Buffy's Dad?

[Spirit_Of_Fred]

it seems like there would be a thread for this already, but i couldnt find it, so just point me in its direction if there already is one. anyway, in the beginning of the series, like when you see buffy's dad in 'nightmares' or 'when she was bad', he seemed like a really nice guy. he cared about her, he didnt seem mean or anything, and she even went down to visit him, or him to her, a few times. but then gradually, he stopped coming down for her birthday, like in 'helpless', and eventually buffy says he ran off with his seceretary in spain, or something like that. my question is this: how and why did this transformation occur?

maybe after he didnt have to raise a kid anymore, he went off to see the world and could be less tied down. i can only speculate.

so what do you guys think? and do you think there was a better way his character couldve turned out, and better things he could've done, or do you like the way it was?

 

[Joyce Summers]

This was posted AAAAAGES ago, but I've just come across it and there are *no* replies on it. So i decided to post. hehe.
Now, before I do I wanna say that I probably have a biased opinion as I come from a single parent family, raised by my Mother.
Now, Hank was very nice in the beginning because this was just after the divorce. But I think as he was given more and more free time to lead his life, his daughter began to take a back seat. Most Fathers have a tendency to put themselves first before their children as I'm afraid that it's a tendency of nature for guys to have a more selfish attitude than Mothers, who generally always put their children first.
This kinda explains why Hank gradually fades out of Buffy's life.

 

[white avenger]

In "Conversations With Dead People," which was, I believe, the last time Hank Summers was referred to, Buffy said that "He cheated." I assume that she is referring to an affair with his secretary, but there might have been several other women that we know nothing about, which would probably have been the cause of the divorce in the first place. Interestingly enough, Sarah had a bad relationship with her own father (or possibly no relationship at all. She referred to him once as "the sperm doner," not the most affectionate term to apply to one's father), and she might have been uncomfortable playing a character who loves her father. It wouldn't be the first time a star had influence on a plot line.

As an aside to Slayer Comma The...I'm truly sorry that you had less than an ideal relationship with your father, but as a father AND grandfather myself, I feel qualified to state that the vast majority of fathers do, in fact, "put their children first." I always have, my son certainly does, and every man in my family who has been blessed with children has as well.

 

[Joyce Summers]

As I stated, it was just my personal experience added to the majority of my friends less than ideal fathers. However, I have had a father role in my life, who is great, so I do understand that not all men are the same. And my hat is off to you for being outside of the stereotype that seems to have been set- at least in my life. And I hope that you didn't take offense.

 

[Kean]

In "Conversations With Dead People," which was, I believe, the last time Hank Summers was referred to, Buffy said that "He cheated." I assume that she is referring to an affair with his secretary, but there might have been several other women that we know nothing about, which would probably have been the cause of the divorce in the first place. Interestingly enough, Sarah had a bad relationship with her own father (or possibly no relationship at all. She referred to him once as "the sperm doner," not the most affectionate term to apply to one's father), and she might have been uncomfortable playing a character who loves her father. It wouldn't be the first time a star had influence on a plot line.

As an aside to Slayer Comma The...I'm truly sorry that you had less than an ideal relationship with your father, but as a father AND grandfather myself, I feel qualified to state that the vast majority of fathers do, in fact, "put their children first." I always have, my son certainly does, and every man in my family who has been blessed with children has as well.

I think it was a necessary part of the show. Giles WAS the father figure and he and Buffy treated each other as father and daughter. Looking deeper at it there seems to be an ongoing theme of poor father figures in the show, apart from giles that is, but he is nobodies father biologically.

Hank:MIA
Mr. Harris: Abusive Alcoholic
Ira Rosenberg: Little involvement in his daughters life
Mr.Chase: Replaced affection with money
Faith never knew her Father
Angel:Hated and then ate his father
Mr.Gunn: No real mention of parents but the fact that he lived on the streets says enough
Wesley: Emotionally abusive
Lorne: I can't remember his father being mentioned but I can't imagine him having a different opinion than his mother
Mr. Mc Donald: Failed his family, Lindsay hated him
No mention of Spike's father
and Angel himself, while he tried to be a great Dad, had an awful relationship with Connor

Fred is the only one with a loving relationship with her father. This is something that the show has been criticised for before, for having a rather cynical view on the child/father relationship.

As far as SMP's acting ability to play a girl with a healthy relationship with her Dad...well I don't think she would have had a problem, she is a damn fine actress and a professional. Lesser actors than her have had to face this challenge. Chad Michael Murray plays a young man abandoned by his father and has an extremely close relationship with his mother in One Tree Hill, while in real life Murray's mother left her family when he was just a boy.

