Buffy, Angel and Charmed

[orpheusxi]

My friend says that Charmed is in fact one of the best shows created and is in fact better than both Buffy and Angel. I think that is very much untrue considering the fact that Buffy made the WB as popular as it did. Having Never watched the show though i decided to give it the benefit of the doubt and watch it. Suprisingly enough the show didnt meet the hype not even on the worst episodes of BTVS and Angel. Everything from the script to the special effects seemed tacked together in a desperate attempt to make a show to show on the WB. If anything i think the show should have been on the FOX Family network. The thing i have to say that pissed me off the most about this show is that it "BORROWED" alot from both shows and dummed it down alot. For example the whole Jasmine thing on Angel happened on Charmed but in the form of a group of people and they basically wanted the same thing. Also there are alot of episodes they copied from BTVS like Nightmares(S1). The thing that puzzles me is that the show lasted longer than both Buffy and Angel despite being much more skankier and less plot drive.

My request is that if anyone else who watches all three shows could you please point out the things that Charmed stole from Buffy and Angel.

 

[TabulaRasa]

My best friend loves Charmed, way more than Angel and especially Buffy. I don't get it. I tried my butt off to watch it. I watched from season 4 on, and when it got to season 8 I said "I just can't do it anymore!" It had nothing to do with it competing with Buffy for me, cause no offense to Charmed, no competition at all. Buffy and Angel out perform Charmed. And it isn't just the show's in themselves, it's everything. The storylines are deep, the characters are deep. I just feel more for them, Buffy and Angel I am meaning of course.
Charmed had a lot of repeat performances. What I mean is, I found a lot of episodes of theirs to resemble others of well..theirs. That got annoying. I found a lot of episodes pretty boring. I only find 1 Buffy episode boring, and yet I would watch it over a charmed episode any day. I am talking about Superstar. It may be kinda funny but I don't like it much.
Back to charmed. I also hate when people compare it to Buffy. Ok yes magic, demons whatever, but that is their only similarity. The 2 shows (well 3) are on different levels with each other.
Pooh, pooh Charmed show, pooh pooh! Lol...
Anyways I agree with you Marukisu. Charmed comes no where near to being better than Buffy and Angel. Or I would not have been bored with the show as much as I was. And not like I wasn't giving it a chance on perpose cause I even bought season 4 on dvd, which I have never popped in the dvd player, so I don't know why I bothered. I caught the episodes on tv but this year at christmas nothing was on my list that I wanted and so I just picked up charmed. Mistake since it was a waste of moola. Well, that's my 2 cents. Let's make it...10 cents.

 

[spuffy]

I watched a few Charmed episodes, it's not even close to Buffy and Angel. Those two shows were brilliantly written and fantasticly acted and need I talk about the wonderful visual effects?
Charmed lacked most of that, I only liked it because of Cole Turner, his story really resembled Spike's and he's got good looks too lol.

 

[Spuffiness]

I just think Charmed fans are jealous of the success of Buffy, and always have. It's a fact that Buffy's better. It's not a matter of opinion anymore. Listen, I know a lot about television, I write scripts for television (not professionally though). And I can tell you that in script writing forums, in script writing books, they all talk about Buffy. Many writers are fans of Buffy, and they even read the season 8 comics. Buffy is always a good example for some stuff, example as good stuff.

And you're right, Charmed stole many things from Buffy (I'm sure people will extend on that). It's kids show. They do take things from Buffy and make it "stupider". The fact that Charmed got more season(s) doesn't mean anything. There are so many good and better series that didn't get more seasons than Charmed, but that doesn't mean they're worse. By season 8, Charmed was already out of ideas. There are so many episodes where you see the same thing. Every episode the sisters turn into something, every episode they become evil, etc.

It's a nice show to watch, but not to take too seriously. And I will say it again, it's a fact that Buffy is better, and not only that... Buffy is one of the best shows in the history of television. Ask professionals, writers, producers, directors, all television experts. Charmed is soooooooo far from Buffy. Just ask around the right people. With all due respect, your friend doesn't understand much. I mean, okay, you like Charmed, it's a nice show. But no way it's better than Buffy. Fact.

