buffy and angel VS the scooby gang and AI

[celestialarrow]

did any body but me notice how towards the end of both buffy and angel their gangs turned against them and aligned themselves with the persons both angel and buffy had a rocky past relationship with(faith,spike). i mean though angel was pretending it was very interesting seeing the potentials and the gang turn against buffy while wes, gunn, and lorne turned against angel. and another thing its so interesting how buffy and faith started out friends then became enemies and friends again the same goes for angel and spike the writers of both shows did a great job with the relationships and histories between the four of them.

 

[justanotherjen]

I did. I watched season 7 after Christmas and then a week later I got the Angel DVDs and watched them. I remember getting to the end of season 5 and thinking, "dang, they turned on Angel just like Buffy's friends turned on her."

Of course, I didn't blame Wes and them. Angel had completely lost it by the end. He was acting irrationally. Or, at least, that is how they saw it.

The Scoobies, though. I was kind of mad about. Buffy was doing the best she could and they tossed her out.

 

[celestialarrow]

yeah like you said angel was becoming a jerk but buffy she was doing the best she could and her friends pretended as if she was missing up on every thing when she was willing to give up everything to save the world.

 

[TabulaRasa]

I did. I watched season 7 after Christmas and then a week later I got the Angel DVDs and watched them. I remember getting to the end of season 5 and thinking, "dang, they turned on Angel just like Buffy's friends turned on her."

Of course, I didn't blame Wes and them. Angel had completely lost it by the end. He was acting irrationally. Or, at least, that is how they saw it.

The Scoobies, though. I was kind of mad about. Buffy was doing the best she could and they tossed her out.

Yes the scoobies really made me mad. They treated Buffy pretty bad. I guess everyone has their breaking point tho. No matter who is in the wrong or right.

 

[doppelgänger2]

I don't agree really that Buffy was doing the best job she could by season 7. Yes, she was doing all she could under the circumstances and she genuinely wanted to protect her friends, family and the potentials. But, that doesn't mean she was not breaking down emotionally and perhaps acting somewhat irrational. And if you take into consideration what she went through in season 6, it's understandable. What I find interesting with the character Buffy is that she is always defended by fans as the one who cannot do wrong, which is totally how Buffy (as a character) wants to project herself to friends and foes.

And imagine this in Buffy's case: She's not the most humble leader in the world, she thinks she knows best and she expects others to know she knows best, and therefor follow. By the end of season 7, it's understandable that people were scared and feared for their lifes for super real, they knew the first was not one to mess with. Buffy was not always sure what to do or how to beat this thing, and it's clear she's getting a little emotional about it. Now, you have people that are fearing for their lives, who have let themselves be leaded by Buffy for 7 years, who suddenly thinks "hey, we're dying here for real and all that Buffy wants to do is send us back so we can die a little more?" and Buffy is like "STFU We're doing as I say!". Now, is that so weird and horrible what the scoobies did when they said "hell no!" to Buffy?

 

[sosa lola]

You think Buffy wasn't being a jerk or irrational? She had insulted every person in the room in Get It Done, YET everyone sucked it in and followed her. Except maybe Spike, who left because he didn't like her attitude. Makes me wonder if he'll also go against her along the others in Empty Places if he were there. Then we have her making decisions without listening to her friends' opinions, even Spike objected on her plan in Dirty Places, and she lost. Later she wanted to do the exact same plan, and everyone objected, but according to her they had to fall in line, even though they had big chances of losing again. Not to mention how she was immaturely handled herself, immaturely treating Giles and Faith in front of all the potentials like dirtbags, throwing false accusations like a five year old, stated earlier that se didn't trust any single person in the room but Spike, moreover, not even giving them the license to express their opinions and suggestions.

Tell me again, why they didn't want to follow?

In the original script, Willow and Xander were stating over and over that Buffy needed to rest, she wasn't thinking straight, and I agree with them. A Buffy who got a good night sleep will handle the situation with a rational, calm behavior that will get everyone to respect her opinion and maybe see her point. She also needed to hear suggestions and respect those working for her. Or else she's just a cold, lousy leader.

I understand that Buffy was going through a lot of pressure, her past with Faith clouds her judgment and behavior, the recent betrayal by Giles clouds her judgment and behavior, her need to win got her acting like this. I understand.

I also believe it was a good thing to suggest Buffy leaving if she couldn't work together on the situation with everybody. Just maybe not outside the house.

 

[justanotherjen]

I agree that she wasn't making the best decisions but she was doing the best she could. Her friends had every right to question her but I think they could have gone about it a different way. Confronting her in front of everyone and making her feel like crap...not helping. But, then again, as hard headed as Buffy is she probably wouldn't have gotten the message any other way. They kick her out and then turn things over to Faith who doesn't want the job because she knows she can't lead like Buffy can--it's just not in her nature. It was like a smack in the face to Buffy.

It ticked me off for some reason.

 

[celestialarrow]

yes buffy was making some bad decisions in season 7, BUT you'd think that with all the history they had that her friends could have made her understand but to bombard her while she was already being attacked but the other's wasn't the best way to go about the situation it's like okay we have faith whose a slayer so we dont need buffy any more. how many times have buffy gave up every to fight the good fight and they wait to question her motives now why didn't they do it in the glory arc when buffy stated point blank she would kill anyone who came near dawny. buffy has been through so much she has a right to be a little emotional who hasn't on the show. but the thing that really ticked me off was the fact that buffy WAS actually right caleb was hiding something of hers at the vinyar. i just think they could have handled buffy a little differently considering all she has done, plus im not saying it could happen but what if buffy got so angry so mad she changed and decided to team up with caleb and the first that team would have been un-beatable because lets not forget it was buffy's plan to make every potential into a slayer it's noway the scoobies could have taken on the first, buffy and caleb.