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Discussion of "Angel: After the Fall #1" - Released 11/21/07 (IDW)

A

Allycat

Guest
:'( my comic book store ordered mine too late... I won't get it until next week... I'm so very sad now.
 

Clem Rocks

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Not sure if spoilers are allowed in this thread so

*SPOILERS!*














Finally got issue one and read it. First impression is what we all already knew, man the art is shit! The only characters i could actually recognise are Connor and Gunn, everyone else was just a half assed attempt by the artists.

And apparently you can do strong things to characters in just one comic, like make Gunn rock, and completely ruin Wesley D=, one of the best characters in Angel and they ruin him in one comic for god sake D=

Story's not too good yet, but that's to be expected with it being the first issue, and seeing as we supposedly have big shocks coming, we can assume it's gonna get better, especially seeing as we know Spike's in the next issue =D and then Illyria =D

The one good thing about this comic, and it's a really good thing, is the length =D, why can't Buffy season 8 be that long? D=

Overall, a slow start to a comic that has a lot of potential, can't wait for the next issue *checks back of issue one*, if only they had told us when the next one's out...

P.S The artwork really is shit! That just needed to be said again...
 

nerd4hire

Certified Uncloneable
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Messages
9,102
*** Discussion of Issue. Expect Spoilers If You haven't Read It***

I got it.

Comic guy gave me a choice - official cover, or variant. I took the official for collectibility, but then I was walking out the door and I actually looked at it. It's this fruity, cherry colored thing with kind of a 70s pschychedelia motif. No offense, but there's no other way to put it. It's gay. I went back, and traded it for the variant, which isn't completely horrible.

I got it home and read it. It was better than the first IDW Angel comic I ever read, but that's all the flattery I can force out of myself.

In Brian Lynch's new Angelverse Wolfram & Hart killed Fred. That wasn't the impression I got in the series I saw, but I don't see a big connection between this Angel and (The) Angel even if they are calling this comic canon.

Apparently Joss says he was interested in Lynch because he felt Lynch had the voices down. For the first time ever I'm going to disagree with Joss. Not here Lynch doesn't. I don't know who these characters are, but they're not the ones I know from Angel.

Remember when Wesley died rebelling against W&H. OK now the ghost of Wesley is a W&H toadie. And the motivator for this about face is W&H has a contract with him. So fear of death couldn't make Wesley play ball, but this contract can...uh, yeah...OK.

Remember self-healing Angel? Now he needs some kind of parasites. I played with the idea these were the hallucination parasites from Soul Purpose, and maybe this is all a dream, but I don't think Lynch is that clever. I think, he just wanted some cool little healing parasite things, so he made Angel easier to wound.

There's no Spike, or Illyria yet, but hey we do get Lynch's telepathic fish thing from his previous, definitely, non-canon Spike comics. And we're supposed to what? Thank him. Not today.

And no explanation as to how they got out of the alley. They can say it's about story exposition, but I can't help thinking it's a cheap ploy to suck us into buying more issues. Rots o Ruck.

And on the last page Gunn's a vamp. This is the big story ending surprise, is it? We knew that 2 years ago.

So, in case you're wondering, I didn't like the first issue of Angel: After the Fall much. I want my 5 bucks back.

Get some real writers IDW. Did you hear the news? Drew Goddard is on strike. He might want to make a couple easy bucks writing a comic, or three.
 

Clem Rocks

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*** Discussion of Issue. Expect Spoilers If You haven't Read It***

Remember when Wesley died rebelling against W&H. OK now the ghost of Wesley is a W&H toadie. And the motivator for this about face is W&H has a contract with him. So fear of death couldn't make Wesley play ball, but this contract can...uh, yeah...OK.

