Characters / Big Bads You Feel Were Wasted

Joshua

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What are some characters and big bads / mini baddies do you feel were wasted? Personally for me:

I think they wasted on the Uber Vamps in Season 7. I personally found them more interesting and terrifying than The First Evil posing as a bunch of characters I didn't give a rat's behind for (only scenes I loved from The First were when they posed as Robin's mom, Buffy, Cassie and Drusilla). I loved when Buffy got her ass kicked for the first time since the S6 finale by a uber vamp.

Also I wish Amy Madison wasn't randomly converted to evil randomly out of the blue in Season 6/Season 7. Wasn't she a friend of some sort with the rest of the Scoobies? Or was she just hanging out with Willow?
 
Dawn. I mean, I love Dawnie and all that but come on - she has no arc.
Kendra. You'd expect a vampire slayer to be a bigger deal in a show titled Buffy the Vampire Slayer. No, she's in 3 episodes. Seriously?!
Caleb. Caleb needed more screen time. 'Nuff said.
Adam. It's a zombie/demon/robot hybrid. Can you believe they didn't give him a viking axe and a parrot? OK, a pirate hat would be fine too.
 
I wasn't a fan of the uber vamps. I found them to be very inconsistently written, and was it just me or did they look rather on the wee side which made them even less threatening to me. 😀
 
Mr. Trick was one of the bad guys I thought could be an interesting character for a few more episodes. Since he was technically competent, he could have faced off against Willow in a Willow-centric episode where he would try to take a bite out of her and she would take a byte out of him.

Caleb should have been around for most of Season 7. Instead of the dumb story of Spike being controlled by the first, we should have had a Bringers' Council as the counterpart to the Watchers' Council with Caleb as their president. They would track various potentials, kill some, but have Giles spirit some of them away in the nick of time. That was we wouldn't have a glut of them appearing all at once.

Principal Snyder appears to have had some knowledge of the workings of the hellmouth. Let's see how he got to where he got and what alliances he made and his relationship with the mayor, who he was truly afraid of.

Ben was the counterpart to Glory but let's see what happened to get him in that position. He was thoroughly versed in what was going on because an ordinary person cannot just call down a Queller demon to clean up a security breach.

What made Halfrek into a vengeance demon? Enquiring minds want to know.

Maybe Hank Summers isn't really a big bad, but he has caused some ruination and dropped the ball with child support in Season 6.

Ethan Rayne only shows up four times, but he always leaves me wanting to see more of him, both for his own antics and as a window into Giles' past.

Quentin Travers, like Ethan Rayne, only shows up four times but he is the one who insists on the cruciamentum (but assumes no responsibility for the kidnapping and endangerment of Joyce), attempts to have his wetworks team kill Faith, fires Giles and generally does as much damage as some of the baddies.

The story with Veruca could have lasted a little longer, but then again, maybe we had just enough of her.

We need more Olaf in our lives!

Lyle and Tector Gorch could have had more of a presence.

We could have had more of the family dynamic with Uncle Enyos to show the gypsy point of view.

I would have watched a whole season based on Sweet from OMWF.

Lissa, as played by Ashanti, should have been a bigger part of the bad guy's plans than the one episode where she captures Xander.

Kakistos is only in one episode - should have been more.

I concur with the OP about the Ubervamps. Somehow they went from almost unkillable to stake fodder without an explanation.
 
- Dawn: As a kid character, I didn't expect anything. Then she was given a sprinkle of development in the S7, and then fizzles out. I personally went ape sh*t in a good way when the 'Potential locator ball thingy' went through Dawn and knocked her back first into the front door...she was all afterglowy and everyone was all 'holy crap Dawn's a potential!'.
- Robin Wood: I like the concept of 'the son of a Slayer', but after the hype and mystery of which side he was on concluded, he doesn't really do anything noteworthy other than sexy times with Faith...that bas***d! This man developed in the womb of a Slayer, but wasn't given anything special physically. Personally, I would have enjoyed him being 'better than the average bear boobo'
-The First: A entity with an infinite amount of potential but I feel was rarely used practically. The First could have done a number of things to break the minds of the good guys before the final battle, and win the battle before it was even fought. I feel that the show should have clearly illustrated the First's limitations when it comes to it's appearances.

