Canon Watch (Spoilers for current issue)

Buffy 8:10 - Anywhere But Here

As we know, Willow can fly now. She can also handle a passenger. She can teleport with at least 2 passengers, I think, because Buffy says "teleport again" which I'm guessing refers to her and Satsu from the Twilight stronghold in an earlier issue. We know Amy can at least do onesies.

Buffy doesn't like the flying with Willow thing, even though she rappels out of helicopters. Is this because she doesn't feel in control, or because she doesn't trust Willow? It's an interesting question, I think, because the theme of this issue is kind of a lies and betrayal thing.

BuffyWillowflying.jpg


Willow and Buffy meet a new character named Robin. Not Wood, this one's a girl. It's going to take a little explaining and a few frames to get you up to date on this one.

Dark Horse (the publisher of the comic) ran a competition at their MySpace page. It was an essay competition based on the topic, "How Buffy Changed Your Life". The prize was having a character written into the comic based on the person who's life was changed. The winner was a guy who's wife was being taken over by schizophrenia about the same time she was discovering Buffy.

OK, so Willow and Buffy fly to a location where a girl is sitting in front of a hovel. They are there to see a demon named Sephrillian. He "walks between worlds. Reality tends to buckle around those guys." Sephrilian's thing seems to be time. Past, present, and future can happen simultaneously around Sephrilian. Willow is more sensitive to it, and linear time becomes less linear to her just by being in the general area. Sephrillian is in the hovel. It's bigger on the inside a la Doctor Who.

Robin (who is based on the contest winner's wife Robin) is what's called a Minder. Her plight in the comic has similarities with the real Robin's, real world schizophrenia. Willow describes a Minder like this.

Any unstable reality field is potentially dangerous, even cataclysmic, so someone has to watch over it.

Also...

Robintheminder1.jpg


Robintheminder2.jpg


Robintheminder3.jpg


Here's one that's nothing to do with canon, but I think it's interesting. Willow and Buffy enter the shack, and descend a giant staircase. Buffy wonders why there are no escalators to Hell. As they descend Buffy muses over a wisecrack she delivered to Robin. She says if the time loop gets loopy again she's going to change that wisecrack. Willow replies, "Ah...Spirit D'escolier". I think they spelled it wrong, but here's the Wikipedia definition.

L'esprit de l'escalier (literally, stairway wit) is a French term that describes the predicament of thinking of the right comeback too late.

It's been mentioned earlier that Dawn has grown into a giantess. This was done with magic, and has something to do with her losing her virginity. It also concerns a college relationship she had with someone called Kenny who we are told is something called a Thricewise. We get a look at what Kenny actually looks like.

PictureofKenny.jpg


Up until now Willow hasn't been able to restore Dawn to her real size. Dawn has been keeping a secret. Willow needs to know the truth of what happened or she can't get a fix on what kind of magic was used. Here's Dawn's secret.

KennysRoommate.jpg


Dawn lost her virginity to Kenny the Thricewise's college roommate. His name was nick. That's canonically significant, I guess. He was a bad boy, played in a band type. Xander makes a crack about Parker Abrahms; letting Dawn know her sister was no better. Apparently Dawn didn't know that story.

In this issue they switch back and forth from the Buffy and Willow story to the Dawn and Xander story.

Buffy and Willow meet Sephrilian.

Sephrilian1.jpg


We learn a new word. Tichajt - means one of the demon elite.

Notice he has those four screens on his tail.

Seprilian2.jpg


Sephrillian says...

All my faces are there to see, but you humans...you have too many

It says that in reference to the fact Willow and Buffy have been lying to each other. They have been showing multiple faces.

Sephrilian also says...

Lies, delusions gross simplifications...these are what make mankind. No fault in it; your brains could not contain the horrible beauty of total awareness. You run from it, as from a predator. You escape.

So is the human mind more complex than the demon mind in the Buffyverse, or more simple. I can't figure it out, but I suspect some important philosophical point is being made there.

What are the specific deceptions Sephrilian is speaking of here you ask.

First of all, remember how Buffy won't tell Willow where the money is coming from to finance the slayer army? Here's where it comes from...

SlayerrobSwissbank.jpg


Buffy gets caught lying a second time here, and must admit she led the raid on the swiss bank. She refers to it as a victimless crime. She says it's all insured, and references the fact a lot of old nazi loot is stored in Swiss banks. Buffy appears to be lying, not just to Willow, but to herself.

Willow's deception is different. She has been keeping Buffy from Kennedy. The excuse she tells Buffy is there's a rift between Kennedy and Willow. Something about a mystical death experience Kennedy had. That apparently is kind of true, but the real reason Willow is keeping Kennedy away from Buffy is she still feels guilty about connecting Tara to Buffy. She believes no good can come from such a connection.

