Did Riley have the right to get mad at Buffy?

[Joshua]

In "As You Were", when Riley discovers Buffy sleeping with Spike did Riley have the right to get mad?

 

[AmelRIOT]

Kind of yes, cause when he was still in Sunnydale Spike killed people and tried to kill Buffy, plus Riley knew about his past. Riley hated all vampires he even hated Angel who has a soul. Riley still thought Spike was this horrid creature who do anything to hurt other people he doesn't know nothing that Spike has done like protected Dawn. Plus I think Riley was jealous, Riley wanted to be with Buffy but Buffy wasn't in love with him like she is in love with Angel.

So in a way kind of, but he left Sunnydale and got married she has the right to do whatever she wants to do even if they are bad things.

 

[dexeded]

No. He wasn't involved in Buffy's life anymore, so he didn't have the right to be mad who she slept with, plus he was already married. But it was understandable that he would get mad. On the other hand, he thought Spike was the Doctor (a ridiculous plot which, while canon, was still... really stupid and OOC. I mean, sure, they can show how Spike is still evil, but does it have to be under such a harebrained mastermind-type scheme? I find the whole 'keeping it for a friend' reason much more believable, anyway), in which case his anger would be semi-justified by the evidence that Spike was still doing evil stuff.

 

[prophecygrrl]

I think him being upset at the whole situation is pretty reasonable, but I don't think he necessarily deserves to be mad at Buffy herself. He hadn't been around for the last year, he's married to someone else, and he has a really limited understanding of what Buffy's life was like at that point.

i don't remember much of As You Were (not one of my favorite episodes tbh) so I don't quite remember whether or not he was actually mad or just disappointed.

 

[white avenger]

Absolutely not. He had issued the ultimatums before leaving town, nobody had held a gun on him and forced him to leave, and no one had, as far as we know, forced or even encouraged him to return, especially with his brand new wife in tow (the Suvolte demon was an excuse, not a reason, and that entire story line has more holes than a chunk of Swiss cheese) He had, by his own choice, removed himself from Buffy's life. Riley could have come back and caught Buffy sleeping with the entire vampire population of Sunnydale, and it STILL wouldn't have been any of his business, any more than it was the business of Willow, Xander, or anyone else. Buffy was an adult, supposedly capable of making her own decisions and able to face and live with their consequences without input from or judgement by anyone else.

 

[brinkster130]

I don't think he was mad, just disappointed in Buffy because he thought better of her. IMO he reacted better than other friends of Buffy's did to this information.

I certainly don't think it was his place to be upset with her, but it was a completely understandable reaction. I don't think Riley really overstepped any lines by expressing his feelings to Buffy; he was being a honest friend.

 

[Xin Rong]

Yes he did. The spike thing was ridiculous, and from Rileys view, he had spent years winding spike up that it would never happen, so he was probably disappointed, and humiliated, resulting in mucho anger!

 

[Faith717132]

Yes

She did have the right to get mad.

🙂

 

[EVIL UU]

Look, Spike is a soulless monstrosity, a reanimated corpse, a murderer and a rapist. He's a repulsive piece of trash. It's what makes Spike, Spike. When you learn that someone you even remotely care about is involved with something like Spike you have the right to be angry. It's not about jealousy. I mean, excuse me, have you seen Riley's wife? Look, just take a look.

Yeah. Buffy? She doesn't play in the same league. Personally, I was expecting Riley to start laughing hysterically or something, in a Sam, you're not gonna believe it, my ex sells burgers and ****s a corpse, holy shit, what a total loser she's become! way. Nah, he still cares. Riley is a boring, cheating spineless yokel but at least he's a decent boring, cheating spineless yokel.
[MENTION=11500]drizzlydaze[/MENTION]

a ridiculous plot which, while canon, was still... really stupid and OOC.

It's not out of character just because you don't like it. We're talking here about a monster who turned his own mother into a vampire and staked her afterwards, who used to torture and rape to death girls younger than Dawn and who already uses a silly pseudonym instead of his real name.

Using another silly pseudonym and doing evil shit is very much in character.

such a harebrained mastermind-type scheme?

Yeah, completely ridiculous, like taking footage of Buffy with a camera to learn her fighting style, while knowing well that it's not about moves, love. Or pretending to be disabled for weeks just to surprise Angelus. Or trying to damage Scoobies while serving Adam by whining and spreading nonsense. Or talking kids-turned-into-demons into hunting down a slayer. Or sending her a blue demon hand in a box hoping it will choke her to death or something.

You're right, Spike would never do something like that.

---------- Post added at 10:33 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:59 AM ----------
[MENTION=6758]white avenger[/MENTION]

Buffy was an adult, supposedly capable of making her own decisions and able to face and live with their consequences without input from or judgement by anyone else.

