Discussion of 8.34 "Twilight Part 3" - Released 4/07/10 (Dark Horse)

[Kean]

That's why I don't get any happiness over seeing them together. We need an explanation as to why they are drawn to each other and how long Angel's been effected by it, because at the moment all I can see is Buffy screwing a guy who's spent the season beating up or killing innocent people.

Why they have been drawn to each other is the bond and love they have always had, I thought this issue made that clear. The Universe is using that to its own purpose. If Angel was in control of himself and knew of Twilight's intent I'm fairly certain that he would have taken himself as far away from Buffy as he possibly could be. He wouldn't want to usher in the end of humanity anymore than Buffy would.

I agree about wanting to know how long Angel has been under Twilight's control though. It has clearly been an extended period of time.

What I am confused about is if the Universe wants to wipe out humanity why did it enlist Angel to basically slow down that process? Was Twilight just biding its time until Buffy and Angel were ready to be reunited?

I get why people who love Bangel are enjoying the reunion but I think it is important to remember that in the context of the story it is not a good thing. It is causing the destruction of the world. Humans will cease to matter. Hoards of demons have started pouring into the earthly dimension. Twangel's motivations are still very questionable and now Buffy is in what seems to be an alternative dimension, separated from her family, friends and mission.

I won't lie and say I didn't enjoy seeing Bangel back together. We have been waiting over ten years to see them enjoy and love each other like that. However, I am under no illusion as to what this all means and that Buffy and Angel are being used as pawns...again! My favourite part of this entire is was not the sexcapades but when Buffy and Angel said how much they missed each other, to me, that was real, that was borne out of their genuine connection.

I know they will have to separate in order to save the world but like BEG, my joy is because we Bangel and their love for each other has been reaffirmed, it is canonical fact. They still love each other all these years later, and now we have proof. That's a big deal for me and I couldn't pretend that it isn't, even if I wanted to.

 

[Black Eye Guy]

What I am confused about is if the Universe wants to wipe out humanity why did it enlist Angel to basically slow down that process? Was Twilight just biding its time until Buffy and Angel were ready to be reunited?

It could have been because the universe had to wait for Buffy to Evolve/gain her powers?

 

[Kean]

It could have been because the universe had to wait for Buffy to Evolve/gain her powers?

That's the only explanation I have been able to come up with too. I expect it will become clearer when we learn what exactlt Twilight is.

 

[Buffy4ever2k10]

Okay let me get this straight.

I didn´t read the issue yet because of the stupid german shops but you are all saying the unvierse wants to wipe out mankind? That´s Twilights plan? I don´t get it. *sigh*

 

[Kean]

Okay let me get this straight.

I didn´t read the issue yet because of the stupid german shops but you are all saying the unvierse wants to wipe out mankind? That´s Twilights plan? I don´t get it. *sigh*

Buffy, in creating the new slayers and thus creating power, evolved as a Slayer. The Universe rewarded her with new powers for this creation of power and with that they essentially created a new breed. In doing that humanity as basically lost its place at the top of the food chain and now The Universe wants to push this new stage of evolution on to the next step. Angel recieved these same powers because he is the yin to Buffy's yang. They are each half of their united unit. Think of Mohra's words in IWRY, "Together you are powerful, alone you are dead."

Twilight, from what can guess is "Balance". In activating all the Slayers Buffy imbalanced The Universe and now it is righting itself.

 

[citiegal17]

I highly doubt this prophetcy in any way gets Angel off the hook for anything, it seems more convient than anythng else. Oh yeah remeber his goal is to "end magick" right, well I say this whole prophetcy is connected to that. Also I don't really like Angel all together, his character repulses me. Even if you forget everything he's done as Twilight, he is still guilty of murdering an innocent in cold, miswiping, just ignoring the fact that some people would be killed by vampires, just because he was mad at them, attacking Wesley, compromising his friends safety with the W&H deal, thats why its so believeable that he could do all he has done. For me at least he lost his hero/champion status a long time.

 

[ToShanshuInLA]

edit: never mind.............

 

[Black Eye Guy]

Yeah this isn't part of a prophecy is it? Giles explanation seems to be it's evolution, whatever Twilight is it was always going to happen, but the universe was waiting for a Slayer to prove herself , Buffys done that, so it advanced her evolution, now she's able to survive the Twilight.

I'd like to know what happened before that made Watchers think they were coming close to this.

 

[ToShanshuInLA]

I'd like to know what happened before that made Watchers think they were coming close to this.

