thrasherpix
Scooby
- Joined
- Mar 13, 2016
- Messages
- 5,314
- Age
- 43
Or ultraterrestrials, or whatever you want to call them. 😎
The way I see it, there are some that are just variant species (and can count as aliens who have been influenced by Earth/human culture), such as the Deathwok Clan, and others that are more in the realm of spirits and fairy tales (which could just be seen as some of the weirder parallel worlds out there, which also exist in Star Trek). That said, that many are able to breed with humans does suggest a common ancestor, though it's entirely possible that the Old Ones practiced a form of genetic engineering to keep the human slaves in line, as well as to perfect them for tasks, and the results were the common demons of the Buffyverse (especially those eligible to join the Scourge who see themselves as "pure"), and thus maintain some ability to breed with pure humans...but they can then adapt further to other dimensions.
(That said, I recall reading somewhere that when demons shift to this world, that they're "automatically adapted" to survive here--very useful for those who travel world to world--and this might be advanced enough to allow interbreeding. I've also wondered if demons who can take dual form, say the Mok'tagar, would instead take on the form of a demon, like of the Deathwok Clan, were they to travel to Pylea instead of Earth.)
The thing about many of those demon dimensions, similar (and even worse) societies have existed in our own world...even today, many regions (even in some first world countries) could be mistaken (?) for yet another hell dimension by a dimensional traveler, one in which humans were the demons.
And then there are the transformed, such as vengeance demons, vampires, and those who Ascend (or get changed as Cordelia was). This could be explained by retroviral infections that actually rewrite the genetic code (and alter the mind, not all that dissimilar to some "body snatchers" which repress or override the personality of the unwilling hosts).
I got to get back to reading Queen of the Slayers...early on there was a scene of shapeshifters in the desert outside of Sunnydale that were animals that shifted into people rather than the other way around...that seems like a likely place for lycanthropy in humans and the like to come from! (I just wonder, if a werewolf changed into a vampire, would the vampire then be able to shift form?)
The soul of a vampire that can be called from the ether (I wonder if that's just vampires, or if anyone's soul can be called--it's interesting that as far as I'm aware, no vampire has ever encountered the ghost of the mortal the vampire now occupies, unless you count that very special case of Angel vs. Angelus) seems to me to say that it's not retroviral, but it could be something else that exists in the Buffyverse that we humans (other than witches and the like) don't yet know much about, but could be thought of as aura or essence, or even links to other dimensions that we humans are unaware of as we (save psychics, and demons of the Deathwok Clan which can track and/or read auras as an innate ability) lack the senses that can sense those levels.
That is, it could be that the "vampire's soul" is simply suppressed (rather than truly dead) and somehow powers the transformation, and perhaps even existence, of the vampire, in a way similar (obviously not identical to) to how Glory sustained her essence by devouring the minds of mortals (and yet rather than being "digested," Tara's mind was recalled from Glory by Willow back into Tara--perhaps Tara's sanity was in the same ether that the souls of those transformed into vampires go to, and perhaps it's the same place where Willow shunted Tara's memories later). Perhaps the reason Glory couldn't brain suck vampires is that their souls were already in the ether or other realm (could she have brain sucked Angel?).
Just some random thoughts, for anyone interested. 😵
The part I can't work out is why (at least in this dimension) vampires don't have reflections, especially as they can be recorded by cameras and other sensors that depend upon light. I presume that whatever is behind this is also why sunlight burns them (since the suns of Pylea don't harm vampires and they have reflections there). The best that I can think of is that vampires once turned to magic to gain better control of themselves, that once upon a time they were more like they are in Pylea (where they had a human and beast form, vaguely similar to werewolves that could control their transformation), but as they were falling to other demons and humans (especially the Slayer), they found some magical balance that allowed them to keep their rational mind when transforming, but side effects for some reason affected their ability to reflect as well as making them vulnerable to sunlight. Just a guess.
I personally like some other vampire series in which vampires can't be recorded by cameras, don't cast shadows, and in Salem's Lot (the book by Stephen King), a deputy's flashlight beam went right through the vampires (that is, the light didn't spread as if it were a person and the deputy could see the beam continuing on behind them, yet the vampires approaching him weren't translucent). But that's not the case in the Buffyverse.
As for why vampires can't be read by mind reading...I wonder if that's because part of their mind is in the same place as their soul (but feeding on the mortal's soul in a vaguely similar way as Glory fed off minds) so that mind reading just didn't work...and yet telepathy worked (Willow was able to coordinate with Spike that way). Yet the ensouled Angel couldn't be read either. This could be similar to vampires not being able to reflect yet still affected normally by light in other ways (that is, telepathic messages can reach them, but they can't be read, perhaps not even communicate back silently even if they wanted to), or it could be Willow figured a way around the problem (so that Willow COULD read the mind of a vampire if she desired to).
