't stand the actress at all!!! Her "acting" was terrible!

The character was a great idea. Just couldn't get over the actress. BLECH!

LOL Yeah she did have a couple moments when I thought "Wow, the way she delivered that line was crappy"... But overall I didn't mind her.

Same for me. Didn't mind the character but the actress was terrible. I cringe when I watch her onscreen sometimes. On a couple of occasions it was as if she had forgotten her lines and was taking a second to run them through in her head, especially in the scene with her and Buffy patrolling together, specifically at the point where Buffy wants to split up so she can go see Spike.

I did like the fact that they went with a girl who was physically about as opposite to Buffy as was possible. Very telling on why Riley ended up with her, I reckon.
 
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