Same. I hope they go into that.


By the way, did anyone else feel bad for Satsu in this issue? 🙁

 

[Wilder Midnight]

I get why people who love Bangel are enjoying the reunion but I think it is important to remember that in the context of the story it is not a good thing. It is causing the destruction of the world. Humans will cease to matter. Hoards of demons have started pouring into the earthly dimension. Twangel's motivations are still very questionable and now Buffy is in what seems to be an alternative dimension, separated from her family, friends and mission.

there was a time i only wanted it to be angel and buffy.

i liked riley...but i don't think they were meant to be.

it took me some time to accept and then like buffy and spike as a couple...that actually happened after the show ended.

there was a part of me that always thought it would be buffy and xander together at the end of things way down the road...very way down the road. it actually makes the most sense...what with xander being she demon bait and buffys powers coming from demons and being a she and all.

recently i've come to think that i don't want buffy with angel or spike. as good as they were those days are over and i wanted to see her move on. it would sort of represent that things haven't even really started for her.

funny isn't it...just as i started to think it was okay that buffy and angel are not a couple..here they are coupling.

as for the overall theme of what seems to be happening i mentioned an old comic book mini series called "the One" (by Rick Veitch) published in the late 80's by Marvel/Epic Comics that dealt with the same subject matter i.e. that of two superhuman beings bringing about the next stage of evolution. It has been a very long time since I've read it but it was pretty disturbing...with everything leading up to humanity evolving into balls of light leaving the earth to explore the entire universe.

 

[PrincessBuffy16]

Same. I hope they go into that.


By the way, did anyone else feel bad for Satsu in this issue? 🙁

Umm, I have only read few parts with her on BB, but I guess she had hard time dealing Bangel and whole sex marathon?

 

[Tranquillity]

So if Buffy has asscended to be a higher being (i'm hesitant to say she's a god at this stage) and then we saw Faith suddenly get her powers back does this mean that Faith is now the-one-and-only vampire slayer?

 

[Black Eye Guy]

I haven't read the issue yet, only stuff from the internet, is there any implication Faith got super super powers, people are saying she healed instantly, not normal slayer time healing?

 

[citiegal17]

I don't think Buffy is really a god she was just merged with the scythe, and that more less doesn't mean she was a real god. Instead she is tempoarily being used as a catalyst for the scythe, I think the prophetcy is also being used by Angel as a way in which to achieve to which End Magic, while tricking Buffy into helping him. His actions don't really seem ooc to me, and he also has a messiah/champion complex in his character which makes him think that he is destined to be a great hero. Even the first slayer was not a real god, and she was the most less human slayer, so no I don't believe she is a god.

 

[ToShanshuInLA]

I haven't read the issue yet, only stuff from the internet, is there any implication Faith got super super powers, people are saying she healed instantly, not normal slayer time healing?

"I-I'm not bleeding anymore. My wound--It's--It's gone. Giles, what the hell is going on?" Yeah, it seems she healed instantly but that's about as much attention as they devote to it in the issue, I think.

 

[Buffyverse Fan]

I'm a Bangel and I thought this issue took it way OTT with that aspect.

I went from being neutral on Satsu to utterly disliking her. The chips were down, and she stormed off, she's no hero.

In her place, Spike would be trying to make sense of things and save lives, even with his feelings crushed. Even Riley would have done the same as Spike. Satsu's proved herself entirely useless to the good fight.

While the issue was written well enough, I just didn't like it. Forget Satsu, the issue's done a disservice to Buffy & Angel, the two leads. No one in favor of eugenics ever turns out to be anything but a villain (real life or fiction). And even keeping in mind that she accidentally catalyzed this genetic "cleansing," she's still a villain in my book.

Compare Buffy to Superman, as that's been the recent theme. Superman doesn't want the world to take on his image. Superman's deepest fantasy is to embrace his humanity. It was shown that his most base desire is to be a farmer and a family man with no cape, no costume, and no powers beyond that of a normal man.

Superman, and even a rebel like Batman are working towards a world that doesn't need them. They don't want the world to come over to their lifestyle, they think it sucks to live as they do, consumed with battles and violence.

Buffy & Angel used to be the same way, now they've become the enemy. If they're willfully going along with this, or even if they're unwilling pawns, I almost hope to see Spike, Faith, Connor, and Cordy swoop in and pummel Buffy & Angel out of existence. It's really sad as up until this very moment they were two of my five favorite heroes 🙁

 

[Krj2501]

Actually this is one point where we may be able to see what's coming.