Well Lilah was kinda different when she came back thanks to her contract, but yeah, this issue is really not what i was expecting, can only hope it gets better
 

Lyri

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Sineya
wait, they actually made Gunn a vamp...? *insert random swear words*

i thought the whole point of Wesley dying was so that Gunn wouldn't. Joss changed that for a reason. i expected Gunn to die, but vamping him seems like Lynch is hanging onto Joss's coattails. i get that this comic is canon, so Lynch probably wants to stay true to what Joss had already planned for S6, but the show getting cancelled made Joss change a few things, and i think Wes dying in place of gunn was one of those things.

it seems to me that by turning Gunn into a vampire, Lynch is taking the easy way out when it comes to thinking up storylines and actually writing the thing. i haven't even read this and already i'm not impressed!

i got an email today to say that my copy was being delivered and should be here within 2-3 days (so much for the 28th!) so i'll probably be back Sunday with some more remablings.
 

Black Eye Guy

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Black Thorn
Eh.. Not impressed. I didn't even realise that was gunn at the end! I really don't like the art, The only real part I was intrested in was the Gwen/Nina/Connor bit I thought that was cool.

I'll read it again and come back.

Oh and the fish was stupid!
 

Clem Rocks

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Eh.. Not impressed. I didn't even realise that was gunn at the end! I really don't like the art, The only real part I was intrested in was the Gwen/Nina/Connor bit I thought that was cool.

I'll read it again and come back.

Oh and the fish was stupid!

I didn't realise it was Gunn either, i had to check to see if Gunn was wearing the same jacket as the vamp
 

Tranquillity

That'll put marzipan in your pie plate bingo
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I think i'll add a positive perspective and say that i really liked it. I reckon it's got massive potential to build into a really great story. I like the artwork - very masculine which suits the macho world of Angel. As to Gunn being a vampire - i'm sure i read somewhere (an interview with david fury (or greenwalt?) perhaps?) that this was always intended - that Gunn would have been the big bad of season six should it have been filmed, so i thought that rocked. Gunn has the potential to be a pretty good nemisis for angel - legal knowledge, sympathy for W&H(?), intimate knowledge of Angel and Co.. It would seem that the glowy thing Gunn took out of the skeleton guy is particularly important

"It started with a girl" - I think Wolfram and Hart were implicated in Fred's death because they made sure that Gunn's brain upgrade was temporary, they knew he'd have to make a deal for a permanent fix and they knew that the doctor would get him to sign the customs release for illyria's sarcophigus. They also did nothing to help Team Angel when Gunn requested help to save Fred - thus condemning her to Death (well that's how i've always see it anyway).

I will agree that Wesley did seem a bit weird but i'm prepared to accept this part of his perpetual contract (for the moment). I'm glad they are promising us 'First Night' when we'll find out a little more about the acctual fight in the ally, at least we know the fill-in information is coming (which is more than we can say for Buffy). I like that Connor, Gwen and Nina are present.

I'm just happy to have Angel back!

Edit:

darn, too late to edit.

Apparently it was Amy Acker and J. August Richards who spoiled the would-have-been season six story lines at a convention sometime last year.
 

nerd4hire

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As far as the Gunn as vamp talk goes. It goes back to the John Kerry fund raiser radio talk thing. I don't know how many years that's been. Including that one, off the top of my head, I can count 3 mentions by Joss, saying Gunn would have been dead, then later Amy Acker confirmed the talk Gunn was to be a vampire. There were rumors before that. There's at least 3 threads, and multiple mentions on this board alone concerning the progression. This is why I said the big surprise at the end was not surprising. Also it's presented clumsily and not much of a shocker.

Concerning W&H's involvement in Fred's death, OK yeah you can make a fan wank argument for them being in back of Knox and the doctor's agreement in spite of the fact Knox was in the cult of Illyria before he joined W&H, and the fact W&H weren't happy about Illyria's appearance, but why would Angel think there was a connection? He knows Fred's death was organized by Knox and his Illyria cult. He saw W&H help to take down Illyria. He heard Hamilton tell him W&H didn't get along with Illyria. The suggestion was they didn't want her around.

Nevertheless they say A:atf is canon so I guess we have to accept it now. W&H was behind Knox's actions. Doesn't make sense is all.
 

Anya2012

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I hate the art and I'm pretty sure I'll hate the story arc. I haven't gotten my copy yet but what a disappointment it's turning out to be.

