Did "I will remember you" kill Riley?

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Robb Stark

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I was thinking about why Riley didn't really work with Buffy, and I think "IWRY" was the epitome of it. It was hard enough to get into Riley after everything Buffy and Angel had done and gone through in the first three seasons of the show, but then Buffy goes down to L.A. and we basically find out that her and Angel truly are in love with each other. Even if you don't like the Buffy/Angel pairing, that pretty much slays any momentum Riley had going (and there wasn't much to begin with). If you were into Buffy/Angel (and I was so into it), it made it pretty much impossible to get into Riley.

It didn't hurt Spike because he didn't get into Buffy until a full season or so later (and because Spike is one of the best characters ever), but with Riley it was just flat out rejectionville after that.
 
(Sorry, I got lost in my rhetoric and lost track of the original question)

I don't think that this episode had anything whatsoever to do with Buffy's relationship with Riley, because, not only did she not remember any of it, it literally never happened.
 
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white avenger said:
(Sorry, I got lost in my rhetoric and lost track of the original question)

I don't think that this episode had anything whatsoever to do with Buffy's relationship with Riley, because, not only did she not remember any of it, it literally never happened.
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I read your response before you edited it, and while I found it very interesting, I didn't really agree. I'll shoot you a PM.

But for the question, I wasn't thinking so much along the lines of Buffy and Riley on-screen, but the interest of the audience. I know that to everyone on the show but Angel, that episode was erased, but it wasn't to most fans. Continuity wise, emotionally, that episode still happened, and it was a pretty big Buffy/Angel moment, even if Buffy forgot it happened.
 
My answer to this is: it depends on whether or not you watched both shows. Not everyone watched Angel, so there are some who didn't know it happened until they saw it years after or perhaps still haven't seen IWRY and don't know to this day.

For those who watched both shows, I think it did pretty much kill off any momentum Riley may have been gaining. Just as it looked like Buffy would move on and we as viewers could move on with her, they brought the whole Bangel thing back up again and made us realise just how much Riley wasn't Angel. How different the chemisty was between SMG and her two leading men and how much the back story between Buffy and Angel meant to the fans at the time. Love it or hate it, it's still the linchpin relationship throughout both shows and reminding us of that when trying to build up and new heroic leading man and love interest was a mistake in my opinion.
 
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Always Bangel said:
I read your response before you edited it, and while I found it very interesting, I didn't really agree. I'll shoot you a PM.

But for the question, I wasn't thinking so much along the lines of Buffy and Riley on-screen, but the interest of the audience.
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Actually, I hadn't really thought much about Buffy's relationship with Riley one way or the other, either before or after that episode (counting the syndicated episodes, I was watching at least three different time lines most of the time, so I could see Buffy in high school in the mornings, college in the afternoons, and in the first run every Tuesday night. It made keeping track of who was doing what to who something of a challenge at times) To me, he was just too sweet and wholesome to take seriously. Even when they tried to "nasty" him up with a vampire prostitute addiction, he still reminded me of a somewhat more masculine version of Season 3 Wesley. Sincere, but just out of his league trying to run with the real heroes.
 
I just didn't like Riley because the actor was terrible in my opinion and he kept butting in I wanted to get to know Riley more before getting with Buffy I thought it moved way to fast. But I Will Remember You did show me that Riley could never win Buffys heart, Buffy loves Riley but she's in love with Angel. If Tara didn't exist I think Willow would of been better with Riley.
 
It did for me. I actually started to move on from Bangel and Riley seemed pretty dope for Buffy, she was really into him, but then i saw iwry and was like...riley? ha
 
No. IWRY was a wish fullfillment episode for me and yes, it hurt not to see that wish come true for real but at the same time I still feel that Buffy and Angel had some growing to do apart and at that point she did have feelings for Riley. I thought her relationship with Riley was a nice interlude shall we say? A time for Buffy to grow and learn more about herself.

I kind of just viewed IWRY as something that gave me an idea of what the possible future would be like, at the very end of the show.
 
Hm, I actually only watched Angel after finishing all seven seasons of Buffy, so that didn't affect me. But if I had watched IWRY at the time, I don't think it would've changed much. If Buffy had remembered the episode, then sure, Riley would be no-no. But she didn't, so it's fine. I'm not a Bangel shipper, so...
 
