How many times have we messed with people's memories?

[RiverandFaith]

I noticed after watching a few episodes of both Angel and Buffy, and I've notice that we like to mess with people's memories. In Angel, you have 1.08 "I will always remember you" where, in order to fulfil the whole Angel back to a vampire thing, we had to turn back the clock so only Angel remembers those events, but also when the angel gang goes to Wolfram and Hart, we have memory swipes for the Jasmine and Connor's existence. In Buffy, everyone's memories are played with to make way for Dawn. Are these the only counts or are there more? Also is this maybe an unintentional fix that's overused by the writers?

 

[RachM]

*Broken record* Technically IWRY doesn't have anything to do with memory wiping as, as you stated, the day was rewound, so therefore no one ever formed the memories of the day.

Angel erasing his friends memories of Connor is different matter, that was definitely a Thing.

Aside from inserting Dawn into everyone's memories, we also have Willow wiping Tara's memory at the end of All The Way and attempting to wipe both Buffy and Tara's memories in Tabula Rasa (which, of course, goes haywire and causes everyone to temporarily lose their memories).

I don't think memory wiping was ever supposed to be viewed as a "fix", especially considering how Tara (rightfully) calls Willow out for it and describes it as a violation. I think, in Willow's case it was used to show how badly she was sliding down the path of recklessness and magic, in the Monks' case it was viewed as a necessary tool to protect the Key and in Angel's case, it was used to show how desperate he was to save his son.

 

[DeadlyDuo]

It's a shortcut used to serve the story. IWARY is basically what a Bangel happy ending would look like, only that can't happen otherwise there is no show for either Buffy or Angel. By using a memory wipe/rewinding the day, the writers have essentially given their audience a happy ending for Bangel whilst also taking it back so the shows can continue.

With Dawn, memories obviously had to be played with so that the characters don't question her sudden existence.

 

[WillowFromBuffy]

Angel is like the Willow of AtS. He is quick to turn to dangerous magical solutions. And of course, the second spell Willow casts is to save Angel's soul.

The only way a memory spell was used as a deus ex machina we've-written-ourselves-into-a-corner fix is when Angel allows WRH to create a new life for Connor, but I think it turned out well nonetheless. The idea of a Connor who is a the amalgamation of a deeply troubled and a well adapted young man is quite interesting.

 

[Ethan Reigns]

Johnathan in Superstar created a glamour and when it ended, people gradually forgot about all their adulation for him.

I often thought it would be interesting to have Dawn die and people forget about her at various rates with Buffy not necessarily being the last one to forget. Could be an interesting fanfic.

Tabula Rasa and Spin the Bottle followed the same pattern of memories being wiped and danger coming from it.

In order to circumvent the mind wipe in Season 4 of Angel, he had to have his soul removed so they could talk to Angelus, whose memory is still intact.

 

[RachM]

I often thought it would be interesting to have Dawn die and people forget about her at various rates with Buffy not necessarily being the last one to forget. Could be an interesting fanfic.

Oooh, I love this! Could def be an interest fan fic, but in general, it's such a cool concept!

 

[white avenger]

*Broken record* Technically IWRY doesn't have anything to do with memory wiping as, as you stated, the day was rewound, so therefore no one ever formed the memories of the day.

Technically, maybe, what Angel does to Buffy here isn't the same thing as Willow does to everyone in "Tabula Rasa" but the results are the same. One person decides arbitrarily to make a decision drastically effecting someone else without either consulting or getting permission from the party in question.

 

[RachM]

Technically, maybe, what Angel does to Buffy here isn't the same thing as Willow does to everyone in "Tabula Rasa" but the results are the same. One person decides arbitrarily to make a decision drastically effecting someone else without either consulting or getting permission from the party in question.

Yeah, yeah, I know, Angel's such a horrible person for making a decision about his own body/being/fate and not consulting Buffy (because The Oracles totally gave him the time to do so, what with the whole "decide now" bit).

That wasn't the point of this thread, we're talking about memory tampering, so my original point still stands, neither Angel nor the Oracles erased or tampered with Buffy's memories.

 

[WillowFromBuffy]

Angel's such a horrible

Nobody's implied that.

That wasn't the point of this thread, we're talking about memory tampering, so my original point still stands, neither Angel nor the Oracles erased or tampered with Buffy's memories.

What isn't the point of the thread? The OP included it. You claim it doesn't fit. It must be allowed to argue that it does indeed fit.

 

[white avenger]

Yeah, yeah, I know, Angel's such a horrible person for making a decision about his own body/being/fate and not consulting Buffy (because The Oracles totally gave him the time to do so, what with the whole "decide now" bit).

I wasn't making any judgement as to Angel's motivations in this matter, I was simply pointing out that the end result was the same, whether memories were erased or time was reversed and rewritten. But, as I recall, Angel's decision wasn't as much about his own body as it was Buffy's. The Oracles implied that Buffy would die trying to protect him, and Angel bought it. Ironically, she died trying to protect Dawn the next year anyhow. Inescapable fate, obviously.

 

[Priceless]

I often thought it would be interesting to have Dawn die and people forget about her at various rates with Buffy not necessarily being the last one to forget. Could be an interesting fanfic.

They sort of did this in the comics. The seed of magic is destroyed and everything magical begins to fade from the world, including Dawn. It's a great arc and really emotional.