Here's what I mean - think about in the Fray Comic -where it states that sometime in the 21st century - the Slayer & her allies battle a gigantic army of demon. While the exact fate of the Slayer was unknown - she succeeds in banishing the demons, and vampires from this realm. It's only after about 2 centuries that the demons & vampires return.

And at the end of this issue (#34) we see the return of a whole lot of demons.

My bet on what's coming up by the season finale - We'll see Buffy & Angel both return to their Champion Form(all be still Superpowered) and unite with the Scoobies, and possible Angel's allies (i.e Spike, Illyria & Connor) to finally drive the demons from the main Whedon'verse. But victory will come at a price.

All supernatural (non-human) beings will be pulled into another dimension - which includes Buffy. Angel, Spike, Faith, as well as other Slayers, vampires, werewolves, and demons. Witches will likely be depowered to co-exist with normal humans.With the human characters of Xander, Dawn, Giles, and likely Willow will remain in the main Whedon'verse.

It all kind of makes sense when you remember that Joss just loves - huge Apocalyptic battles for his Finales.

 

[Buffy4ever2k10]

Sex in space? Are you ****ing kidding me?

Sorry but this is bad fan fiction. I don´t like Buffy with superpowers and it looks like she doesn´t even care about the world.This is not what i expected and Giles is the worst watcher ever.

Faith has now superpowers too or how could she heal so fast?
I don´t get it. They destroyed Buffy and Angels character. They are the big bads now like i thought and it sucks!

I can´t write anymore i´m to upset.

 

[white avenger]

All supernatural (non-human) beings will be pulled into another dimension - which includes Buffy. Angel, Spike, Faith, as well as other Slayers, vampires, werewolves, and demons. Witches will likely be depowered to co-exist with normal humans.With the human characters of Xander, Dawn, Giles, and likely Willow will remain in the main Whedon'verse.

I would be inclined to agree with this except for one thing. Angel, Spike, and anyone else from the LA crew, at least the superhuman ones, Connor and Illyria, are or would be basically only in Season 8 on loan from IDW. I'm not certain that Joss would be within his rights to any sort of change in them that would have to be carried back over into their own series. Remember, he CREATED those characters, but legally they are under contract, so to speak, to another publishing company who are using them in their own series, so, while he might be able to use them for a crossover arc, he wouldn't be able to make any kind of permanent change in them. It would be like a Superman guest appearance in a "Fantastic Four" comic where Dr Doom killed Superman with a synthetic kryptonite ray. If Superman died in the Marvel universe, he wouldn't be able to return to his own universe, meaning that all of the series that DC uses him in would no longer be able to. (I hope that makes as much sense being read as it does to me while I'm writing it)

The only way that Angel, Spike, Connor, Nina, and Illyria could participate in that final battle and NOT be sucked into the alternate dimension with all of the other supernatural beings would be for them to be "re-humanized," but in doing so there would be a change made in the characters that would eventually create an anomaly with their story line in their own series at IDW, even with the time difference. Eventually, whatever happened to the characters while in the Dark Horse universe would have to happen to them in the IDW universe, UNLESS we are supposed to believe that the IDW Angel and others are actually NOT their Dark Horse counterparts.

(As I said, I hope that this makes as much sense to the reader as it does to me while I'm writing it. If not, just ignore the whole thing, and remember that it's early morning right now, and I didn't sleep much last night)

 

[Buffy4ever2k10]

Okay besides all the things that happend between Twangel. *sigh*

Giles searched for a mystical totem to kill Buffy? What is wrong with him and are they still looking for it? Is the totem now useless?

I dont believe it. Giles could really kill Buffy...this is just horrible. Giles character gets too dark imo. I don´t like it.

Faith is now "the slayer" and i hope ready to fight them.

The flashforwards are interesting and Spike fighting shoulder to shoulder with Buffy is great. I always liked them the most when they are facing the evil together.

Who is that on the picture with the three days ago line? It looks like Dawn but i can´t tell for sure.

Good thing is i don´t really care anymore about season 8 and the following seasons. The direction this season is heading is interesting but it´s just too much of everything. I will read it till the end that´s for sure but how the characters behave is not like i imagined.

I said it before but i really miss the old scoobies and the hellmouth.

Bvts and Angel saved my life so i get very emotional about it and this is just too much. 🙁

The cover of issue 35 makes now more sense then ever and this makes me sad.

Goddamn.....