cheers
 
While they were by no means wasted, a little more depth to Xander, Anya, Oz, and Tara. Aside from the whole wedding arc Xander wasn't given nearly as much to do in the last few seasons; as has already been pointed out, we know very little about Anya except that she likes Xander, money, and is brutally honest; the "wolf" side of Oz needed to be explored earlier on in Season 3 (I understand things didn't go as intended in Season 4 due to Seth Green leaving the show); Tara needed relationships with other characters outside of Willow and Dawn. And speaking of Dawn, she just kind of hung around (**** it, she didn't do much but whine) in Season 6. I wanted that whole "Dawn talking to the dead" thing to be a reality. Also, Cordelia was wasted in Season 3. Thankfully she got better over on Angel.

The Master - He should've escaped halfway through the season rather than at the very end. Mark Metcalf did a good job but instead Buffy's original Big Bad spends most of his screentime monologuing and only lasts about five minutes on the outside world before Buffy kills him. I liked his return in "The Wish" -- if he'd done that much damage throughout a whole season, he would have been without a doubt my favorite Buffy villain.

Adam - Again, liked the villain but he spent way too much time talking before doing any real harm to the Scooby Gang. If the rest of his scenes had been as great as the last two episodes he was in...

The First Evil - Where to begin? A shit ton of buildup about going out with a big finish and... it does less overall damage to the Scoobies than any of the other Big Bads combined. The concept of shapeshifting into dead people was a clever one, though.

I also think The Trio should have been considered more of a threat or at least taken seriously.

Amanda was by far the best Potential and they should've given her more focus or at least let her survive. As mentioned above, once the hype about Wood trying to get revenge on Spike cleared, he didn't have all that much to do other than play hide the zucchini with Faith (*cough* mommy issues *cough*). And then even that didn't last -- he's written off in a most fan fiction-y way during Faith's first appearance in S8.
 
Tara needed relationships with other characters outside of Willow and Dawn.
I think it was a bit of a missed opportunity with Tara and Anya not being good friends. It would give them both someone outside their partners to interact with. One of my favorite episode with Tara is I Was Made To Love You. When Tara and Anya are walking and talking about computer classes and the internet. We need more scenes that give us a sense that they have a life outside of the Scoobies.

I personally enjoy The Master. But I do wish he was used better. He's better and more threatening than Adam. He at least kills a few people in the underground church. Adam just does nothing. Wasn't Maggie Walsh supposed to be in it more but the actress had to back out. Like Seth Green, maybe season 4 would have been better if the actors didn't leave. Among a lot of other things too. But Adam is a boring Big Bad, and The First was all setup no pay off. I agree about the Trio. This was discussed in another thread, but they should have been treated like more of a threat.
 
I think it was a bit of a missed opportunity with Tara and Anya not being good friends. It would give them both someone outside their partners to interact with. One of my favorite episode with Tara is I Was Made To Love You. When Tara and Anya are walking and talking about computer classes and the internet. We need more scenes that give us a sense that they have a life outside of the Scoobies.

I personally enjoy The Master. But I do wish he was used better. He's better and more threatening than Adam. He at least kills a few people in the underground church. Adam just does nothing. Wasn't Maggie Walsh supposed to be in it more but the actress had to back out. Like Seth Green, maybe season 4 would have been better if the actors didn't leave. Among a lot of other things too. But Adam is a boring Big Bad, and The First was all setup no pay off. I agree about the Trio. This was discussed in another thread, but they should have been treated like more of a threat.

Tara and Anya - YES it's a bit odd with the knowledge that they never have a scene together again, but I enjoyed the banter between them and wished we could have seen more of it.

