Does Oz deserve a free pass?

[Tome]

Oz cheated. Sure he didn't control himself once he turned into a werewolf, but he made the conscious decision before he turned to lock Veruca in with him. He had good intentions, but it still happened. Now, do I think it's a big deal or that he deserves a free pass? Neither exactly.

I think Willow had the right to be mad. And we could all see Oz felt terrible about it. I think that she'd have moved on at some point, though. Just look at how she changed her mind about hurting him when she was doing the spell. I see Willow as a very forgivable person. I think it was OZ who didn't forgive himself and realized he had to work some things out(mainly his wild side). Thus why he left. 🙂

 

[prophecygrrl]

Do you think Oz cheated? No
If you don't, why do you think he didn't? Oz said the Wolf inside of his was out of his control. The primal urges of the beast lured him to Veruca, Oz knew what would happen when they both changed and in doing so he sacrificed his relationship with Willow to save many denizens of Sunnydale.

Whoops, accidentally hit enter on my rep. I don't agree lol and I think Oz did cheat, but just wanted to say that your banner is awesome.

The thing about the whole "animalistic urges" idea is that said urges weren't to blame for everything. Oz not telling everyone about his suspicions is purely his own fault. Him getting into the cheating situation with Veruca is a consequence. Not saying he could've foreseen that, but that if he had come clean, it most likely wouldn't have come to that anyway.

 

[mayfever]

Woz is my second favourite couple in the entire Buffyverse, so the way there were broken up by the writers really pains me, especially how they had Oz act like such a jerk through the entire thing...

I think Oz cheated, and I don't think he should get a free pass. I get the whole "animalistic urges" thing, and I also agree that, in a way, he was in a no-win situation because he had to protect innocent people from Verruca. Still, he could have locked her in a separate cage, or told Buffy or someone about her. I don't like the way the writers sometimes tend to sell something as a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario, when clearly there could have been a way to sort things outif only communication had been better.

Still, I think they could have made things work again if Tara hadn't shown up...

 

[Marisa]

I think he did cheat. Do I think it was right no but there were circumstances. So do I think he deserves a free pass? No but I do think he should get some credit. His and Willow's relationship was complicated when it came to cheating.

 

[Deus Ex Machina]

I was watching Phases again last night, and Oz didn't tell people he was a werewolf right off the bat, so I guess him not telling them about Veruca kind of made sense in that regard as well? Like, he thought it was something he could handle on his own, so it was best to keep it to himself.

 

[VisionGirl]

Oz does what a lot of the characters in the Buffyverse do: try to handle situations alone. Other examples: Buffy hiding Angel when he came back, Wes taking baby Connor, etc. I don't know so much that I think he's "guilty" for sleeping with her, since the werewolf urges took over, although he & the writers certainly did not give him a free pass, but he was wrong in the way he handled things, which led to the breakup & his leaving. Well, technically we all knew why things went the way they did, but I'm talking about in the story.

 

[Mumrik]

I was watching Phases again last night, and Oz didn't tell people he was a werewolf right off the bat, so I guess him not telling them about Veruca kind of made sense in that regard as well? Like, he thought it was something he could handle on his own, so it was best to keep it to himself.

Or maybe he was just panicking. It's only natural. I mean, real people have problems revealing important things about themselves to others, too. I think coming out as a werewolf to your friends must be pretty hard, so maybe he had the same mindset about the whole Veruca thing. He's a guy who overthinks things and maybe he was likening her to himself a little. That maybe she wouldn't want other people knowing she was a werewolf and he didn't want to be THAT person. Still a mistake, but alo still an understandable one.

 

[FetalPig]

Everyone deserves a free pass ... even Warren ... erm .. but he used his up ages ago

 

[prophecygrrl]

soulunsung agrees: Oh no, I'm not blaming everything on his animalistic urges. I actually like Oz, but I didn't care for his cheating and/or not telling someone (namely Buffy) about Veruca when he found out.

Oh, I didn't see your comments, lol. 😀 I was responding to other people arguing that since he was a werewolf and not in control of himself, he shouldn't be blamed. I like Oz too! And Woz! I just think that in this instance, Oz is wrong.

I agree with VisionGirl that Oz is just trying to handle the situation alone and that other Scoobies have also done similar things, but I also think that that doesn't mean he can avoid blame. I mean, personally, I think Buffy lying to the others about Angel in Season 3 was wrong, Giles trying to deal with the Ripper business by himself at first in 'The Dark Age' was wrong, etc. (not many other immediate examples come to mind at the moment, but I'm sure there are plenty...) Not that those things shouldn't have happened, of course, because characters sharing absolutely everything would be boring lol, but that it's still not the best way to handle things a lot of the time and consequences are inevitable. And in that, there should be some blame. No free passes! 😛

 

[soulunsung]

Oh, I didn't see your comments, lol. 😀 I was responding to other people arguing that since he was a werewolf and not in control of himself, he shouldn't be blamed. I like Oz too! And Woz! I just think that in this instance, Oz is wrong.