There are also glimpses into Willow and Buffy's pasts and futures.

Willow's

WillowandSnakeWoman.jpg


Buffy's

InjuredBuffy.jpg


There appears to be debate as to whether or not the Willow with the snake woman scene is from Willow's future or past. I direct them to this post from the episode discussion thread.

Edit
Joss Whedon has since suggested it is Willow's past.

Buffy-Boards - View Single Post - Discussion of Episode 8:10 Released 01/02/07 (Dark Horse)

But continuing on with the canon stuff...

In the process of seeking the truth from Sephrilian Buffy has revealed all her secrets. Sephrilian threatens to share the secrets with its demon brethern.

It's Slaytime.

Slaytime.jpg


I guess what's happening in the above graphic is up for interpretation, but to me Willow seems to have created a magic weapon and put it in Buffy's hands. She did something similar when Buffy was rescuing Willow from the Twilight base in an earlier issue. This looks to be a new trick the two of them can do.

This issue ends with Buffy and Willow walking away in separate directions. So now there's a rift between Buffy and all of Willow, Giles, Faith, and Dawn. Buffy is steadily finding herself more alone. You can perhaps add Spike and Angel to that list. I'm not sure how the timeline of the 2 verses works out, but at some point Andrew convinced Angel and Spike Buffy is with the Immortal.
 
A
alexa
need some rep for all that work
I need to bump this thread to the next page, so it won't load as slow with new pics in the next issue. So I don't know...somebody discuss something with me for a few posts.

Now that you've had a chance to get used to it, do you have any problems accepting the comics as canon?

In other discussions on the board, do you find yourself factoring in occurrences from the comics to adjust understanding on storylines and characters?

Of Buffy Season 8 and Angel: After the Fall, does one or the other feel more canon-y than the other, even though you know they both are?
 
Ok I'll play

I see season 8 as canon, as Buffy. AFT I take with a pinch of salt
 
I haven't even picked up an ATF comic but from an outsider's view I guess it's canon to me. Plus Joss said it was canon and whatever Joss the Boss* says we should listen. 🙂

* If there's a 'Stan the Man' Lee there can be a friggen 'Joss the Boss' Whedon lol.
 
Season 8 is most definitely cannon to me. Joss is the one running the show, he's written most of the issues so far, and baically, it rocks so it's cannon, lol

Angel: After the Fall? eh. i just can't accept the storyline. i mean, come on! a psychic fish? Spike living in the playboy mansion? blah. i know Joss says it's cannon, and he's behind it, but i think that Lynch is trying way to hard to incorporate stuff from his other ATS comics into Season 6, thus making them cannon. like the fish. maybe when this arc is over, it'll get better, but right now, i'm not buying it. plus, the art sucks!!
 
Why can't you lot accept that After the Fall is canon? Joss says it's cannon, the other writers say it's cannon, the people that sell it say it's cannon, it's obviously cannon =|
 
the basic reason is i don't like it. it doesn't seem like something the gang would do and i don't like the story line. i think it's because Joss isn't the one behind the wheel, it doesn't even seem like he's giving directions. which makes me feel that it's not really Joss' work.
 
I accept the fact that Angel After the Fall is canon. I just think that they ruined everything. There's so much more that could have been done with the way the series ended. Instead we get AI in Wonderland with the talking fishies, the skank sluts at the mansion, and the X-Men hidden in the factory.
 
Anyway, the question was...

Of Buffy Season 8 and Angel: After the Fall, does one or the other feel more canon-y than the other, even though you know they both are?

It's not really about the fact A:AtF is canon. It's about the way you might feel in spite of that fact. Apparently some people feel the same way about Buffy Season 8. They know it's canon, but they just don't connect with it as such. I personally am not one of those people BTW. Not with B-8 anyway.
 
Anyway, the question was...



It's not really about the fact A:AtF is canon. It's about the way you might feel in spite of that fact. Apparently some people feel the same way about Buffy Season 8. They know it's canon, but they just don't connect with it as such.

Well my answer is that Buffy feels more canon to me than Angel does. I thought my dislike for After The Fall made that clear.
 
nerd4hire
nerd4hire
Yeah, I know. I was addressing the one 2 posts above yours.
8.11 A Beautiful Sunset

I'm thinking the big introduction into canon for 8.11 is more conceptual than literal. We're familiar with the concept of actions having consequences in Buffy. It's often introduced in a supernatural context, but it's there.

In this issue Buffy wrestles with the idea her gifting of power to so many girls may have consequences. She begins to doubt the moral righteousness of her action. More specifically though the concept introduced clearly into canon here is this one...

narration1.jpg


narration2.jpg


narration3.jpg


narration4.jpg

This might be important. I think it's always been clear the experience of being slayerfied is emotionally powerful, but I don't think it's ever been shown with this kind of detail

slayerfication.jpg


Knocks Satsu on her butt. Makes her smile and cry.