Not sure about the Maggie Walsh actress, but I heard the same story elsewhere so I guess it's true, but if that's the case, why did she come back again at the end of the season? It's possible she had scheduling conflicts during the middle of the season but oh well. And yes I feel that if Seth Green stayed we would have explored his character a lot more.
 
In a way - Glory.
She was mostly played for comic relief (except for when she consistently beat Buffy up throughout the season, and the only reason anyone lived is because Glory conveniently decided not to go all Inquisition on them and just hung out doing what... shopping? Waiting for Buffy to come around?)

I've seen it posited that Glory was supposed to represent materialism with Buffy and co opposing her from a more 'commie'/non-materialistic kind of side of the spectrum. This is one of those things where I feel thinky-fans are just looking way too far into the text and adjusting it to the notions they want it to fit to. Glory was, technically speaking, too big of a bite for the -verse to take on. A God. How could Buffy possibly beat a god? Well, she can if we make the god intensely dimwitted and kind of docile and definitely shallow even in her non-repressed states. We also never really go a satisfying answer, in my mind, to who the whole Glory/Ben division worked, as in - how could Ben possibly survive "sharing" a body with an entity so superior to his own... So yeah, definitely Glory.

And not really necessary to say the First as well. Another bite too big for the verse. They clearly did not know what to do with it and just had this "bad" walking around babbling about how 'bad' it is... zzzzzzzzz.... Undefeatable supervillains made defeatable in the last two seconds... boring and usually the subjects of lazy writing.
 
Fuffy Baith
Fuffy Baith
I agree. Glory should have been better.
Dawn. I mean, I love Dawnie and all that but come on - she has no arc.
Kendra. You'd expect a vampire slayer to be a bigger deal in a show titled Buffy the Vampire Slayer. No, she's in 3 episodes. Seriously?!
Caleb. Caleb needed more screen time. 'Nuff said.
Adam. It's a zombie/demon/robot hybrid. Can you believe they didn't give him a viking axe and a parrot? OK, a pirate hat would be fine too.

I don't agree with you about Kendra. I think she always had a limited appeal and I think the writers knew this. Three episodes was about right for me, plus you have the bonus of the surprise when she was killed off. But when Faith came along they knew they were onto a great character.

In a way - Glory.
She was mostly played for comic relief (except for when she consistently beat Buffy up throughout the season, and the only reason anyone lived is because Glory conveniently decided not to go all Inquisition on them and just hung out doing what... shopping? Waiting for Buffy to come around?)

I've seen it posited that Glory was supposed to represent materialism with Buffy and co opposing her from a more 'commie'/non-materialistic kind of side of the spectrum. This is one of those things where I feel thinky-fans are just looking way too far into the text and adjusting it to the notions they want it to fit to. Glory was, technically speaking, too big of a bite for the -verse to take on.
A God. How could Buffy possibly beat a god? Well, she can if we make the god intensely dimwitted and kind of docile and definitely shallow even in her non-repressed states. We also never really go a satisfying answer, in my mind, to who the whole Glory/Ben division worked, as in - how could Ben possibly survive "sharing" a body with an entity so superior to his own... So yeah, definitely Glory.

And not really necessary to say the First as well. Another bite too big for the verse. They clearly did not know what to do with it and just had this "bad" walking around babbling about how 'bad' it is... zzzzzzzzz.... Undefeatable supervillains made defeatable in the last two seconds... boring and usually the subjects of lazy writing.

You forgot the scene with Spike that was one of the highlights of the season. I'm a big Glory fan. I wasn't the first time around, but the second time I really got into the performance from Claire Kramer. Not only is it a very ripe and charasmatic performance, but its very physically credible too. I do think there is more depth to the character than first appears, and part of that comes from Kramer's performance. I don't know about the materialism argument. Sounds a bit far fetched but its interesting anyway.
 
In a way - Glory.
She was mostly played for comic relief (except for when she consistently beat Buffy up throughout the season, and the only reason anyone lived is because Glory conveniently decided not to go all Inquisition on them and just hung out doing what... shopping? Waiting for Buffy to come around?)