Alright. Let's say I accidentally learn that my dear friend boinks Issei Sagawa. What am I going to do? Will I say something like You're an adult, you're able to face consequences of your actions, I'm fine with you boning Mr. Sagawa, do carry on.? No, obviously I'll be like What the ****, are you out of your mind?! You **** a crazy woman-eating murderer, what is wrong with you?!. Because she's my friend and I care about her general wellbeing. That's what friends do, they're to tell you that you do stupid crap when you do stupid crap. Being an adult has nothing to do with it.

In other words, dude...seriously? 🙂

 

[YummySushiPJs]

I'm not sure if I'd say he "had the right", but I think he reacted a lot better than he could have overall, probably much better than I would have!

 

[white avenger]

In other words, dude...seriously? 🙂

In other words, yes. As a friend, it could certainly be argued that Riley might have a legitimate reason to be concerned for Buffy's welfare, but the question wasn't about worry, it was about anger, and he had no right to be mad, not at Buffy, not at Spike, not even at the Doctor, whoever that was.

 

[EVIL UU]

not at Spike, not even at the Doctor, whoever that was.

What do you mean, whoever that was? Spike was the Doctor, it's the bloody canon, re-watch the episode or something. And yes, Riley has the right to be angry, Spike trades and hides deadly, demonic crap in his cave and the person who was supposed to help him find them has sex with him instead. Those demonic eggs are an apocalypse material, for Tara's sake.

Freaking Gandhi would be pissed off.

 

[YummySushiPJs]

As human beings we all have the right to be angry, I guess...

 

[dexeded]

It's not out of character just because you don't like it. We're talking here about a monster who turned his own mother into a vampire and staked her afterwards, who used to torture and rape to death girls younger than Dawn and who already uses a silly pseudonym instead of his real name.

Using another silly pseudonym and doing evil shit is very much in character.

I didn't think it was OOC because I didn't like it; I didn't like it because it was OOC. Using the pseudonym obviously isn't the OOC thing. Doing evil shit obviously isn't the OOC thing. The OOC thing is this big master plan of networking and trading demon eggs, evil mastermind style. Spike's much more straightforward than that, even with the constraints of a chip. I'm obviously not saying Spike isn't evil at this point, nor am I saying that he isn't capable of doing the evil/destruction the egg scheme would've brought; I'm saying the methodology was OOC, and that bothered me.

Yeah, completely ridiculous, like taking footage of Buffy with a camera to learn her fighting style, while knowing well that it's not about moves, love.

Hm, I do actually think that was kind of OOC too, except it could be explained away that we don't really know how he operated when it came to Slayers. We do know, after all, that he did fight Nikki multiple times before killing her.

Or pretending to be disabled for weeks just to surprise Angelus.

Wasn't saying Spike isn't capable of long term planning. He was still healing at this point, so he did need to still pretend to be disabled till he healed completely, and got the right opportunity.

Or trying to damage Scoobies while serving Adam by whining and spreading nonsense.

Not OOC, Spike is good at reading and manipulating people.

Or talking kids-turned-into-demons into hunting down a slayer.

I don't see how this has anything to do with long term planning, or how it's OOC. He wouldn't have expected them to succeed anyway.

Or sending her a blue demon hand in a box hoping it will choke her to death or something.

Uh, I'm assuming this is a joke because he didn't deliberately send it to her. Dalton lost it.

 

[EVIL UU]

[MENTION=11500]drizzlydaze[/MENTION]

Spike would never do such a thing! It was OUT OF CHARACTER! <stomps foot>

Yeah, except he did.

Now think about it, maybe, just maybe it's not Spike that's out of character, maybe it's your view of the character that's idealized and out of touch with the show? Do you really think that you know Spike better than the people that created the character? What are the odds?

 

[dexeded]

Yeah, except he did.

I know he did. I wasn't contending that. And well, lol, you basically quoted something I didn't even say from my entire post.

Now think about it, maybe, just maybe it's not Spike that's out of character, maybe it's your view of the character that's idealized and out of touch with the show? Do you really think that you know Spike better than the people that created the character? What are the odds?

Thing is, there are always going to be inconsistencies in stories because they are fictional. There are plot holes in BtVS. It doesn't make sense. The same goes for characters, although for what constitutes as OOC is more debatable. Plot holes, character holes, both existing.

maybe it's your view of the character that's idealized and out of touch with the show?

Sure, my take on the character is different from yours or other people's, because everyone's take on the character is going to be different, including all the individual writers. But I don't see how my take is idealised. I agree that Spike's totally evil -- but my point is that they could've shown him being evil in a way that would make more sense character-wise. He could've mass murdered a bunch of people in a more straight forward way for money or something (okay, I just came up with that off the top of my head, so not really a great example). I'm saying that he's obviously capable of the destruction and death and evil the eggs would bring, but the modus operandi is just off. I'm not even saying he wasn't the Doctor.