I Will Remember You & Briley

[Buffy Summers]

Are there comparisons between Buffy & Angel in I Will Remember You and what eventually happened with Buffy & Riley?

When Angel becomes human, and he and Buffy are talking about whether than they be together, Angel says Buffy couldn't be an effective Slayer if she was worrying about protecting a human him. In the end, Angel has to go back to being a vampire instead of being with Buffy.

Is there a parallel here with when Riley becomes "more human" and it doesn't work out between him and Buffy?

 

[white avenger]

Neither Riley nor Angel could come to grips with being significantly weaker than Buffy, if that's the parallel that you mean. Neither one wanted to just be the hero's boyfriend, and neither de-chipped Riley nor human Angel were good enough to be either a partner or a sidekick. They each had their own way of justifying what happened, but I think that, basically, Buffy was just too much woman, and Champion, for either one.

 

[Blaze]

I don't think so. I think it was mostly in Angel's head that Buffy couldn't be with a human, I think it would have worked out fine. I think the same with Riley. Sure, Buffy had issues, big issues, in the relationship, but she had it with all her partners, human or not. But I think given the chance, and finding the right partner, she could have dated a human.

 

[Ethan Reigns]

I think the reasons IWRY and Riley didn't last were totally different.

In IWRY, Angel suspected he would become the weak link in a fight and that was proven true. He was further given the prediction by the Oracles that if they did settle down, his humanity would cause the death of Buffy. Angel made the painful decision and his logic is unassailable based on his poor performance fighting the Mohra demon:

Angel: "You saw what happened last night. If anything I'm a liability to you. You take chances to protect me, and that's not just bad for you, it's bad for the people we were meant to help."

Other than that, there is every indication that they would be a happy couple. They have an interesting and somewhat prescient moment when she says:

Buffy: ...You're human for like a minute and already there is Cookie-dough-fudge-mint-chip in the fridge." Cookie dough shows up later in "Chosen".

Riley is in a pharmaceutically augmented state until he rejects the rations he is given plus he has an embedded disk drive which isn't removed until "Primeval" when he rips it out of his own chest. Riley gets hurt by the fact that when Buffy's mother went into the hospital, his "support" was perceived (correctly) as just another burden placed on Buffy at the worst possible time. Riley is also bothered by the fact that Buffy is stronger and a better fighter than he is. He sees her secretiveness as rejection even though he should understand the concept of secrets being essential to the job she has. Riley is also stuck with his corn-fed Iowa ideas about the role of women and Slayer is not part of it. He also has a crisis of faith about the Initiative that would never have happened without Buffy. He gets caught in the vampire den and eventually gives her an ultimatum and she is too late to bring him back, but chasing after him wasn't really her idea in the first place. Later Riley shows up with Sam but he has taken a long time to get over Buffy. It is difficult to believe Riley as an elite soldier because we see him fail at everything he tries and he does not have that faraway look of military people when they are thinking about their past - he seems to be someone who has seen mothing worse than what we have seen. Riley seems better off with Sam and Joss has been so unimpressed with him that he gets a happy marriage, something no important person in the Jossverse gets.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

Is there a parallel here with when Riley becomes "more human" and it doesn't work out between him and Buffy?

You know I never thought about that. That's very interesting.

So I began to think... you don't really have the same situation with Xander, and he is pretty much helpless. Giles not being far from that either. So then I thought further and do you think this belief could come from a deep-seeded root? Such as when Giles drugged Buffy in Helpless and she lost her powers? Could it simply be extrapolating how helpless she felt once having powers and losing them onto Angel and Riley?

Do you think that a 'normal' Angel and Riley would still need the same protecting if they never had powers to begin with, such as Xander? I don't think so. I think it was only because they had powers and lost them that it became an issue. Neither Riley nor Angel would or did, change the way they fought, but neither were as good at it as they previously had been. Granted, Riley was much better than Angel but that was due to training. So Buffy knew she had to protect a 'frail' Angel, and she knew or thought, she would have had to protect a 'frail' Riley as well.

Yes, I do think there is a parallel.

 

[Buffy Summers]

Hmm I think that's an interesting point. Not sure if it would apply to IWRY because that was mostly on Angel's side, but with Riley sure: she would have had to assume Riley felt the same way about being human that she herself had, and subconsciously that would have worked against the relationship.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

Hmm I think that's an interesting point. Not sure if it would apply to IWRY because that was mostly on Angel's side, but with Riley sure: she would have had to assume Riley felt the same way about being human that she herself had, and subconsciously that would have worked against the relationship.

Well.. as Doyle was fully aware of what happened because, if I recall correctly, he was a demon, as Buffy was part demon maybe it was subconsciously in her mind. That coupled with her own experience would have been enough to doom the relationship.

 

[PassionBecoming]

I do think there are parallels, for a couple different reasons, some already mentioned.

1. I do think the fellas themselves, once completely "humanized", did feel threatened by Buffy being stronger/more capable than them. It's in a male's genetic code to "protect the female", so it was probably difficult for them to over come that, especially when they had both been supercharged for so long. This issue showed more with Riley of course, but I do believe both wouldn't have felt as needed by Buffy in any aspect - she is a pretty closed off person emotionally and doesn't readily ask for help with anything in life, so where would that leave her boyfriend if they can't fight along with her?

2. As far as Buffy, she has carried the burden of being the Slayer for years. She is always in danger, fighting, killing, getting beaten on - a pretty high-stress gig. Add to that a boyfriend that can't handle himself in combat situations adds one more thing for her to worry about. Riley seemed more capable of fighting, but she had to be more aware of both he and Angel's weakness in those situations, thus giving her more weight to carry. That had to be on her mind somewhere along the road. She already had to watch over her friends that were out helping her, as well.

I do think it would be possible for a relationship between Buffy and a regular Joe could work, but it would be difficult. He would need to know why she was always working nights and coming home beat up. He would have to learn to keep his nose out of it so she wouldn't have to be worrying about his safety. (Also, I do think Buffy having a significant other/kids lends the bad guys opportunities to get at her more easily. Kidnapping, hurting, killing her family.) The issue with both Riley and Angel is that they were accustomed to be in the fight, with and without Buffy, so it was hard for them to just walk away from what they had been doing their whole lives.

 

[GoSpuffy]

I've never thought of this before but I agree there are parallels. BtVS loves it's foreshadowing and I can't believe I never noticed the cookie parallel before! Angel and Riley weren't what Buffy needed for the end game.