On a personal note I come from a household where my father is the one to put his three daughters before ANYTHING not my mother. I also realise that this is just my experience but I agree not all Father's are Hank Summers.

 

[Joyce Summers]

White Avenger- Don't worry, I took no offense, and I'm glad you didn't either. As for "Sadly, there are smoe men in the world who should never be allowed to have children. and they givr the rest of us a bad name."- I'm afraid that's unfortunately true.

Edit:

There was no tarring I swear! *holds hands up in mock surrender*. I feel all bad and guilty now posting what I did. hehe. I just want to state that was merely my experience with Fathers; My own and the majority of my friends fathers (maybe...i dont know we're just a weird group of coincidental similarities, hehe). However, I do firmly agree that not all men are the same. As I said, I have had a father figure in my life and I can always rely on him totally. And the man in my life is very much not in the bad category.
If you ever consider me too opinionated on this matter put it down to my own biased view through personal experiences and the fact I come from an all-female family (freaky, huh?) so Christmas dinner talks usually, for the older generations especially, tend to lead towards the anti-men thoughts.
I suppose thats the one problem with posting online....no one can tell your tone of voice! haha

 

[Kean]

White Avenger- Don't worry, I took no offense, and I'm glad you didn't either. As for "Sadly, there are smoe men in the world who should never be allowed to have children. and they givr the rest of us a bad name."- I'm afraid that's unfortunately true.

Edit:

There was no tarring I swear! *holds hands up in mock surrender*. I feel all bad and guilty now posting what I did. hehe. I just want to state that was merely my experience with Fathers; My own and the majority of my friends fathers (maybe...i dont know we're just a weird group of coincidental similarities, hehe). However, I do firmly agree that not all men are the same. As I said, I have had a father figure in my life and I can always rely on him totally. And the man in my life is very much not in the bad category.
If you ever consider me too opinionated on this matter put it down to my own biased view through personal experiences and the fact I come from an all-female family (freaky, huh?) so Christmas dinner talks usually, for the older generations especially, tend to lead towards the anti-men thoughts.
I suppose thats the one problem with posting online....no one can tell your tone of voice! haha

You can only speak fom what you lived and what you said is what you know!! My view is biased too! I can't help but be 'pro-Dad' when it was my father that I have relied on for EVERYTHING all my life. I don't have that with my mam so I'll always try and see the more positive view of fathers. Neither of us has to apologise for what we were brought up with, we just have to shut up when we start to drive people mad!!!

 

[Spirit_Of_Fred]

Hank:MIA
Mr. Harris: Abusive Alcoholic
Ira Rosenberg: Little involvement in his daughters life
Mr.Chase: Replaced affection with money
Faith never knew her Father
Angel:Hated and then ate his father
Mr.Gunn: No real mention of parents but the fact that he lived on the streets says enough
Wesley: Emotionally abusive
Lorne: I can't remember his father being mentioned but I can't imagine him having a different opinion than his mother
Mr. Mc Donald: Failed his family, Lindsay hated him
No mention of Spike's father
and Angel himself, while he tried to be a great Dad, had an awful relationship with Connor

dont forget tara's dad. he's a prime example of terrible fathers. he made her think she was a demon to control her!

 

[Kean]

dont forget tara's dad. he's a prime example of terrible fathers. he made her think she was a demon to control her!

Damn! I thought I had them all! it's weird though that father's get such a bad rap on the show! I have heard Joss speak about his Dad and Step-Dad and he only had good things to say...I'm drawing a blank!:thought:

 

[Joyce Summers]

Neither of us has to apologise for what we were brought up with, we just have to shut up when we start to drive people mad!!!

Here, here! hehe.

As for the whole Dad's having a bad rep thing on Buffy...I really can't explain that. Except that maybe it was to better emphasize how strong the women were on the show? I know Joss originally didn't want like any parents on the show (not even Joyce) so I don't know.....maybe it's something to do with children growing and learning from their parents mistakes.....::shrugs::. coz when you think about it, it wasn't just the fathers that got a bad time of it in Buffy. It was all parents. The only decent one was Joyce.
I mean you have Sheila Rosenberg- totally distant from her daughter, so much she didn't realize she'd cut her hair till fives months later, Jessica Harris- the name 'Harris' should alone explain the bad parents, the entire MaClay family was the uberbad and I'm trying to think of others....but yeah, I don't know. I think it was only Buffy who had a good parent, even if it was only the one.

 

[Kean]

Here, here! hehe.