Good point. An insane Hell god (that scared other gods) that sucked on people's brains should've been...a lot scarier? A lot more threatening? But, although she's powerful, the writers have to make Glory really stupid, careless and lazy for the middle half of the season to suspend disbelief.
Although the 'defeating her out of nowhere' isn't S5's problem- the ways they beat Glory are cleverly scattered throughout the season and then come to a head at the end.

Pulling a solution to beat the uber-bad guy out of your ass at the last minute? That would be Season 4- Adam the unbeatable getting his ass handed to him by some super-Buffy spell? That was dramatically weak writing.

That's where the 'escalation of bad guys' comes from as well. Season 1 and 2 had vampires, Season 3 had a slayer/true demon, and so the writers thought they had to keep on upping the threat level.
 
In a way - Glory.
This is one of those things where I feel thinky-fans are just looking way too far into the text and adjusting it to the notions they want it to fit to. Glory was, technically speaking, too big of a bite for the -verse to take on. A God. How could Buffy possibly beat a god? Well, she can if we make the god intensely dimwitted and kind of docile and definitely shallow even in her non-repressed states.

For example, people who were born extremely wealthy oftentimes have characteristics that are the result of never having their power (so to speak) challenged and as a result never having been challenged to be different, to change, to grow, etc. because there exists no external pressure or stress to motivate that change. Glory can easily be interpreted along the same lines: she was an undisputed God of her own hell domain, and never experienced a serious challenge to her power. Especially over the course of millennia, she could indulge or fall victim to her own personal vices (or if she had them from the beginning, she never needed to outgrow them), her vanity and shallowness and laziness and more, because there was no outside pressure or stress to force her to change or adapt or evolve. A look at the history of powerful people in Western history, popes, statesmen and more, will furnish many examples of people with gross character flaws far more numerous then the average person, because they can afford to be. I don't think it requires a too-thinky person to think the presentation of Glory made sense.

And also, Glory is evil, from tip to toe. She always has been. I imagine evil people (with lots of undisputed power especially) like being vain and worshiped and self-indulgent. I imagine they are more likely to be that way, because I imagine evil people can see no problem with it and they probably feel entitled to all of that too. A God as evil from Glory from the start, God of her own hell domain for as long as she was...I was surprised she didn't have more fatal character flaws then she did to be honest. I imagine a truly evil God with unchallenged power would be vain, shallow, conceited, arrogant, etc. and like it, and enjoy it...and indulge in it, of course.

I like that Glory is what she is in the show. I thought it was interesting to watch an evil Hell God of her nature especially have to come to terms with her lack of humanity (all her numerous flaws of course add up to total lack of humanity) when removed from her hell dimension and forced to have to account for the first time with other things, like humanity, a conscience (eventually, if only briefly and misunderstood) other powerful people with power that could challenge her, even if only briefly, people with the audacity to challenge her, etc. It didn't change her, but that was part of the interesting thing about S5. I was intrigued by Glory's psychology. 
But, although she's powerful, the writers have to make Glory really stupid, careless and lazy for the middle half of the season to suspend disbelief.
Although the 'defeating her out of nowhere' isn't S5's problem- the ways they beat Glory are cleverly scattered throughout the season and then come to a head at the end.

I think her stupidity is more a function (or consequence) of her gross character flaws, which I think are easily enough explained by what I explained at the beginning of this post^^^. Or in other words, she's not stupid really, so much as just SO vain and shallow etc. that she makes difficult decisions to understand by normal people, and that seem stupid without knowing her background. I think there is a difference: not stupid, that wouldn't be quite accurate considering where she came from, it's just the logic of someone extremely shallow, vain etc. which admittedly can sound very foolish or stupid sometimes to the rest of us. Her logic can make sense or be internally consistent though, within the context of what she is, whereas stupid people often are incapable of that.
 
Mr Trick
Mr Trick
Great argument!
Riley.
They had the chance to give Buffy an interesting, non vampire related love interest.
They didn't use the opputunity and we got captain cardboard instead...