Get rid of Urru!!!
 

Kean

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Sineya
*** Discussion of Issue. Expect Spoilers If You haven't Read It***

I got it.

Comic guy gave me a choice - official cover, or variant. I took the official for collectibility, but then I was walking out the door and I actually looked at it. It's this fruity, cherry colored thing with kind of a 70s pschychedelia motif. No offense, but there's no other way to put it. It's gay. I went back, and traded it for the variant, which isn't completely horrible.

I got it home and read it. It was better than the first IDW Angel comic I ever read, but that's all the flattery I can force out of myself.

In Brian Lynch's new Angelverse Wolfram & Hart killed Fred. That wasn't the impression I got in the series I saw, but I don't see a big connection between this Angel and (The) Angel even if they are calling this comic canon.

Apparently Joss says he was interested in Lynch because he felt Lynch had the voices down. For the first time ever I'm going to disagree with Joss. Not here Lynch doesn't. I don't know who these characters are, but they're not the ones I know from Angel.

Remember when Wesley died rebelling against W&H. OK now the ghost of Wesley is a W&H toadie. And the motivator for this about face is W&H has a contract with him. So fear of death couldn't make Wesley play ball, but this contract can...uh, yeah...OK.

Remember self-healing Angel? Now he needs some kind of parasites. I played with the idea these were the hallucination parasites from Soul Purpose, and maybe this is all a dream, but I don't think Lynch is that clever. I think, he just wanted some cool little healing parasite things, so he made Angel easier to wound.

There's no Spike, or Illyria yet, but hey we do get Lynch's telepathic fish thing from his previous, definitely, non-canon Spike comics. And we're supposed to what? Thank him. Not today.

And no explanation as to how they got out of the alley. They can say it's about story exposition, but I can't help thinking it's a cheap ploy to suck us into buying more issues. Rots o Ruck.

And on the last page Gunn's a vamp. This is the big story ending surprise, is it? We knew that 2 years ago.

So, in case you're wondering, I didn't like the first issue of Angel: After the Fall much. I want my 5 bucks back.

Get some real writers IDW. Did you hear the news? Drew Goddard is on strike. He might want to make a couple easy bucks writing a comic, or three.


I know this is in no way your fault but you just broke my heart a little! I had such high hopes for this comic and from what you say I'm disgusted. If it's as bad as you say then Joss should pull the tag season 6 from it and just leave us with the fantastic ending that we already have.
 
Tranquillity
Tranquillity
It's not all Bad! I loved it.

Clem Rocks

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@Tranquillity&nerd4hire: I think the reason Angel blames Wolfram and Hart is simply if they hadn't have taken the jobs, Fred would still be alive, Knox wouldn't have met her so he wouldn't have chosen to use her as the vessel for Illyria
 
Tranquillity
Tranquillity
good point.
nerd4hire
nerd4hire
I think Traquillity accidently pressed the wrong button with disagree, so I'll press the agree button even though I disagree, and even things out. Hehe, that's funny. Actually I think you'll make points on the exchange.

Karl

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Just read it and I think it sucks, it sucks bad. I don't like the premise, I don't like the art and I hate what they have done to Wesley & Gunn.
 
Kean
Kean
I know! making him a vamp is the absolute worst thing they could have done to him

nerd4hire

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Tranquillity
Tranquillity
also at the IDW formum too

Angel's vision

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This could go in the way of season four-either love it or hate it.

I had my copy and to be honest I was surprised to see Gunn as a Vamp mainly because earlier he was getting rid of an Evil Demon and had no signs of being evil, plus the remarks concerning Gunn I assumed were part of Josses' jokey remarks reg who survived the Ally.(I also took Amy's remarks to mean that's what would of been if they hadn't cancelled the show and did S6,
Clearly they are doing this in comic form...)
What I didn't like was what they did with Wes it makes his death piontless!
Can't they make him rest in B***dy peace? Still it is interesting how Angel is gonna take things judging by the closing dialogue, and what is it with the healing parasitie? I thought Vamps had quick healing properties! I'm still not liking the Hell LA unless they are moving towards Angel finding a way to bring hell away from LA I'll be dissapionted.

