Does anyone notice that there is hardly any full on fight scenes in season 1?

[tylermaaynard]

I do like season 1 but I must say it is probably my least favourite season, just because of how there isn't much action or fight scenes in it. Does anyone know why this is? It's justs straight after season 1 season 2's fight scenes were so much better! Do you think it's because they couldn't afford good stunt doubles?

 

[Robb Stark]

That's exactly what it was. Fight scenes mean trained stunt doubles, specialized stunt coordinators, added insurance and basically, just more money. It's the same reason why a lot of show try to avoid using fire if they can avoid it. Fire means a fire marshal has to be present for filming, which means you have to pay him, and actors/stuntmen trained in handling fire. Making things look cool on screen, just as a general rule, tends to get pretty pricey.

And in S1, I think they had almost no money to work with a lot of the time. In the commentary for "Welcome to the Hellmouth", Joss Whedon talked about how they had one set hallway which they used for every scene in the school for the entire first season. They also had way more vampires killed off screen so they didn't have to pay for the effect of having them explode into dust.

 

[Mischlings]

It all came down to budget. It's quite interesting how that changes over time in the show -- for example, Season 1 is really underlit in places, so then they got better lighting in Season 2. Season 1 barely had fight scenes, then they got the money for it in Season 2. They shot on 16mm for the first two seasons, then got the budget to shoot with 35mm, which makes the show look much, much better. They never got enough money that the CGI didn't look bad, but that's just something I have to forgive for a 10 year old show.

Also, just having a budget doesn't mean that there can't be real problems with the fight scenes anyway. Much as I like the swordfight in Becoming Part 2, they shot the stunt doubles very badly, which comes down to camera placement and other things not as reliant on a budget (seriously, that's where you go for a wide shot from above, not a medium shot from the side. Unless Buffy was supposed to grow 6 inches and Angel's hair was supposed to start receding in the middle of the fight).

 

[tylermaaynard]

It all came down to budget. It's quite interesting how that changes over time in the show -- for example, Season 1 is really underlit in places, so then they got better lighting in Season 2. Season 1 barely had fight scenes, then they got the money for it in Season 2. They shot on 16mm for the first two seasons, then got the budget to shoot with 35mm, which makes the show look much, much better. They never got enough money that the CGI didn't look bad, but that's just something I have to forgive for a 10 year old show.

Also, just having a budget doesn't mean that there can't be real problems with the fight scenes anyway. Much as I like the swordfight in Becoming Part 2, they shot the stunt doubles very badly, which comes down to camera placement and other things not as reliant on a budget (seriously, that's where you go for a wide shot from above, not a medium shot from the side. Unless Buffy was supposed to grow 6 inches and Angel's hair was supposed to start receding in the middle of the fight).

Thanks for your help!
Oh my, have you noticed that in becoming as well? I think it was a very good fight scene but like you said they messed up a lot with the stunt doubles. I noticed this quite a lot in season 2 and season 3 but not as much, then through the later seasons it gets a lot better.

I've also noticed that Buffy fights differently in some seasons, this is obviously due to different stunt doubles.

Another thing I've noticed is that on the first half of season 2 the noises that Buffy makes whilst fighting aren't actually Sarah Gellar, it's the stunt doubles and then on the other half of the season you can then tell that it is Sarah. If you know what I mean?

 

[white avenger]

Thanks for your help! I noticed this quite a lot in season 2 and season 3 but not as much, then through the later seasons it gets a lot better.

I've also noticed that Buffy fights differently in some seasons, this is obviously due to different stunt doubles.

I've also noticed that Sarah and Eliza seem to use the same stunt double occasionally. She does one very distinct kick where she leans forward, swinging one leg back all the way around and kicks her opponent in the face. I've never seen anything like it in ant martial arts form or freestyle demonstration, and I seriously suspect that it's actually from ballet or gymnastics (you'd be amazed at just hoe many "martial artists" in the movies and on TV have a more extensive background in gymnastics or ballet than they do in tae kwon do or kung fu. Patrick Swayze for one, and Van Damme for another, though the Muscles from Brussels DID practice martial arts and competed)

Incidentally, the fight in the dream sequence at the beginning of "Beer Bad" is one of my favorites in the whole series, along with the Buffy/Faith showdown.