I agree with VisionGirl that Oz is just trying to handle the situation alone and that other Scoobies have also done similar things, but I also think that that doesn't mean he can avoid blame. I mean, personally, I think Buffy lying to the others about Angel in Season 3 was wrong, Giles trying to deal with the Ripper business by himself at first in 'The Dark Age' was wrong, etc. (not many other immediate examples come to mind at the moment, but I'm sure there are plenty...) Not that those things shouldn't have happened, of course, because characters sharing absolutely everything would be boring lol, but that it's still not the best way to handle things a lot of the time and consequences are inevitable. And in that, there should be some blame. No free passes! 😛

I actually agree with your logic here, because while Oz was wrong in what he did I feel the same as you do, he shouldn't get a free pass. There were still consequences there and Willow was still hurt. And of course, one could argue (and I believe what I'm about to say a well) that Willow hurt Oz with her cheating with Xander as well. So on this one thing alone, they're both even.

I tend to think that the arguing that Oz is human most of the time and has a soul is okay in one sense, but when you're talking in terms of when the werewolf takes over and he loses himself and has to succumb to his animalistic behavior, that's where it gets a bit murky. It's still Oz, it's just an animalistic version of him. Just like, Angel is still Angelus without a soul even if both of those characters are two different distinct character's, the way that Spike is still evil without his soul and different when he has a soul.

OMG. I can't believe I'm even trying to discuss this, because I'm confusing myself with all my thoughts jumbled in my head, but I hope you see where I'm going. lol.

 

[prophecygrrl]

I actually agree with your logic here, because while Oz was wrong in what he did I feel the same as you do, he shouldn't get a free pass. There were still consequences there and Willow was still hurt. And of course, one could argue (and I believe what I'm about to say a well) that Willow hurt Oz with her cheating with Xander as well. So on this one thing alone, they're both even.

I tend to think that the arguing that Oz is human most of the time and has a soul is okay in one sense, but when you're talking in terms of when the werewolf takes over and he loses himself and has to succumb to his animalistic behavior, that's where it gets a bit murky. It's still Oz, it's just an animalistic version of him. Just like, Angel is still Angelus without a soul even if both of those characters are two different distinct character's, the way that Spike is still evil without his soul and different when he has a soul.

OMG. I can't believe I'm even trying to discuss this, because I'm confusing myself with all my thoughts jumbled in my head, but I hope you see where I'm going. lol.

I agree, but on the second instance, he opened up the cage for Veruca to get in with him, knowing what would happen if he did so. That was a conscious decision. And while it was made with the intention of saving lives, it shouldn't have come to that in the first place. Veruca was a monster as a werewolf and even worse as a human being with a soul for 27 days out of the month...I think she's primarily to blame for the situation and I guess in a sense I've been putting too much blame on Oz, but I still don't think he should be in the clear. And I think we actually agree (sorta, unless I'm understanding you wrong) on that part.

 

[Himiko]

First off: Willow definitely cheated. I don't agree that kissing someone else isn't cheating (unless you're in an open relationship, or have some kind of agreement, etc. but then, that could also apply to sex, so yeah...)- not only that, having kissed Xander once, she then continued to act on her feelings, despite knowing that they were wrong, much as Oz did with Veruca. The only difference was the physical act that they engaged in- to me, sex is a form of showing physical pleasure and/or affection, etc. just like passionate kissing (obviously, with more added risks, etc.), which I know isn't neccessarily a commonly held viewpoint...

Anyway, yes, both of them strayed- I'd be tempted to say Oz got a "free pass" of sorts for that one, because it's pretty well established that he doesn't have control over his wolfy self, and it was only after the transformation that he and Veruca sought each other out. Though I imagine Willow would still have been upset, and knowing he had the potential to do something like that might well have made Oz seek more control over his inner wolf anyways. Both of them then went on to do it again, despite knowing that it was wrong. Both felt guilty over their actions- rightfully so- and I wouldn't say that either deserved a free pass. I think Oz's guilt lies largely in the fact that he didn't tell anyone about Veruca- I mean, I don't see him being able to build a spare cage in a day, when it got to the end of the day and she was there, then locking her in with him was probably the best thing to have done under the circumstances. Still, Willow had every right to be upset that he chose that route, instead of telling her, or Buffy, as he was upset when he discovered her and Xander.

I do think it was unfair of him to bring her and Xander up that early in the argument- they had supposedly put it behind them, and it just sounded like he was making excuses, or getting revenge, or that he deserved a free pass, which was at odds with how he acted in the rest of the episode.

I do think they would have made up, given time, though.

 

[soulunsung]

I agree, but on the second instance, he opened up the cage for Veruca to get in with him, knowing what would happen if he did so. That was a conscious decision. And while it was made with the intention of saving lives, it shouldn't have come to that in the first place. Veruca was a monster as a werewolf and even worse as a human being with a soul for 27 days out of the month...I think she's primarily to blame for the situation and I guess in a sense I've been putting too much blame on Oz, but I still don't think he should be in the clear. And I think we actually agree (sorta, unless I'm understanding you wrong) on that part.

No. No. We do actually agree on that part and I think I was essentially trying to say exactly what you did say here and a lot more eloquently. I, too, tend to think that we put a bit more blame on Oz without really considering that Veruca is a third party involved here and she seems to escape some of the blame. Or maybe it's not that she escapes it, so much as it's not as discussed more or less.

But, yes he did make a conscious decision KNOWING what would happen next, and I think that's what tends to have me thinking that he carries a bit more of the blame than Willow does in this situation.