The Story has potential to be something so I'll give it a few Issues before thinking it crap.
 

Tranquillity

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@Tranquillity&nerd4hire: I think the reason Angel blames Wolfram and Hart is simply if they hadn't have taken the jobs, Fred would still be alive, Knox wouldn't have met her so he wouldn't have chosen to use her as the vessel for Illyria

Sorry, that should have read tranquillity AGREES - Good point (must have clicked the wrong box by mistake)

It ties in nicely with what Angel says early in the book about going to W&H being the biggest mistake in a life defined by mistakes.
 

GATEGOD

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I finally got it! Off to read it ^_^

Edit:

I had my copy and to be honest I was surprised to see Gunn as a Vamp mainly because earlier he was getting rid of an Evil Demon and had no signs of being evil,

The Story has potential to be something so I'll give it a few Issues before thinking it crap.



:Spoilers:


The fact that Gunn is still 'alive' well not alive, but not dead, well he is but... the fact that he still walks the earth ^_^ Is great.

He didn't seem evil at all when we first see him... Could he have just killed those things because they were demon worshipers or is he evil?

I can't tell maybe he is soul Gunn or Evil Gunn idk... Do you?

The beginning was a bit weird... and i hoped they would have just started the moment the show ended... but atleast they promised to explain what happened in latter additions.
Even though they should have in the first :) I liked most of it, but psychic fish? and weird demon things.. they don't look like demons they look like 'Gew/goo' monsters :lmao:
 

Canon

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Just read it, and I thought it was alright but I found it really confusing at times so I think I'll need to go back and re-read. And I'll agree that the art isn't that great either, I'm finding it hard to figure out who's meant to be who and such....
 

tommy

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My copy of ATF 1 came in the mail this morning all unexpected and it made me happy.

It's a good comic. I like the art by Urru and I have the variant which he also did the cover for. Sure, I wouldn't have recognized say, Nina, if the words "werewolf" and "Nina" weren't on the page, but that doesn't bother me. I know what comic Nina looks like now. I managed to read ish 5 of Buffy without realizing Andrew and certain slayers were in it until I looked on Wikipedia. I like the design for Wesley - he looks kinda creepy.

I get that some people are mad at the way certain characters are acting, but one issue isn't really enough to go on. It make sense that characters would behave differently - they've been through things. Like death. Maybe in the next few issues you'll start to find out why people are doing what they're doing. Wesley being all differenty and mysterious is interesting and I want to know more.

The telepathic fish is my least favorite thing so far. Seems unnecessary. Could turn out to be a really important character.... but it's a big fish!

It would be much easier to tell that the vamp on the last page is Gunn if his eye scar was still visible a little. That seems to be the big new feature of his face.
 

GATEGOD

Anyanka
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My copy of ATF 1 came in the mail this morning all unexpected and it made me happy.

It's a good comic. I like the art by Urru and I have the variant which he also did the cover for. Sure, I wouldn't have recognized say, Nina, if the words "werewolf" and "Nina" weren't on the page, but that doesn't bother me. I know what comic Nina looks like now. I managed to read ish 5 of Buffy without realizing Andrew and certain slayers were in it until I looked on Wikipedia. I like the design for Wesley - he looks kinda creepy.

I get that some people are mad at the way certain characters are acting, but one issue isn't really enough to go on. It make sense that people would behave differently - they've been through things. Like death. Maybe in the next few issues you'll start to find out why people are doing what they're doing. Wesley being all differenty and mysterious is interesting and I want to know more.

The telepathic fish is my least favorite thing so far. Seems unnecessary. Could turn out to be a really important character.... but it's a big fish!

It would be much easier to tell that the vamp on the last page is Gunn if his eye scar was still visible a little. That seems to be the big new feature of his face.
Plus they jumped from Gunn then came back, at first I'm like what did they do to Angel...?
But is Gunn killing them because they were evil or because he is? :drunk:
 
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