IDK, this is just bugging me now. 😳😕😵
The way I see it, there are some that are just variant species (and can count as aliens who have been influenced by Earth/human culture), such as the Deathwok Clan, and others that are more in the realm of spirits and fairy tales (which could just be seen as some of the weirder parallel worlds out there, which also exist in Star Trek). That said, that many are able to breed with humans does suggest a common ancestor, though it's entirely possible that the Old Ones practiced a form of genetic engineering to keep the human slaves in line, as well as to perfect them for tasks, and the results were the common demons of the Buffyverse (especially those eligible to join the Scourge who see themselves as "pure"), and thus maintain some ability to breed with pure humans...but they can then adapt further to other dimensions.
(That said, I recall reading somewhere that when demons shift to this world, that they're "automatically adapted" to survive here--very useful for those who travel world to world--and this might be advanced enough to allow interbreeding. I've also wondered if demons who can take dual form, say the Mok'tagar, would instead take on the form of a demon, like of the Deathwok Clan, were they to travel to Pylea instead of Earth.)
The thing about many of those demon dimensions, similar (and even worse) societies have existed in our own world...even today, many regions (even in some first world countries) could be mistaken (?) for yet another hell dimension by a dimensional traveler, one in which humans were the demons.
And then there are the transformed, such as vengeance demons, vampires, and those who Ascend (or get changed as Cordelia was). This could be explained by retroviral infections that actually rewrite the genetic code (and alter the mind, not all that dissimilar to some "body snatchers" which repress or override the personality of the unwilling hosts).
I got to get back to reading Queen of the Slayers...early on there was a scene of shapeshifters in the desert outside of Sunnydale that were animals that shifted into people rather than the other way around...that seems like a likely place for lycanthropy in humans and the like to come from! (I just wonder, if a werewolf changed into a vampire, would the vampire then be able to shift form?)
The soul of a vampire that can be called from the ether (I wonder if that's just vampires, or if anyone's soul can be called--it's interesting that as far as I'm aware, no vampire has ever encountered the ghost of the mortal the vampire now occupies, unless you count that very special case of Angel vs. Angelus) seems to me to say that it's not retroviral, but it could be something else that exists in the Buffyverse that we humans (other than witches and the like) don't yet know much about, but could be thought of as aura or essence, or even links to other dimensions that we humans are unaware of as we (save psychics, and demons of the Deathwok Clan which can track and/or read auras as an innate ability) lack the senses that can sense those levels.
That is, it could be that the "vampire's soul" is simply suppressed (rather than truly dead) and somehow powers the transformation, and perhaps even existence, of the vampire, in a way similar (obviously not identical to) to how Glory sustained her essence by devouring the minds of mortals (and yet rather than being "digested," Tara's mind was recalled from Glory by Willow back into Tara--perhaps Tara's sanity was in the same ether that the souls of those transformed into vampires go to, and perhaps it's the same place where Willow shunted Tara's memories later). Perhaps the reason Glory couldn't brain suck vampires is that their souls were already in the ether or other realm (could she have brain sucked Angel?).
Just some random thoughts, for anyone interested. 😵
The part I can't work out is why (at least in this dimension) vampires don't have reflections, especially as they can be recorded by cameras and other sensors that depend upon light. I presume that whatever is behind this is also why sunlight burns them (since the suns of Pylea don't harm vampires and they have reflections there). The best that I can think of is that vampires once turned to magic to gain better control of themselves, that once upon a time they were more like they are in Pylea (where they had a human and beast form, vaguely similar to werewolves that could control their transformation), but as they were falling to other demons and humans (especially the Slayer), they found some magical balance that allowed them to keep their rational mind when transforming, but side effects for some reason affected their ability to reflect as well as making them vulnerable to sunlight. Just a guess.
I personally like some other vampire series in which vampires can't be recorded by cameras, don't cast shadows, and in Salem's Lot (the book by Stephen King), a deputy's flashlight beam went right through the vampires (that is, the light didn't spread as if it were a person and the deputy could see the beam continuing on behind them, yet the vampires approaching him weren't translucent). But that's not the case in the Buffyverse.
As for why vampires can't be read by mind reading...I wonder if that's because part of their mind is in the same place as their soul (but feeding on the mortal's soul in a vaguely similar way as Glory fed off minds) so that mind reading just didn't work...and yet telepathy worked (Willow was able to coordinate with Spike that way). Yet the ensouled Angel couldn't be read either. This could be similar to vampires not being able to reflect yet still affected normally by light in other ways (that is, telepathic messages can reach them, but they can't be read, perhaps not even communicate back silently even if they wanted to), or it could be Willow figured a way around the problem (so that Willow COULD read the mind of a vampire if she desired to).
IDK, this is just bugging me now. 😳😕😵
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