 

[TabulaRasa]

I think alot of it too is that people who liked charmed first, hear that there is this competition and don't allow themselves to love Buffy or Angel because of it, because they liked it first. Does that makes sense?
There is no competition btw, not to us fans who know where each show stands!

That would be like Anya loving money and being obsessed with money and someone tell her bunnies are better. She's just not gonna hear it! Lol.

 

[white avenger]

I watched a few episodes at random times, but it just never grabbed me hard enough to watch even two shows in a row. Somebody must like it, though. It keeps coming back. (of course, so does Al Gore...)

 

[CharmedSlayer85]

I liked Charmed up until Season Four after Season Four Charmed began to get stupid. I continued to watch it but it just got stupid and with like every episode just very inconsistant and rules changed from one episode to another. For example through the entire run of the show Piper was unable to freeze good witches, however somewhere out the blue in Season Eight she was able to freeze good witches and MANY MANY other inconsistancies. Also the show started to become more and more fairy tale like as the show progressed. Buffy and Angel were just great, not that many inconsistancies with the exception of slayer and vampire strength which continued to fluctuate, but that's it.

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

I just think Charmed fans are jealous of the success of Buffy, and always have. It's a fact that Buffy's better. It's not a matter of opinion anymore. Listen, I know a lot about television, I write scripts for television (not professionally though). And I can tell you that in script writing forums, in script writing books, they all talk about Buffy. Many writers are fans of Buffy, and they even read the season 8 comics. Buffy is always a good example for some stuff, example as good stuff.

And you're right, Charmed stole many things from Buffy (I'm sure people will extend on that). It's kids show. They do take things from Buffy and make it "stupider". The fact that Charmed got more season(s) doesn't mean anything. There are so many good and better series that didn't get more seasons than Charmed, but that doesn't mean they're worse. By season 8, Charmed was already out of ideas. There are so many episodes where you see the same thing. Every episode the sisters turn into something, every episode they become evil, etc.

It's a nice show to watch, but not to take too seriously. And I will say it again, it's a fact that Buffy is better, and not only that... Buffy is one of the best shows in the history of television. Ask professionals, writers, producers, directors, all television experts. Charmed is soooooooo far from Buffy. Just ask around the right people. With all due respect, your friend doesn't understand much. I mean, okay, you like Charmed, it's a nice show. But no way it's better than Buffy. Fact.

I hate Charmed, bores the pants off me actually but please don't use the word 'fact' to make your opinion seem better than it is.
I know for a 'fact' that there are people out there that believe Charmed is the better of the two, I would argue that it isn't but neither of us are wrong or right, its about your own personal taste.


Ohh and again in script writing forums, that too doesn't make something fact.
I'm sure that there is a chance there are some people that would cite Chramed Scripts as the best thing ever written.

I have to say, I love how your 'fact' is backed up because 'you know alot about TV and write TV scripts' though the latter is not professionally.

I'm genuinely convinced most of the people on this 'board' knows alot about TV and I even know some people here that write TV scripts but sadly they too don't do it professionally. Instead. all they have is their real job and an opinion.

 

[Randy Giles]

I watched "Charmed" for a while. I remember that after school a couple years back, TNT had a block of Charmed and Angel. Or maybe it was Angel and then Charmed. Anyway, after school I would watch them both. Charmed entertained me enough but I never loved it, and it certainly never lived up to Angel.

I think Charmed had a good premise, but it was executed horribly. Even for a show on The WB, it could have been better. I guess this isn't the thread to get into exactly how Charmed could have been better though.

Anyway, for me Charmed has never been more than something campy to watch for entertainment, and now I probably wouldn't even watch it at all because there's a lot of great shows on TV that are currently on that I could spend my time watching. But Charmed is not comparable to Buffy. It lacks the characterization, the acting, the writing, the intelligence, the quirky AND intelligent humor, the emotion, everything.

 

[mogwaid]

I like season 1, 2 and 3 of charmed. After Shannon leaves, its not even worth watching for me anymore. Charmed is all right, but it nowhere nears the goodness that is of Buffy imo.

 

[Spuffiness]

I hate Charmed, bores the pants off me actually but please don't use the word 'fact' to make your opinion seem better than it is.
I know for a 'fact' that there are people out there that believe Charmed is the better of the two, I would argue that it isn't but neither of us are wrong or right, its about your own personal taste.


