Chosen to Fray - Fury discusses.

[nerd4hire]

David Fury had some interesting stuff to say on the whole what happens between Chosen an Fray thing.

JOZIC: I know a lot of people, especially after reading the Fray mini-series where Joss alludes to the last slayer before Fray come into the picture 200 years later, who thought that Buffy was going to die at the end of season 7. I asked Jane Espenson about it and she said that, as far as she knew, there wasn't any plan to have Buffy die - that it wasn't in Joss' plan.

FURY: No, and I'm not really sure that in the Fray series it indicated that the slayer did die.

JOZIC: There was a big portal, or something, and all the demons were coming out - very much like the end of Angel"¦

FURY: Right.

JOZIC: "¦but basically, the slayer pushed all the demons back and followed them in, sealing the thing off...

FURY: Interesting. I didn't remember that.

JOZIC: "¦and then there was no slayer for the next 200 years.

FURY: All I do remember was that there was a definitive story.

One can only suspect that that story has yet to be told for Buffy.

JOZIC: I know Joss also said that the slayer mythology had kind of grown over the year or two that he was writing Fray, so"¦

FURY: Yeah, the last season did require a lot of rethinking in terms of the potential slayers. You know, Joss' thing, and rightly so, is that he allowed the mythology to serve whatever story he wanted to tell so he didn't lock himself into a concrete mythology that would limit him. If he had a story he wanted to tell, he would adjust the mythology accordingly. A lot of people had their own ideas about how slayers were called, or if they knew they were going to be called, or if they go through life blindly or do they have watchers all their life like Kendra did or does a watcher come to them in the last second like it did for Buffy at the point where they were about to be called? Those are things which just kind of"¦whatever fits the correct way to tell a story of all girls and about all the potential they have to be heroes. So, yeah, he certainly adjusted it accordingly.

As far as Buffy [being] sealed up inside, it's very possible that Joss had the idea"¦well, I will say this. Very early in the season, the finale was going to be Buffy having to force the Hellmouth open. I don't remember it being so much about being in cave spaces, it might have been, but the point of it was they were trying so hard to keep the Hellmouth closed that she realized that the only way to do this is to open the Hellmouth. It was one of those ways of thinking that we were going to figure out later but to defeat them you have to open the Hellmouth wide. Probably at some point when Joss was writing Fray he thought that, when that happens, Willow casts this spell which creates sort of a vacuum effect and that Buffy would be sealed inside, but I think ultimately he decided that wasn't the way to end the series - for Buffy to be potentially dead.

JOZIC: He also never specified that the last slayer was Buffy"¦

FURY: I talked to him about it when he was writing Fray and I think that he always had the sense that it was Buffy. But the fact that it's left vague in the comics makes it open for interpretation. People can decide whatever they want and Joss can certainly decide it's not Buffy, but at the time he wrote it he believed that it was Buffy. That she was the last slayer before Fray was called. I think it gave Buffy a greater stake in the mythology to know that she was the last one before Fray was called.

But, like I said, that's a story yet to be told.

http://www.mikejozic.com/buffyweek6.html

 

[Cordelia Chase*]

Interesing. I've never read any of these comics but wow.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

Yeah seriously intresting!! Its good to see even the main guys are confused by that storyline!!

 

[The Arcane]

Very interesting read, and i can see how the activation of all the slayers in season seven may have forced him to alter his original plans for where Buffy ends and Fray begins ... although nothing is stopping Joss from using my idea to tie up the various threads of Buffy, Angel and Fray. It allows for the existence of all the slayers and connects all the dots of the three storylines.

You hear that, Joss? All you need do is get in touch! All i expect is a writers credit! 😀

 

[nerd4hire]

I found this part interesting -

FURY: No, and I'm not really sure that in the Fray series it indicated that the slayer did die.

JOZIC: There was a big portal, or something, and all the demons were coming out - very much like the end of Angel…

FURY: Right.

JOZIC: …but basically, the slayer pushed all the demons back and followed them in, sealing the thing off...

FURY: Interesting. I didn't remember that.

JOZIC: …and then there was no slayer for the next 200 years.

So could that explain how the line goes from multiple slayers in Chosen to single slayer in Fray?

Is it possible the line passes through Buffy in Season 7, so it can't pass to anyone else for as long as her essence is trapped in the demon dimension?

I mean yeah there's still that bit in Fray where he's telling Mel how other slayers were around with the power, but never called. Could he have been talking about all the potentials-now-slayers who would have been around after Buffy's death. He doesn't clearly define any time period, as as I know.

Or I don't know TW, was that your theory? If not catch me up. What was it?

 

[The Arcane]

Or I don't know TW, was that your theory? If not catch me up. What was it?

The last time i mentioned it was as part of this discussion but basically it is as follows.