As for the whole Dad's having a bad rep thing on Buffy...I really can't explain that. Except that maybe it was to better emphasize how strong the women were on the show? I know Joss originally didn't want like any parents on the show (not even Joyce) so I don't know.....maybe it's something to do with children growing and learning from their parents mistakes.....::shrugs::. coz when you think about it, it wasn't just the fathers that got a bad time of it in Buffy. It was all parents. The only decent one was Joyce.
I mean you have Sheila Rosenberg- totally distant from her daughter, so much she didn't realize she'd cut her hair till fives months later, Jessica Harris- the name 'Harris' should alone explain the bad parents, the entire MaClay family was the uberbad and I'm trying to think of others....but yeah, I don't know. I think it was only Buffy who had a good parent, even if it was only the one.

Maybe it was to emphasise that blood doesn't necassarily make a family. I think the show goes out of its way to show how a family created by oneself can be stronger, happier and better than the one God gave ya. I mean the loyalty shown by the Scoobies and The Fang Gang is a hell of a lot more than A LOT of blood families show.

 

[Joyce Summers]

Hmmm...I think you may have hit the nail on the head there with the 'sometimes family are the ones you choose' theory. Because wasn't that essentially what the entire episode 'family' was about. Where Mr MaClay says 'we are her blood kin! Who the hell are you?' and Buffy replies 'we're family'.
And you're right that the Scoobies are just as close as blood families, if not more so because they understand each other so much more. You get me? I always thought it was nice though they had the fatherly roleness in Giles. Twas sad though that none of them realized how much they turned to Joyce as a Mother figure though until she died (I think that was in an actor interview somewhere, how they only noticed the impact she had on their lives once she was no longer there with them. Might have been nick brendon, possible Alyson. Possibly neither and I'm just way off! haha)

 

[Kean]

Hmmm...I think you may have hit the nail on the head there with the 'sometimes family are the ones you choose' theory. Because wasn't that essentially what the entire episode 'family' was about. Where Mr MaClay says 'we are her blood kin! Who the hell are you?' and Buffy replies 'we're family'.
And you're right that the Scoobies are just as close as blood families, if not more so because they understand each other so much more. You get me? I always thought it was nice though they had the fatherly roleness in Giles. Twas sad though that none of them realized how much they turned to Joyce as a Mother figure though until she died (I think that was in an actor interview somewhere, how they only noticed the impact she had on their lives once she was no longer there with them. Might have been nick brendon, possible Alyson. Possibly neither and I'm just way off! haha)

It sounds like a Nick Brendon comment to me, but yeah I get what you mean. Sometimes the 'family' you make with your friends IS better because unlike blood relations they are not obligated to care about you, they just do, they choose to have you in their life and thats a pretty massive thing when you think about it.

 

[Joyce Summers]

Yeah, it is a pretty massive thing. I mean family have no choice, friends they choose to care and with it comes their freedom to tell you to shut up when you're being an idiot. haha.
And I think maybe you're right, I think it was a Nick interview.....I think it was the same one where he said he and Sarah always hoped Buffy and Xander would get it together, hehe.

 

[Kean]

haha! that would have been funny in a spike/buffy 'Something Blue' kind of way! not sure if I would have liked them as an actual couple, I think it would have been similar to what happened with Riley. Buffy pushing him away...I'm still living in denial and hoping cordy is brought back from the dead so they can live happily ever after!

 

[nerd4hire]

This is turning into kind of an interesting conversation. I'd never even thought about how there aren't any good fathers in the Buffyverse.

I'm racking my brain trying to think of a contradiction. Giles is a good father figure I guess, but even then you can't say father figures are the way to go because there's the mayor. Cordelia's dad, maybe, but one gets the opinion he spoiled her rotten. Is that the way to go? I have to go all the way over to the Angelverse for Mr. Burkle, Fred's dad.

 

[Kean]

There are a few character's parents that we know nothing about but from what we do know Mr. Burkle is all on his lonesome, although mothers don't get quite as bad a rep their is still a distinct lack of strong parental figures.

 

[palabravampiress]

I'm on board with the "family that you choose" theory, myself.

As an avid General Hospital fan, this is nothing new. On GH, there are so many paternity scandals and brainwashes and back-from-the-dead stories that it ends up so that adoption plays a key role in the makeup of most of those families. Joss builds a family by choice on Firefly, too. I think that's a powerful notion. It speaks to the human capacity to love for selfless reasons.

That said, I do wish that someone on Buffy had a good relationship with his or her father. Dads aren't all deadbeats. My own father and I, for example, are very close. Family by choice is great. But family by blood can be just as good.