Ohh and again in script writing forums, that too doesn't make something fact.
I'm sure that there is a chance there are some people that would cite Chramed Scripts as the best thing ever written.

I have to say, I love how your 'fact' is backed up because 'you know alot about TV and write TV scripts' though the latter is not professionally.

I'm genuinely convinced most of the people on this 'board' knows alot about TV and I even know some people here that write TV scripts but sadly they too don't do it professionally. Instead. all they have is their real job and an opinion.

Okay, let me explain why it is a fact and why I used that word. You're right, there is the matter of taste. But there is also a matter of fact. I said the word "fact" because of the criterions that determine if something is good. Buffy is better because: the acting is better, the script, the plot, the editing, the characters and the way they're built, the directing, the shooting, the effects, etc. All of the above tells me that Buffy is better and they're facts.

Egg, for example, is egg, and that's a fact. you can't argue and say that egg isn't an egg. right?

You can say (and I can say) that you like a show better (or anything else), but that doesn't mean it is better. So according to what I said, yes, it is a fact that Buffy's better.

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

Okay, let me explain why it is a fact and why I used that word. You're right, there is the matter of taste. But there is also a matter of fact. I said the word "fact" because of the criterions that determine if something is good. Buffy is better because: the acting is better, the script, the plot, the editing, the characters and the way they're built, the directing, the shooting, the effects, etc. All of the above tells me that Buffy is better and they're facts.

I studied film and the moving image(how to make and critique) and I can tell you something, none of your 'criterion' are fact.

Acting is, again, subjective. I believe that Shannon at her best is a better actress than SMG(in my opinion). I can also say that certain actors in Buffy weren't, especially at the beginning, that great at acting.
That's not me saying Charmed was better, I have yet to watch the full series, but what I have seen, there were at least three very competant actors(Cole, Leo and Shannons), doing a good job.

Script, well again, many people can argue this one.
I wouldn't say one is better than the other until i've had a chance to read entire scripts(NOT ones transcribed by fans). I have alot of experience with scripts, I mean I don't write them now but I had to study them constantly for 4 years. There are many different things you have to take into account with scripts, not just dialogue(as i'm sure you are aware). But even with all these you still have to take into account personal preference.

Plot is 100% personal preference. I have many friends that think that the Charmed season 8 arc was the greatest plot on TV, and they've seen Buffy(some of them aren't even fans - can you imagine that someone not believing Buffy to be the greatest show on TV, favouring Charmed!!).

Editing is an art form but it has to meld with many things.
I'm in no way saying that Buffy's was bad, it fit perfectly for the show, what I am saying is that the editing of Charmed, if it fit the story being told, was right. If that is the case, you cannot compare the two.

I could go on, and although I won't because I think i've made my point that all your reasons for it being 'fact' still fall under subjective.

 

[orpheusxi]

I studied film and the moving image(how to make and critique) and I can tell you something, none of your 'criterion' are fact.

Acting is, again, subjective. I believe that Shannon at her best is a better actress than SMG(in my opinion). I can also say that certain actors in Buffy weren't, especially at the beginning, that great at acting.
That's not me saying Charmed was better, I have yet to watch the full series, but what I have seen, there were at least three very competant actors(Cole, Leo and Shannons), doing a good job..

Lol everytime i come across any of your posts they mak me laugh. Anywhoo on topic

When you say you have studied how to make a critique can you say some of the things one would do while making one . Im just curious to see how you yourself were taught to make one.

As far as Shannon at her best better than SMG could you tell me some things she has been at at her best because i can believe that as much as an SMG fan i am but ive only seen her in Charmed and in that performance i feel she dummed herself down her co-stars and the directing of the show.

I agree with the whole acting thing but as far as the acting in Charmed doesnt the direction and the tone of the show play a role as well. To me in Charmed all the people you listed were in fact prob the best however due to the fluffy nature of the show and the actors who couldnt really act kind of forced the good actors to downgrade to their level. This wasnt helped by the generic sounding lower rank and higher rank evil characters who all used that self important voice that is slow and try to pronounce every syllable in a word to sound evil. At least the lower evil guys, demons and big bads had range in which it was apparent to see. i will admit though the master had that self important voice in season one of buffy but he got better in angel season 2. The saving grace of The Buffyverse and its evil people as well is because they gave them a human like attitude which made the show funny as well but when it came time to get serious the bad guys knew to do so . Examples of this are Glory, Skip etc....