We've seen criminal slayers before - Faith, Fray, Lady Genevieve Savidge, Buffy herself robbed a Swiss bank last issue - but now we have another. Simone Doffler and her gang of thieves, at least one other of which is a slayer.

SimoneDoffler2.jpg


Dawn drinks. At least in Scotland she does. Apparently she's legal drinking age there. She can be forgiven here though. She has a weight taken off her shoulders after telling Xander her secret last issue. She's happier now they tell us. She can get it into party mode now.

DawnDrunk2.jpg


OK, I don't hear anybody else making a fuss about this, but my opinion - the below matters. I'll explain why after you see it.

Slayerpowerboosts.jpg


Want a good argument? Post a post suggesting there may be something significant about the way Buffy appears to rise stronger from her first death in Season 1, or after getting skewered in Chosen. For those one, or two who might agree with me, don't you think there may be another clue to the puzzle of slayer power boosts in the above?

As has been mentioned earlier, the new slayer, Satsu, is in love with Buffy. Through a process too intricate to show without posting 3 or 4 disconnected pages Buffy lets her down easy.

The best I can condense it down is with this...

BuffyletsdownSatsu.jpg


Moving on though. As you may have gathered one of the main mysteries of Season 8 is who, is Twilight (the big bad). A number of clues are offered in this issue, but I won't bother getting into them, because we don't know which ones are red herrings, and which ones are real clues. It is the big mystery of the series so far though. That in itself is I believe canonically significant.

I will say this though...Twilight can fly.

TwilightFlying.jpg
 
And he can fly through buildings without getting hurt.. break swords with his fist.. and in the above pic seems like he can't be decapitated (with that outfit on.. maybe.)

Also the pic you showed of Buffy looking at Satsu she's talking about her dream in Restless with the mud on her face. 😀
 
nerd4hire
nerd4hire
Thanks :)
Good call on the mud scenes in Restless. What caught my eye though was the idea that although Satsu wasn't as fast as Buffy at that time she would be in the future. I don't think there's a clear explanation for that. As such I think it may be one of those things that can be used used as support in a suggestion of possible explanations as to how parts of the Buffyverse might work behind the scenes.
 
Yeah.. that talk has been around for a while. I remember when Faith fought the beast on Ats people wondered if Buffy was somehow absorbing Faith's slayer powers. Actually I'm still disappointed that Faith didn't get to recover and kill him, but that's beside the topic I guess.

For now I'm of the opinion that with experience and confidence you become a better slayer. Plus it was such a funny panel, very Joss. Buffy's really cool then 'ahhhh -splat' 😛 One of the few times I've laughed out loud in this season.
 
Yes, can the slayer get power boosts? This has been a much debated topic, on this board at least. Here's a little more fuel to that fire, I think.
 
Yes, can the slayer get power boosts? This has been a much debated topic, on this board at least. Here's a little more fuel to that fire, I think.

Would the spell that helped Buffy kill Adam class as a power boost?
 
nerd4hire
nerd4hire
I'd say so, and if we see it in concept do we see it in practice? That's the question.
Good call on the mud scenes in Restless. What caught my eye though was the idea that although Satsu wasn't as fast as Buffy at that time she would be in the future. I don't think there's a clear explanation for that. As such I think it may be one of those things that can be used used as support in a suggestion of possible explanations as to how parts of the Buffyverse might work behind the scenes.

There is actually some canonical support for that, though: Not only does Riley comment on Buffy's power increasing ("You're getting stronger every day, more powerful. I can't touch you. Every day, you're just ... a little further out of my reach."), throughout the series, we see it.
 
I always assume that it's something akin to the Saiya-Jinn race from Dragonball. The heroes there, particularly the Saiya-Jinns face off against increasingly tougher opponents, but every time manage to win (if barely), they're a race of born fighters and every fight makes them a little bit stronger.

I think it's the same with Vampires and Slayers in the Buffyverse. The demon in them that grants them their power increases in strength after successful battles.

It's pretty common in this type of fiction, where the villains pose a physical threat. The writers try to come up with a bigger, bad-er, and stronger villain every season. Result is that the protagonist also has to get stronger.
 
I don't know about the cant be decapitated thing, cuz if you look at their hands, Buffys are in a position where she's pulling the scythe towards his neck, while his are on the opposite side, pushing it away from him, which to me would mean that he's of equal or greater strength?
 
Good point BEG. I actually noticed that later, but didn't think to go back to edit. I think I will now though, because that may be important.

Edit

Oh wait a minute now... It wasn't me who said that, at least not here. I may have on another thread.
 
Back
Top Bottom