Buffy references in Dollhouse

[Enuf3]

Maybe none of it is a 'nod' to anything, perhaps ED just doesn't have that great an acting range so whatever she does is similar to the stuff she's already done.

That's also a possibility.. As much as I would hate to admit it.

 

[DarklyDreamingDrusilla]

The only Buffy-esque reference that I have noticed was pointed out to me by TC (The Chosen) about episode three. In Season 1 Episode Three of Buffy and girl catches on fire and in Season 1 Episode Three of Dollhouse a girl catches on fire its more of a crazy random happenstance than a reference I guess, but it is still quite interesting.

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

The only Buffy-esque reference that I have noticed was pointed out to me by TC (The Chosen) about episode three. In Season 1 Episode Three of Buffy and girl catches on fire and in Season 1 Episode Three of Dollhouse a girl catches on fire its more of a crazy random happenstance than a reference I guess, but it is still quite interesting.

Or Maybe Joss is showing he really only had one original idea and is rehashing it?

 

[MinwaraYana]

Leather pants!!!
.....................

 

[clemsgirlfriend]

It does seem like the whole idea of having a 'minder' really sounds a whole lot like having a 'watcher'. Both are unusual enough in life that their co-existence can't really be explained by 'well, yeah, but that's just normal'. Does seem like a concept/type of relationship (pseudo-parental but not with an actual biological parent) that Joss hadn't finished mining yet and wanted to continue exploring.

Joss has said before that he was raised by a single mom. Anyone wonder if having watcher/slayer-minder/active relationships in his shows is his way of exploring the role of important non-familial mentors in a person's life and the influence that they can have on someone's development? (Similarly, other than Buffy's mom, none of the other characters had great relationships with their parents - Willow, Xander, Cordelia to an extent, Faith, Buffy and her dad, but they referred to their co-workers and friends as their family. Joss's relationship with his mom was great (he has said in interviews), but he might be very interested in exploring the role that other parental-style role models can play in a person's life, especially when no strong biological father is present or active in their kid's life.)

Or maybe i'm just reading too much into it (as Cordelia once said, and could have been describing me, "over-identify much?")
Hmm. 🙂

 

[Cohen]

The hotel in Episode Three looked very similar to shots of the Hyperion Hotel. Did I already post this?

 

[marukisu2]

I think you guys are reaching on alot of this, but when she did say "The Tabula Rasa effect" i instantly thought to that episode, but i dont think it was an active easter egg reference.

But if we want buffverse references, how about the main hall in the Dollhouse having a similar build and color scheme to Wolfram and Hart. =)

 

[Buffy Summers]

Of course I also went 'heeeey, Buffy episode' when I heard that, but, I just have to quote one of my psych books from uni here:



("Atkinsons & Hilgard's Introduction to Psychology", 14th edition, 2005)

In that sense, I think this is just the perfect term to describe the dolls, which, if they hadn't used it, would've made them look like morons for not using it. So no power to the Buffy reference here.

It's still a reference. I'm not saying it's an invented term, but using the term "Tabula Rasa" in Dollhouse is a connection to Buffy.

Like if Topher had a Mr. Gordo sitting on his desk or something...

 

[entropy]

The only Buffy-esque reference that I have noticed was pointed out to me by TC (The Chosen) about episode three. In Season 1 Episode Three of Buffy and girl catches on fire and in Season 1 Episode Three of Dollhouse a girl catches on fire its more of a crazy random happenstance than a reference I guess, but it is still quite interesting.

Or maybe Joss is just a Michael Jackson's fan and wanted to make a tribute with the whole 'girl catching on fire thing' 😀

No, seriously, the only reference, plausible one anyway, I thought they made was, like they were saying in previous posts, the Tabula Rasa one, I even remember thinking to myself "Oh my god! Willow again!"

 

[Flannen]

It's still a reference. I'm not saying it's an invented term, but using the term "Tabula Rasa" in Dollhouse is a connection to Buffy.