Script, well again, many people can argue this one.I wouldn't say one is better than the other until i've had a chance to read entire scripts(NOT ones transcribed by fans). I have alot of experience with scripts, I mean I don't write them now but I had to study them constantly for 4 years. There are many different things you have to take into account with scripts, not just dialogue(as i'm sure you are aware). But even with all these you still have to take into account personal preference..

Could you elaborate on what you mean by script. Because are you talking about the dialouge on paper or the dialogue in the show as the characters act it out im a bit confused.

Plot is 100% personal preference. I have many friends that think that the Charmed season 8 arc was the greatest plot on TV, and they've seen Buffy(some of them aren't even fans - can you imagine that someone not believing Buffy to be the greatest show on TV, favouring Charmed!!)..

I agreee plot is 100% preference as well as the premise because you cant judge a show badsed on that just moreso on execution of it. But as far as Charmed S8 being the best arc idk im not arguing on that because as i have said i think Buffy as a whole is better than Charmed as a whole. Also obviously no show is perfect and has inconsitencies but Charmed had alot more inconsitincies than Buffy. Another reason i think it is better than Charmed is because of the realistic confort level that the other two shows set. You know how once you get a comfort level and a feel of a show you kind of know whats gonna happen next or your kinda got a gut feeling after watchin so long. I think in Charmed everytime an episode starts the viewer thinks "Oh ok what speel are they gonna find out this time to get out of this jam". Whereas with Buffy or Angel its like " Oh ok we're in this dilemma and we need to figure out how to get out of this" but it also comes with reprocussions along withcharacter growth and development.

Editing is an art form but it has to meld with many things.I'm in no way saying that Buffy's was bad, it fit perfectly for the show, what I am saying is that the editing of Charmed, if it fit the story being told, was right. If that is the case, you cannot compare the two.

I could go on, and although I won't because I think i've made my point that all your reasons for it being 'fact' still fall under subjective..

What do you mean by editing like camera work and stuff? if thats he case i mean i dont tend to dwelve to deep into that because it really doesnt matter to me and doesnt affect my enjoyment of the show unless the angle of the camera is like not even on the character or if they stay in the same angle for a long time but that is w/e. If your talking about the editing of the special effects i think Buffy was wayyyyy better. And im not just saying that because i prefer Buffy. I will asmit though Buffy's special effects werent all that and looked tacky at times like in Shadow ( i think is the name of the ep.) where Buffy jumped on the snake demon and killed it when they zoomed out it was tacky and looked fake. Charmed however was just an ugly show in this department the explosions and killing of the demons made no sense whatsoever .Whenever someone was stabbed they bursted into flames in which you could still see the outline of which they were supposed to dissapear. and the explosions looked like higher budget explosions condensed in front of an image. Idk it just seemed really tacky looking to me.

 

[Wiccaness]

Okay, let me explain why it is a fact and why I used that word. You're right, there is the matter of taste. But there is also a matter of fact. I said the word "fact" because of the criterions that determine if something is good. Buffy is better because: the acting is better, the script, the plot, the editing, the characters and the way they're built, the directing, the shooting, the effects, etc. All of the above tells me that Buffy is better and they're facts.

Egg, for example, is egg, and that's a fact. you can't argue and say that egg isn't an egg. right?

You can say (and I can say) that you like a show better (or anything else), but that doesn't mean it is better. So according to what I said, yes, it is a fact that Buffy's better.

i have to agree with bored of the dead

the example you gave really doesnt clarify why its a fact. And honestly i dont think its a fact. I think its your opininon over stated.

Yes i believe that btvs and ats are way better then charmed, but you saying 'fact this and fact that' i disagree with.

 

[DarlaFan2011]

I am a devoted Charmed fan,I could sit and watch Charmed all day long.I gave Angel and Bufy a chance just to see what my best frriend was talking about.I have to say I loved Angel but not more then Charmed.Some people just don't see Charmed the way I do but I am not going to go around insulting them or insulting Buffy or Angel for that matter so why is it that people sit there on their high horses and say "it is a fact that Buffy is better?"