At some point in the near future the Senior Partners are finally ready to put into action the endgame of the great "Big A" Apocalypse that they have been preparing for for centuries. The whole reason behind Wolfram & Hart, the Circle of the Black Thorn and so on is revealed to be that they were corrupting mankind towards evil, tipping the scales just enough to allow the original demons, once banished, to reclaim the Earth as their own.

Angel, Spike and Illyria, who all survived the alley (in an as yet unseen fashion, lol) have continued to fight against this going ahead but by now have turned to Buffy and the Scoobies for help. The two groups form an army of slayers and other mystical allies to defend Earth as the SPs attempt to rip open the dimensional walls, once and for all.

The battle starts to go in favour of the demons and Buffy realises that the only way to win is to seal of the demon dimensions from Earth altogether. Between Willow, Giles, and the other magically inclined members of Buffy's team they work out a spell to do just that. Only two problems arise. One is that it requires somebody to be on the other side of the dimensional walls to seal the portals from both sides at the same time. Secondly that any remaining demons on Earth will no longer be able to survive there. This obviously includes Angel, Spike and Illyria.

The spell requires two powerful mystical artifacts bonding together, one on either side of the dimensional walls, and locking the realms apart permanently. They must be held by a being of great power as the energy involved is too great for the average human. Angel volunteers to take the demon side artifact as this is his only chance of survival anyway. Illyria also chooses to go with him as she will die otherwise. Everybody expects Spike to choose to leave too but he surprises everyone by saying he is staying. The power of the artifacts is extremely volatile and may be more than even Buffy can handle on her own. One demon needs to remain on the earth side to back Buffy up, in case her strength fails.

Angel and Illyria pass through to the demon realm and the spell goes ahead and starts to work, closing the portal slowly. Unfortunately the Senior Partners discover what is happening and send an army to stop it. They attack Angel and Illyria, threatening to overwhelm them. Buffy can only stand and watch as Angel is fighting for his life, Illyria already contained. Spike sees the panic on Buffy's face and finally accepts that Angel is the one she truly loves. Also, Buffy's strength is failing as the artifact's energy courses through her body and he realises that he needs to take over her place. He tells her to go and help Angel, if she can. Spike takes the artifact and Buffy jumps through the portal. Her arrival allows for just enough time for the spell to complete and in a flash of energy the demon dimensions are cut off from Earth altogether.

Spike, however, is not dead, but instead truly alive. The energies released had a side effect of cleansing the demon from him, making him human and fulfilling the Shanshu prophecy. A vampire, who played an important role in the great Apocalypse, has been made human again. A secondary after effect is the discovery that the slayer line has apparently ended. With all mystical energy suddenly cut off from Earth the slayer power is no more and Faith and all the other remaining slayers are just ordinary girls once again.

He and the rest of the surviving Scoobies are left to mourn the loss of Buffy and Angel in a world without demons. At least until the time of Fray.

 

[Fat Elvis 007]

That's a very awesome and well thought out idea. But I would switch the roles of Spike and Angel--I think Angel deserves the Shanshu much more, and at least Spike would get a noble(and final) death.

 

[Allycat]

Great idea... I wouldn't mind if Joss used that. Only, wouldn't it make more sense for Connor to act as a back up on the human-side?!?

(PS: Great signature Fat Elvis 007.)

 

[mayukhers112]

I mean yeah there's still that bit in Fray where he's telling Mel how other slayers were around with the power, but never called. Could he having been talking about all the potentials-now-slayers who would have been around after Buffy's death. He doesn't clearly define any time period, as as I know.

I kind of agree with you about Urkonn talking about potentials who were just around when Buffy went. Then again, I got to thinking: is Fray also a potential, or was she really called? Or were the last slayers the ones who were around when Buffy died, and once they died, the slayer lineage/calling returned to normal again? I'm confusing myself...but I guess what I'm trying to say is, once the last 'full' slayer (thanks to Willow's spell) died, did the line and everything return back to normal, with Fray's calling? And are there potentials in Fray's world, too?

 

[The Arcane]

Great idea... I wouldn't mind if Joss used that. Only, wouldn't it make more sense for Connor to act as a back up on the human-side?!?

(PS: Great signature Fat Elvis 007.)

Actually, it would, lol! Only thing is that in the longer version i have put together Connor, along with several other characters, have already been lost in the battle.

One of the reasons Angel is ready to sacrifice himself to the hell dimension is that he is mourning the loss (for the third time) of his child and is struggling to find a reason to carry on by that point.

Fat Elvis, i have several reasons for letting Spike be the one to Shanshu (not least being the fact he is my favourite character, lol) but the main ones are that i wanted the possibility of continuing the Buffy/Angel dynamic so keeping them together was neccessary. Given that fact, plus the fact that Angel had technically signed away any chance he had of getting the Shanshu himself, i decided that the best option was to allow Spike to become human.