Higher stakes? The Scoobies & Slayers vs The First Evil or Team Angel vs W&H
- Thread starter Joshua
- Start date
I have not read any Angel comic, so take that into account.
That being said, I think they were equal in the high stakes department: both were armies of evil spilling into our world. Whether the Senior Partners planned to destroy the world or not, that's what would have happened had they won that fight (I guess I heard something about everyone being sucked into a hell dimension, but as mentioned I haven't read comics about it).
That being said, I think they were equal in the high stakes department: both were armies of evil spilling into our world. Whether the Senior Partners planned to destroy the world or not, that's what would have happened had they won that fight (I guess I heard something about everyone being sucked into a hell dimension, but as mentioned I haven't read comics about it).
NileQT87
Billowy Coat, King of Pain
Wolfram & Hart swatted the First Evil like the irritating little bug it was. No contest which was the bigger threat with a more well-thought-out plan.
The end-all, be-all of the First Evil's incompetent plan was to overrun the planet with a bunch of Hellmouth nasties. All the First managed with its so-important key plan of using Spike was a few dead no-name ladies and Andrew getting a sore neck (and he deserved worse).
Wolfram & Hart sent the whole city of L.A. to another dimension just in retaliation for killing a few key employees and only gave up one city (while having offices still all over Earth) because Angel was too expensive. The Wolf, Ram and Hart remain entirely undefeated in some other dimension and are still completely capable of acting up in the main one. Then there's all those dead employees that still walk, talk and do their jobs forever.
The First Evil was practically getting mocked at the end for being impotent and incorporeal with only the power to taunt. It clearly was getting nowhere in its desire to be corporeal again.
Even Holland Manners alone was better at taunting Angel than the First Evil managed on anyone past Amends (the only time it did anything almost effective). What Wolfram & Hart pulled with Darla's resiring and spiking Angel's drink with Connor's blood was more competent than anything the First Evil managed. Granted, Wolfram & Hart had five years of development on its side, as well.
I'll put my money on the Big Bad that actually defeated the other Big Bad. It certainly wasn't Buffy's dumb little spell that saved the day. She, the Scoobies and all her little girls would be Hellmouth food without Lindsey/Lilah/W&H's shiny bauble and plan to drive Angel crazy with Casper the Friendly Vampire. Buffy wouldn't have won her last battle without Angel being desperate enough to save his son with a little sweetener on the side of saving his ex from her non-existent plan. Without the deus ex machina, it would be Angel fighting a lot of Übervamps with a lot of scared teenage girls with new powers that need to be trained from scratch. He's had plenty scarier foes than them, given that even Dawn could slay them (the one Buffy slayed earlier was clearly the only MVP). The demon horde as a parting gift from Wolfram & Hart he had in the alley was comparable. Jasmine and the Beast were more apocalyptic, seeing as every souled being on the planet was about to become Jasmine's one-minded army. Wolfram & Hart are nigh unbeatable. Only a full-powered Illyria might give Wolfram & Hart a run for its multidimensional existence.
The end-all, be-all of the First Evil's incompetent plan was to overrun the planet with a bunch of Hellmouth nasties. All the First managed with its so-important key plan of using Spike was a few dead no-name ladies and Andrew getting a sore neck (and he deserved worse).
Wolfram & Hart sent the whole city of L.A. to another dimension just in retaliation for killing a few key employees and only gave up one city (while having offices still all over Earth) because Angel was too expensive. The Wolf, Ram and Hart remain entirely undefeated in some other dimension and are still completely capable of acting up in the main one. Then there's all those dead employees that still walk, talk and do their jobs forever.
The First Evil was practically getting mocked at the end for being impotent and incorporeal with only the power to taunt. It clearly was getting nowhere in its desire to be corporeal again.
Even Holland Manners alone was better at taunting Angel than the First Evil managed on anyone past Amends (the only time it did anything almost effective). What Wolfram & Hart pulled with Darla's resiring and spiking Angel's drink with Connor's blood was more competent than anything the First Evil managed. Granted, Wolfram & Hart had five years of development on its side, as well.
I'll put my money on the Big Bad that actually defeated the other Big Bad. It certainly wasn't Buffy's dumb little spell that saved the day. She, the Scoobies and all her little girls would be Hellmouth food without Lindsey/Lilah/W&H's shiny bauble and plan to drive Angel crazy with Casper the Friendly Vampire. Buffy wouldn't have won her last battle without Angel being desperate enough to save his son with a little sweetener on the side of saving his ex from her non-existent plan. Without the deus ex machina, it would be Angel fighting a lot of Übervamps with a lot of scared teenage girls with new powers that need to be trained from scratch. He's had plenty scarier foes than them, given that even Dawn could slay them (the one Buffy slayed earlier was clearly the only MVP). The demon horde as a parting gift from Wolfram & Hart he had in the alley was comparable. Jasmine and the Beast were more apocalyptic, seeing as every souled being on the planet was about to become Jasmine's one-minded army. Wolfram & Hart are nigh unbeatable. Only a full-powered Illyria might give Wolfram & Hart a run for its multidimensional existence.
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W
WillowFromBuffy
Guest
WRH's apocalypse is long in the future. They do bad works, but they are no immediate threat to humanity. Angel admits that destroying the Black Thorn is little more than a temporary inconvenience for the senior partners. Therefore, no risk and no gain.
The Scoobies stopped an insane preacher and a new race of übervamps, creating a new generation of superheroes in the process. Pat on the back.
The Scoobies stopped an insane preacher and a new race of übervamps, creating a new generation of superheroes in the process. Pat on the back.
and yet Giles banned Angel and his friends from the Scoobies because he worked for W&H yet it was Wolfram and Hart that saved their asses in Chosen lmao gotta love irony
AlphaFoxtrot
Scooby
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Here's the way I look at it. The First is an Primordial being, an elder thing, that much like Sauron, or Morgoth, was cast out the doors of night into the void, and can no longer take physical form in the universe, but if it could, Titan who would destroy or enslave everything. The Wolf, Ram & Hart are lower beings, who specialize in manipulating the world of men for the benefit of the Demon World. They are best fitted to this world, but, in the First’s world, they have no purpose, and would probably be devoured as food for the elder things. Ultimately, the Senior Partners are like Spike or Trick, they like the Human World, because they feed on it; whereas the First is like the Master or Angelus, they want to destroy the world, in devotion to the old ones.
NileQT87
Billowy Coat, King of Pain
Buffy won? I'd say W&H won with help of Angel and Spike. Or, possibly, Lindsey via Eve and Lilah was behind it to start with and not strictly W&H at all.
Buffy didn't win squat in Chosen.
Buffy didn't win squat in Chosen.