 

[orpheusxi]

I am a devoted Charmed fan,I could sit and watch Charmed all day long.I gave Angel and Bufy a chance just to see what my best frriend was talking about.I have to say I loved Angel but not more then Charmed.Some people just don't see Charmed the way I do but I am not going to go around insulting them or insulting Buffy or Angel for that matter so why is it that people sit there on their high horses and say "it is a fact that Buffy is better?"

If you are devoted Charmed fan who prefers Charmed then why are you on a Buffyboard? Anywhoo i think it is fair to hear from a Charmed fan. What do you see in Charmed that others dont. and everyone almost agrees that it is not a fact but more-so a general consensus that Buffy is better.

 

[TabulaRasa]

Charmed fans can still enjoy Buffy and Angel. So it is not fair to think that Faithfan2005 should not come by. Let's not discourage fellow watchers of our favorite show.

Only one person said it was a fact tho, the average group of us just have it as an opinion of our own. We just have a connection to Buffy and Angel that we cannot find in Charmed.

 

[orpheusxi]

Charmed fans can still enjoy Buffy and Angel. So it is not fair to think that Faithfan2005 should not come by. Let's not discourage fellow watchers of our favorite show.

I want trying to discourage its just it kinda of came across as though if they liked charmed more. So i jsut questione why would they be here if they preered that more as opposed to prefering both equally. And i really wanted to know what Faith saw in harmed that we didnt.

 

[Wiccaness]

I want trying to discourage its just it kinda of came across as though if they liked charmed more. So i jsut questione why would they be here if they preered that more as opposed to prefering both equally. And i really wanted to know what Faith saw in harmed that we didnt.

i dont think it should matter if she likes charmed better. Shes still a fan of buffy and thats why shes on the board.


and what ever she sees in charmed is probably just what you see in buffy but towards charmed

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

Lol everytime i come across any of your posts they mak me laugh. Anywhoo on topic

Thats because i'm a funny guy who really doesn't care what people say and will put whatever I want😉

When you say you have studied how to make a critique can you say some of the things one would do while making one . Im just curious to see how you yourself were taught to make one.

How to make Film and TV AND how to Critique it.
When you are writing a critique you take whatever you want into account. YOu can focus on acting, story, directing anything. It is supposed to be unbiased but every single critic out there uses that one thing everyone else uses - personal opinion -

As far as Shannon at her best better than SMG could you tell me some things she has been at at her best because i can believe that as much as an SMG fan i am but ive only seen her in Charmed and in that performance i feel she dummed herself down her co-stars and the directing of the show.

Watch Mallrats, some of her earliest(I mean seasons 2-4) of 90210 and the brilliant Heathers
I will also say that on occasion of the episodes I saw, Shannen did a pretty good job in the show. Her performance did seem to get a little lacklustre in her final season but in season 1 she was really ok.

I agree with the whole acting thing but as far as the acting in Charmed doesnt the direction and the tone of the show play a role as well. To me in Charmed all the people you listed were in fact prob the best however due to the fluffy nature of the show and the actors who couldnt really act kind of forced the good actors to downgrade to their level. This wasnt helped by the generic sounding lower rank and higher rank evil characters who all used that self important voice that is slow and try to pronounce every syllable in a word to sound evil. At least the lower evil guys, demons and big bads had range in which it was apparent to see. i will admit though the master had that self important voice in season one of buffy but he got better in angel season 2. The saving grace of The Buffyverse and its evil people as well is because they gave them a human like attitude which made the show funny as well but when it came time to get serious the bad guys knew to do so . Examples of this are Glory, Skip etc....

This is exactly why its not a 'fact' but an opinion.
You have to take so many things into account and those things are not 'fact' themselves that you have to realise what you are saying is opinion.
I believe that Buffy is far greater than Charmed, but at the end of the day, that is my own opinion based on my own personal taste.

Could you elaborate on what you mean by script. Because are you talking about the dialouge on paper or the dialogue in the show as the characters act it out im a bit confused.

I mean the actual script. Spuffiness was making a claim that the scripts for Charmed were 'factually' worse than Buffy. For a start thats wrong because its not a fact. I have not read a true shooting script from Charmed, so I cannot compare the two, but even then, I would pick one over the other because of my opinion.