Like if Topher had a Mr. Gordo sitting on his desk or something...

It's not a reference. It's a philosophical term from the EIGHTEENTH-CENTURY! Yeah it may have made you THINK of the Tabula Rasa episode in Buffy but its not why it's been put in to Dollhouse.

Tabula Rasa simply describes what goes on with the actives, just as it described what happened to the scoobies when they lost their memories.

Jeez, it's a different show. Why would Joss be so lame as to reference one of his own old shows in a new one?! He doesn't!

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

It's not a reference. It's a philosophical term from the EIGHTEENTH-CENTURY! Yeah it may have made you THINK of the Tabula Rasa episode in Buffy but its not why it's been put in to Dollhouse.

Tabula Rasa simply describes what goes on with the actives, just as it described what happened to the scoobies when they lost their memories.

Jeez, it's a different show. Why would Joss be so lame as to reference one of his own old shows in a new one?! He doesn't!

Joss Whedon could have called the episode absolutely anything he wanted, but he chose Tabula Rasa.

Do you think when he landed on the name he said - 'Ohh, the Buffy fans will get a kick out of this because its an EIGHTEENTH CENTURY philosophical term' or 'Ohh, the Buffy fans will get a kick out of this because they, LIKE ME, will remember it was the name of a Buffy episode.'

If Joss was intent on keeping the shows completely separate then there wouldn't be ANY actors in it that are closely linked with Buffy/Angel.

With all the millions upon millions of words in the English language alone (I know its not English), for him to pick this combination of words is OBVIOUSLY a nod to Buffy.

Jeez, its a different show but Joss has already made the mistake of neglecting the fans - he won't do that again.

Wait, why am I even entering this part of the conversation?

 

[Flannen]

You can hardly say that by using the same actors he wants to keep them linked, it couldn't possibly be because he's worked with them before and, oh I don't know, thought they could make the parts work?!

And he obviously didn't choose the title simply because it's an eighteenth-century term in English philosophy, but I think it might be because its a term, that as I said previously perfectly described the two situations in which it is used?

Maybe it was a 'nod' to Buffy but really when you consider the meaning of tabula rasa and the contents of the episodes in which it was used, I'm guessing it wasn't Joss' primary reason for wanting to use it.

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

You can hardly say that by using the same actors he wants to keep them linked, it couldn't possibly be because he's worked with them before and, oh I don't know, thought they could make the parts work?!

And he obviously didn't choose the title simply because it's an eighteenth-century term in English philosophy, but I think it might be because its a term, that as I said previously perfectly described the two situations in which it is used?

Maybe it was a 'nod' to Buffy but really when you consider the meaning of tabula rasa and the contents of the episodes in which it was used, I'm guessing it wasn't Joss' primary reason for wanting to use it.

No, but if he didn't want people to link the shows, he wouldn't have any on screen connection.

And yes, the term is accurate in use BUT it is also a perfect nod.

A reference doesn't have to be
Echo: "Its like that show, Buffy the Vampire Slayer"

Your argument is, in all fairness rubbish, because it IS a nod.
Doesn't matter where it comes from, its blatantly a connection.

 

[Flannen]

No, but if he didn't want people to link the shows, he wouldn't have any on screen connection.

And yes, the term is accurate in use BUT it is also a perfect nod.

A reference doesn't have to be
Echo: "Its like that show, Buffy the Vampire Slayer"

Your argument is, in all fairness rubbish, because it IS a nod.
Doesn't matter where it comes from, its blatantly a connection.

And you've heard from Joss that he definitely meant to do that then? Just, you seem so damn sure!

And no, a reference doesn't have to be direct like that, but also, every word used in Dollhouse that just so happens to have been used in Buffy is NOT a 'nod.'

You can't support a statement like 'your argument is rubbish' with such an uninformed argument yourself - an argument that is based on desperate to relate EVERYTHING to Buffy.