(I have nothing against Riley, it's more my anger towards the writers that barely fleshed him out- IIRC, he was in more episodes than Faith was, but barely has development in comparison to her.)
 
Riley.
They had the chance to give Buffy an interesting, non vampire related love interest.
They didn't use the opputunity and we got captain cardboard instead...

(I have nothing against Riley, it's more my anger towards the writers that barely fleshed him out- IIRC, he was in more episodes than Faith was, but barely has development in comparison to her.)

Except that the actor playing him was also really bland. Besides which its possible that he was boring on purpose to show that ultimatly Buffy cannot be in a normal relationship, don't forgot Scott was a bit on the dull side.
 
And also, Glory is evil, from tip to toe. She always has been. I imagine evil people (with lots of undisputed power especially) like being vain and worshiped and self-indulgent. I imagine they are more likely to be that way, because I imagine evil people can see no problem with it and they probably feel entitled to all of that too. A God as evil from Glory from the start, God of her own hell domain for as long as she was...I was surprised she didn't have more fatal character flaws then she did to be honest. I imagine a truly evil God with unchallenged power would be vain, shallow, conceited, arrogant, etc. and like it, and enjoy it...and indulge in it, of course.
.

To each his own I guess. To me evil people are better represented as most of all kind of paranoid about keeping their power. Entitled yes, but aware of threats. (To speak mythologically speaking - classical mainly - pretty much all gods are fierce about worship, not so much expecting it as demanding it). So for me someone through and through evil like Glory is supposed to be wouldn't so much be vapidly enjoying being worshipped without alertness, because, well, no one goes unthreatened. I.e. I imagine more of an "off with their heads type", not a "let's threaten and threaten and threaten until maybe they give me what I want". So for me, Illyria as we first see her makes sense as a God to me. Glory should have been a demi-god at best.

And yes, I like her too on the show, because she's pretty funny. But she doesn't make sense to me and I think they were just goofing off half of the time, not sure what to do with her. And I do think that they were just trying to go bigger and bigger, which is a mistake many shows make, instead of trying to make something of more substance and quality.
 
Faith in Season 7 of Buffy. They could've done more with her.

I wanted to see her interact with Xander and Willow beyond the superficiality of what we got. Some resolution to those relationships would've been very nice to see.

I agree with you on that -- again, Faith obviously patched things up with both of them (she probably reconciled with Xander offscreen, otherwise it would be difficult for them to be in the same room again) but I would've liked to see it: Faith coming to terms with the fact that the people she hurt needed an apology, Willow and Xander's reactions to hearing that she'd turned over a new leaf.
 
Fuffy
Fuffy
THIS !
To each his own I guess. To me evil people are better represented as most of all kind of paranoid about keeping their power. Entitled yes, but aware of threats. (To speak mythologically speaking - classical mainly - pretty much all gods are fierce about worship, not so much expecting it as demanding it). So for me someone through and through evil like Glory is supposed to be wouldn't so much be vapidly enjoying being worshipped without alertness, because, well, no one goes unthreatened. I.e. I imagine more of an "off with their heads type", not a "let's threaten and threaten and threaten until maybe they give me what I want". So for me, Illyria as we first see her makes sense as a God to me. Glory should have been a demi-god at best.

And yes, I like her too on the show, because she's pretty funny. But she doesn't make sense to me and I think they were just goofing off half of the time, not sure what to do with her. And I do think that they were just trying to go bigger and bigger, which is a mistake many shows make, instead of trying to make something of more substance and quality.

Don't agree with this, surly being a demi-god and being evil goes hand in hand with feeling untouchable because unlike Buffy Glory has that sort of ego.
 
Don't agree with this, surly being a demi-god and being evil goes hand in hand with feeling untouchable because unlike Buffy Glory has that sort of ego.

*shrug*

I've been studying mythology off and on for some time and the one thing pretty much all mythological gods or demi-gods, evil or not, have in common is that none (exception to the rule might be Apollo) of them feel particularly untouchable. At least not against worthy foes. Either way, to each his own.
 
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