I agreee plot is 100% preference as well as the premise because you cant judge a show badsed on that just moreso on execution of it. But as far as Charmed S8 being the best arc idk im not arguing on that because as i have said i think Buffy as a whole is better than Charmed as a whole. Also obviously no show is perfect and has inconsitencies but Charmed had alot more inconsitincies than Buffy. Another reason i think it is better than Charmed is because of the realistic confort level that the other two shows set. You know how once you get a comfort level and a feel of a show you kind of know whats gonna happen next or your kinda got a gut feeling after watchin so long. I think in Charmed everytime an episode starts the viewer thinks "Oh ok what speel are they gonna find out this time to get out of this jam". Whereas with Buffy or Angel its like " Oh ok we're in this dilemma and we need to figure out how to get out of this" but it also comes with reprocussions along withcharacter growth and development.

Personally, I really dislike Charmed. My point wasn't to defend Charmed, but defend the integrity of Buffy. If we have people going around telling others that Buffy is better than Charmed and it is 'fact' it devalues the argument. You have people saying why is it 'fact' and then when the arguments that have been propsed come out, you have people(like me) showing why those aren't fact. When that is done, you have lost the argument because you look like you are using a falsehood to win the argument.
Buffy and Angel are strong enough to stand up to other opinions with opinions because they are well made shows.
As for the stuff on how the show ends, well one of my absolute favourite shows is Doctor Who, and i'll be honest, at times the ending is a little annoying because it seems that all the build up has a sort of anticlimactic ending.
People like that Buffy deals with her situations like so, just like people like how the Halliwells find a magic spell to destroy a demon.

What do you mean by editing like camera work and stuff? if thats he case i mean i dont tend to dwelve to deep into that because it really doesnt matter to me and doesnt affect my enjoyment of the show unless the angle of the camera is like not even on the character or if they stay in the same angle for a long time but that is w/e. If your talking about the editing of the special effects i think Buffy was wayyyyy better. And im not just saying that because i prefer Buffy. I will asmit though Buffy's special effects werent all that and looked tacky at times like in Shadow ( i think is the name of the ep.) where Buffy jumped on the snake demon and killed it when they zoomed out it was tacky and looked fake. Charmed however was just an ugly show in this department the explosions and killing of the demons made no sense whatsoever .Whenever someone was stabbed they bursted into flames in which you could still see the outline of which they were supposed to dissapear. and the explosions looked like higher budget explosions condensed in front of an image. Idk it just seemed really tacky looking to me.

By editing, I mean just that. I don't mean the filming or shooting, I mean the stuff the guys do in the editing suite. When they take all the footage and splice it together to make a coherent show.

I am a devoted Charmed fan,I could sit and watch Charmed all day long.I gave Angel and Bufy a chance just to see what my best frriend was talking about.I have to say I loved Angel but not more then Charmed.Some people just don't see Charmed the way I do but I am not going to go around insulting them or insulting Buffy or Angel for that matter so why is it that people sit there on their high horses and say "it is a fact that Buffy is better?"

Thank you for adding to this. I definitely don't agree with you, but you could not have posted at a better time🙂

If you are devoted Charmed fan who prefers Charmed then why are you on a Buffyboard? Anywhoo i think it is fair to hear from a Charmed fan. What do you see in Charmed that others dont. and everyone almost agrees that it is not a fact but more-so a general consensus that Buffy is better.

I post on other TV show boards. There is no rule that says if you prefer one show to another you must not comment on the one you like least.

Charmed fans can still enjoy Buffy and Angel. So it is not fair to think that Faithfan2005 should not come by. Let's not discourage fellow watchers of our favorite show.

Only one person said it was a fact tho, the average group of us just have it as an opinion of our own. We just have a connection to Buffy and Angel that we cannot find in Charmed.

I want to sing.
"Have I told you lately that I love you?"

I want trying to discourage its just it kinda of came across as though if they liked charmed more. So i jsut questione why would they be here if they preered that more as opposed to prefering both equally. And i really wanted to know what Faith saw in harmed that we didnt.

Well I prefer Doctor Who more than Buffy, but I post here because I do like Buffy as well.