Riley didn't exist to me in that episode. I've always had the assumption that buffy would drop any man to be with angel and it never really even happened, buffy doesnt know about it so Riley doesn't know about it, so he can't be hurt then. Only angel knows, and it's trapped deep in his soul.
 
It definitelly didn't help, but I think riley had already been 'killed' at this pont
 
AmelRIOT said:
I just didn't like Riley because the actor was terrible in my opinion
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In defense of Marc Blucas here, though I'm not a personal fan of his work, in all fairness it should be remembered that he is cursed with the kind of boyish good looks and wholesomeness that makes him believable only in a single type of role, so we never have actually seen him play anything but Riley or, on other shows, basically the same sort of character. It'd hard to judge his general acting ability based on his portrayal of one single character type, especially if that character isn't one of your favorites.
 
I don't think IWRY "killed" Riley, because, by then, he wasn't Buffy's love interest, strictly speaking. Riley's (relative) unpopularity as Buffy's boyfriend was very well explained in the essay "Andrew, Riley, and Kennedy: What the Heck Was Joss Thinking?"

http://bookishwench.livejournal.com/345196.html

I agree with the author that Riley was too normal, and writers had to use artificial tricks to create real drama in their relationship. Compared with the scale of Bangel and Spuffy drama, Buffy/Riley story felt less interesting.
 
I see where you're coming from with this question and yes, i would say it showed us that although she was in a relationship with Riley she obviously still loved Angel. This is obviously a no brainer! I wouldn't say however that Riley didn't stand a chance after that, i mean, things did get better and i think she really did start to move on and care for him. I watched all of Angel before all of Buffy for the first time so i can't personally say how i felt but after just watching these eps. recently in timeline order, it certainly does make you think.
 
In terms of the audience's attachment to B/A, it certainly didn't help his cause. However, not every viewer is a B/A shipper (Only the best ones. 😛 JOKING! Don't kill me internet 😛) so that theory doesn't hold an awful lot of weight.

Ultimately, Briley didn't work because Buffy wasn't in love with him and staying in a one sided relationship was killing Riley. If Buffy had truly and sincerely been in love with Riley I think it could have had a shot. But, she so clearly didn't. The audience takes most of their cues from the lead, and Buffy wasn't doing anything to endear that relationship to anyone. However, Riley himself, was incredibly endearing and absolutely worth routing for.
 
Black Eye Guy
Black Eye Guy
Lets be honest by JOKING you mean,'Deadly serious'
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I had trouble getting into any relationship Buffy and Angel had outside of each other but Riley took the cake. I never liked him and the fact that he was with Buffy just added to that. "IWRY" didn't play a part for me about how I felt about Riley and Buffy's relationship but it definitely solidified my opinion that Angel and Buffy belonged together.
 
The episode IWRY didn't really impact how I felt about Buffy/Riley because I never liked Riley even from the beginning. Just something about him bugged me. Although, I do think my love for Buffy/Angel did have something to do with it because I never liked Buffy with anyone other than Angel.
 
I think it was Riley who ruined Riley.
(for those who dislike him, I'm pretty indifferent to him)
 
Ethan Reigns
Ethan Reigns
A by-the-book military man and Buffy could never exist in each other's world.
In depends, on an intellectual level you could argue that 'IWRY' was the end of Bangel, it spelt out in no uncertain terms why they couldn't ever be together, not while the world was like it was. That it wasn't Angel's 'perfect happiness' clause that was keeping them apart but what they were as people- as in heroes.
(Which, is why, imo, Bangel works. Tragic romances are always more interesting than romances that work out.)

But on an emotional level, absolutely it killed Briley. MB didn't have half as much chemistry with SMG as DB had, it isn't really a contest.
By the end of 'IWRY' I knew that Riley wasn't the one for Buffy- over the season the two of them grew into a nice couple. I do think he was good for Buffy, but I was always waiting for it to end.

Imo, Bangel is tragic romance, Briley is a nice relationship (albeit a doomed one) and Spuffy is tawdy sleaze that people just think is a relationship. 🙂
 
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