Help 7.04 Official Discussion

I thought the ep was ok. It was very depressing to watch. I majorly cried when Willow went to see Tara's grave. Gosh I miss her.

I really felt bad for Cassie esp. when she saw Buffy and Xander outside of her dad's house. It made me so sad when she that she doesn't want to die. It wasd also sad that even though she got saved by Spike and Buffy she still ended up dying. That sucks. I really liked her too. 🙁

OMG. That Zachery Ty Byan guy from Home Improvement totally annoyed the hell out of me! I couldn't stand him at all. What an a** he was to Dawn about taking a poll of whose got a date to the dance. That was so mean. Haha. He got bitten by the demon.

OMG. That scene where Buffy went to see Spike in the basement was too depressing for me to watch. I just hated it when Spike kkept hitting himself. I cried when Spike said I hurt you Buffy and I will pay. I am paying. I just can't stand seeing Spike like that anymore. I don't want him to be crazy forever. Was Angel ever like that when he first got his soul?

Loved it when Cassie told Spike 'She'll tell you' Someday she'll tell you. ' Of course me being a B/S shipper I totally freaked out. I think that Cassie meant that Buffy will tell Spike that she loves him. I mean that's what Spike wants. He wants Buffy to love him. Spike's face was in shock too when Cassie told him. It gives me so much more hope that they will be together! I just hope that that 'someday' will come verrrrry soon. I'll never give up on Buffy and Spike!
 
Originally posted by Princess Buffy

I cried when Spike said I hurt you Buffy and I will pay. I am paying. I just can't stand seeing Spike like that anymore. I don't want him to be crazy forever. Was Angel ever like that when he first got his soul?
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I think it was implied in Becoming Pt. 1 or 2 when Angel was in the gypsy camp that once he started remembering the horrific things he'd done when he had no soul, the torment would drive him crazy.

Then we see him about 10 years later during the Boxer Rebellion in China, perfectly lucid but definitely dark and brooding.

Hopefully it takes a lot less than 10 years to get over the "insane" stage, and we can have a more functional Spike back this season.
 
All we ever got to see about Angel was after he was done dealing with insanity apart from a few flashbacks like the one where that demon picked him up in NYC to take him to LA. That was already 100 years after the gypsy cursed him. And we need to bear in mind that he did not have anybody to support him. He still tried to hang out with his old gang which did not help either.
We need to have some time until Spike is back to fairly normal as that is what makes the difference between Angel with soul and Spike with soul. Otherwise his part might end up just being an Angel copy and nobody needs that.
I like this season so far very much and ep4 was great. All the seeds for interesting future development.
And then Dawn! I am really growing to like the girl. I am glad for her that they decided to give her some substance.
 
Did anyone else have flashbacks to the 'Buffy & Cordelia go to Frat party' episode back in Season, I dunno, 2 or 3? The whole group of guys in ritualistic-human-girl-sacrifice to the yucky demon in exchange for riches thing again.

I also took the 'someday she'll tell you' at face value. What's bugging me is I can't remember what Cassie (aka Cassandra - well-known prescient of Greek myth) foretold to Buffy. Anyone?
 
Originally posted by Stake'em & Smile
If you guys wanna see something kinda cool and freaking pertaining to this episode you have to check this out.

http://www.cassienewton.com/

The site really exists!
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I was going to check that out too. Forgot about it. Wow, that's a trip. I didn't think it would. Wonder if it was there before Buffy and they cast her because of the site. Nah. Cool site though.
 
I can't believe it's an actual site! That rocks. It looks exactly like it was on the show. Awesome much?
 
Another great ep.

Do agree that Buffy threatening the student was a little unrealistic but can understand her desparation.

Really liked Stake'em's theory about two Spikes. Maybe insane Spike is just another Big Bad shapeshift? However the things he says while insane are leading Buffy in the right direction so....

I liked Cassie too and was also disappointed when she died but can understand why it went that way so Buffy could realize that her Slayer persona won't always be able to help the high school kids. There was a little insight to this when Buffy and Xander were at Cassie's dad's house and she said "Slayer-Buffy would just knock down the door and Counselor-Buffy had to wait".