 

[Mischlings]

I've also noticed that Sarah and Eliza seem to use the same stunt double occasionally. She does one very distinct kick where she leans forward, swinging one leg back all the way around and kicks her opponent in the face. I've never seen anything like it in ant martial arts form or freestyle demonstration, and I seriously suspect that it's actually from ballet or gymnastics (you'd be amazed at just hoe many "martial artists" in the movies and on TV have a more extensive background in gymnastics or ballet than they do in tae kwon do or kung fu. Patrick Swayze for one, and Van Damme for another, though the Muscles from Brussels DID practice martial arts and competed)

Incidentally, the fight in the dream sequence at the beginning of "Beer Bad" is one of my favorites in the whole series, along with the Buffy/Faith showdown.

I looked through IMDB, and I didn't see anyone listed as stunt double for both Eliza and Sarah.

Also, which Buffy/Faith fight are you talking about? My first thought is the fight in Graduation Day Part 1, but really, every fight between the two is awesome.

Though, that made me think of something that bugs me -- something small, but it still bugs me: Faith and Buffy have distinctly different fighting styles. But, in Who Are You, when they fight at the end, they're using each other's fighting styles. I know it's because they've swapped bodies and everything like that, but it still bugs me that their fighting styles are off.

 

[white avenger]

Though, that made me think of something that bugs me -- something small, but it still bugs me: Faith and Buffy have distinctly different fighting styles. But, in Who Are You, when they fight at the end, they're using each other's fighting styles. I know it's because they've swapped bodies and everything like that, but it still bugs me that their fighting styles are off.

Probably because both Slayers were fighting on a subconscious, instinctive level, relying almost entirely on the reflexes and muscle memories of the bodies that they were currently occupying. That being the case, Buffy and Faith were simply allowing their respective bodies to do the job that they did best, without interference from the brains except for specific strategies. That being the case, both bodies fought in the style with which they had conditioned over years of training.

Plus, the actors simply fought the way that they always had, and didn't think that anyone would notice.

 

[AmelRIOT]

I really like season 1 even though a lot of people dislike it I like it cause the storylines are really good bringing things that are always in soaps and other teenage shows but with horror, plus people seemed to really enjoy it so that's why more seasons came, but I do agree there isn't much fighting but that's because of budget they don't want to spends loads on the first season just in case people didn't like it and cancelled it.

 

[Evil Angelus 95]

I feel like Season 1 gets overlooked because of its short length and since its the show just getting onto its feet. It's not a bad season, but compared to the show's peaks, its lacking a little bit. Still, its better than Season 4 by a long shot 😛

I don't think there were a lot of fight scenes because Joss and the other writers were still trying to figure out what they wanted exactly in this show they had created

 

[Zauberei]

They shot on 16mm for the first two seasons, then got the budget to shoot with 35mm, which makes the show look much, much better.

Yeah, I always wondered why some shots in S1 look grainier than in subsequent seasons. I guess I've gotta rewatch with the commentary track on! 🙂

 

[SMG14Fan]

They shot on 16mm for the first two seasons, then got the budget to shoot with 35mm, which makes the show look much, much better.

I actually like the way the show looked in seasons 1 and 2. Although I've always been a fan of 16mm. I like the grainy look.

 

[Mischlings]

I actually like the way the show looked in seasons 1 and 2. Although I've always been a fan of 16mm. I like the grainy look.

I don't mind it in Season 2 as much -- it took me a while to notice the change in quality, actually -- I had to go back and look at Season 2 and 3 back to back in order to notice the change. Season 1 looked pretty bad, but the main reason wasn't the 16mm. Season 1 looked bad because of the lighting, which improved greatly between 1 and 2. I think that made more of a difference to the look than switching from 16 to 35.

 

[SMG14Fan]

I don't mind it in Season 2 as much -- it took me a while to notice the change in quality, actually -- I had to go back and look at Season 2 and 3 back to back in order to notice the change. Season 1 looked pretty bad, but the main reason wasn't the 16mm. Season 1 looked bad because of the lighting, which improved greatly between 1 and 2. I think that made more of a difference to the look than switching from 16 to 35.

I agree about the lighting in season 1. As far as overall visual look goes, I like how season 2 looks the best.

 

[BladeRunner2007]

Yes, the fight scenes, (if you can call them fight scenes) are very bad and short. As everybody already sad because of the small budget. But season 2 improved greatly on this. And season 3 is just amazing in the fighting department. Still, I enjoy season 1 a lot. Basically because it handles the characters so well and it also establishes everything just fine.