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

And you've heard from Joss that he definitely meant to do that then? Just, you seem so damn sure!

And no, a reference doesn't have to be direct like that, but also, every word used in Dollhouse that just so happens to have been used in Buffy is NOT a 'nod.'

You can't support a statement like 'your argument is rubbish' with such an uninformed argument yourself - an argument that is based on desperate to relate EVERYTHING to Buffy.

You're right, Joss hasn't said it, but something like common sense kicks in.

Actually if you can work around your abject stupidity for a moment and read ALL my comments in this thread, you would see that I find most of the links as a laughable, tenuous attempt to link, HOWEVER there is no denying this one - well no denying to those with IQ's that are higher than double figures.

 

[Flannen]

Working around my abject stupidity would require having to care about your other posts, and I don't. When you find solid evidence that the reference is intentional, and not just your 'common sense' then let me know!

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

Working around my abject stupidity would require having to care about your other posts, and I don't. When you find solid evidence that the reference is intentional, and not just your 'common sense' then let me know!

RIIIIGHT!
So now you need everything spelled out to you by Joss.
Hilarious - further backing up my last comment.
Maybe you should stick to the less cerebral of TV shows for future reference, the ones that don't require the thinking.

Big Brother should be starting soon, how does that work for ya!

 

[Silum]

You're right, Joss hasn't said it, but something like common sense kicks in.

Actually if you can work around your abject stupidity for a moment and read ALL my comments in this thread, you would see that I find most of the links as a laughable, tenuous attempt to link, HOWEVER there is no denying this one - well no denying to those with IQ's that are higher than double figures.

I must be stupid then. What would be the best way to express the minds of an active who can be imprinted with memories then wiped? It just so happens that the phrase Tabula Rasa reffering to a blank slate was the PERFECT word to describe a wiped mind...this phrase was story/writing driven and not a nod. It could easily have been written by someone whos never seen Buffy before.

The fact that it can be linked to the show is interesting but ultimately arbitrary. Its a nod in the same way that both Faith and Echo picks up a bow, a happy coincidence that 2 plot devices/components mesh

 

[Edmund Blackadder]

I must be stupid then. What would be the best way to express the minds of an active who can be imprinted with memories then wiped? It just so happens that the phrase Tabula Rasa reffering to a blank slate was the PERFECT word to describe a wiped mind...this phrase was story/writing driven and not a nod. It could easily have been written by someone whos never seen Buffy before.

The fact that it can be linked to the show is interesting but ultimately arbitrary. Its a nod in the same way that both Faith and Echo picks up a bow, a happy coincidence that 2 plot devices/components mesh

I'm not saying that the phrase is JUST a reference, what I am saying is that when Joss decided on the name he knew that it WOULD be a reference AS WELL as having meaning in the show.

Like I stated, a 'nod' which is a reference.
Doesn't devalue the meaning BUT shows that there is a connection.

In fact its possible that he remembered the meaning of the title from his Buffy days.

As for the title of the episodes, it is predominently the show runner that comes up with them, when they come up with the basic outline for the episode.

 

[Flannen]

RIIIIGHT!
So now you need everything spelled out to you by Joss.
Hilarious - further backing up my last comment.
Maybe you should stick to the less cerebral of TV shows for future reference, the ones that don't require the thinking.

Big Brother should be starting soon, how does that work for ya!

Woah - no need to get all Cordelia on me now, is there!?

I totally agree with you Silum.

Personally I think it suits the active situation in Dollhouse much better than it did the Buffy episode, regarding its meaning within philosophy. It is truly a 'PERFECT' description!

---------- Post added at 09:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 PM ----------

And seriously dude - I think you should chill out a bit and join in the spirit of 'discussion.' Do you have something really large, lodged somewhere really uncomfortable?! I'm just trying to determine why you're being so damn...'bitchy' seems appropriate!