Overall very good - little blips into moving the story along.

Can't wait until next week to see if Buffy really does kill Anya and if so why!
 
Wow, I really liked the episode. I cried like a baby, first with Tara and then Cassie died. And when Buffy was talking to her dad I got all teary. I got very mad that Cassie died, it was sad and I was crying and then I started yelling at the TV. And I took what Cassie said to Spike at face value too, which also made me mad because I'm a die hard B/A fan, and now all these people tellign me it's just Joss tricking us is making me happy again. At first when Xander was asking Willow if she was ready for this I thought she was going back to the high school, that would have been so Joss. But I really liked the ep and can't wait till next week
 
cool! there really is a site! I like the poem too, I just wish there was more to look at.

When Angel lost his soul, he actually went back to Darla. There were flashback on "Angel" that showed this. He went back with Darla, Spike and Drusilla, and they were still rampaging through Europe. Except Angel would only eat theives and murdered and such. Never innocents. But Darla knew and wanted him to eat a baby she had gotten for him, he refused, and she 'kicked him out'. The next thing I remember happening to him is him eating rats in a city somewhere, all crazy like.
 
Originally posted by Buffy Ann Summers

When Angel lost his soul, he actually went back to Darla. There were flashback on "Angel" that showed this. He went back with Darla, Spike and Drusilla, and they were still rampaging through Europe. Except Angel would only eat theives and murdered and such. Never innocents. But Darla knew and wanted him to eat a baby she had gotten for him, he refused, and she 'kicked him out'.
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Yes, I think the baby incident happened during the Boxer Rebellion, about 10 years after the gypsy curse. The version they showed on Buffy (S5?) had more emphasis on Spike killing his first Slayer during all the upheaval. But in both cases Angel was sane and not happy with his lifestyle.

Spike, on the other hand, had been hanging around with humans and fighting evil even before he got his soul back, so I'm sure he'll be on some sort of accelerated sanity track.
 
Ok, watched again last night and what Cassie foretold to Buffy right before dropping dead, in response to Buffy's "See, you can make a difference" was "And you will." - clearly with an unspoken 'but not this time'. I'm thinking Buffy's made a difference many times already; - saving lives, saving the world - twice by dying. Anyway, the answer to what you do when you know that "Sometimes you can't help" is that you keep trying, because when you get over this you realize that Sometimes you CAN.
 
She couldn't save Cassie (which is what she set out to do) -- but (presumably) stopping the red-robed creeps and vanquishing their demon *did* "make a difference".
 
I thought this was a very good episode, with great acting from many cast members, as well as the girl playing Cassie. Not sure where I stand on what she meant by, " she'll tell you", but my first reaction was that she'd tell him she loved him. By the way, on the Cassie website there's are more than one poem. Over on the left, it says poems, paintings, and ramblings. It all seems pretty cool, but its a little freaky. I wonder if the site existed pre-show or not?
 
This is as best as I recall it:

Willow: I Google'd her.
Xander: Will, she's only 17.
Willow: That's a search engine.

Terrific ep. Wonder what next week will bring?
 
Doyle, it's actually something like

"Have you googled her yet?"
"Willow, she's only 17!"
"It's a search engine."

But the funniest part...

"They don't tolerate that kind of behaviour, where I come from.."
"The Hood?"
"Beverly Hills.. which is *a* hood.."

-mmmdonuts
 
What exactly was meant by "googled her." I got the play on words, but i really didn't know what Xander thought Will meant... Hmmm.. maybe my mind's not dirty enough.
 
I think Xander just *assumed* it meant something...else. Like, ogle or something. I don't think 'Google" has a meaning besides to run a search on a search engine. I've actually heard this term used like this before, so it's not a Joss thing. Heh. You gotta love the information age. All these crazy words used as slang that eventually make their way into standard English. I wonder how long before we see a entry in a dictionary:

google (gu'-gul): v to search for a term or item on the Internet via a search engine. Google Buffy the Vampire Slayer to find cool discussion forums

Google has to feel pretty spiffy about this development. After all, no one says, "Yahoo that" or "I think I'll alta vista WWII for my history paper..."
 
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