If Giles Hadn't Left...

[Willow-Tree]

If Giles hadn't left in the beginning of Season Six, do you think Buffy would still be alive?

Giles was completely against the idea of bringing Buffy back from the dead, and when he found out that Willow, whom he had greatly respected, cast a spell to re-animate her, he was furious.

If Giles were to have stayed, would Willow & co. be too afraid to cast the spell? Or would they have done it anyway, no matter what his reaction would be.

The Scoobies obviously have a lot of admiration for Giles, or they wouldn't have been so worried at what he might have said when he saw an alive-again Buffy.

Your thoughts?

 

[Flannen]

Interesting question!

Personally, I think Willow would have still been as determined to do it. She knew she was powerful/strong enough to do it. I think the others (Xander, Anya and maybe even Tara) would have needed a lot more encouraging and 'talking into it' to go behind Giles' back when he was actually still in Sunnydale.

I kind of don't want to say they wouldn't have done it all because then Buffy would have stayed dead, which is a sad thought!

 

[Skytteflickan88]

Well, I think they would still have done it. They would just have been more careful. And Willow was surprised that Giles got so angry, so maybe they didn't keep it from Giles because of fear, but because they didn't want to disapoint him in case it didn't work.

Either way, it was a very bad idea to not tell Giles. He could have helped. He might even have been smart enough to know that whenh you bring someone back, here's consequences, like that thing in After life. And he might have asked the question; Where is Buffy?

I still don't get what they were thinking. Bringing someone back from a unknown dimension with dark magic, have no clue in case Buffy would bring hell with her back or not.

I know why they did it, and I think they had good intentions, but they were blinded by their loss to see that what they were doing was stupid. Maybe a part of them knew that, and that's why they didn't tell.

I aslo keep thinking about that poor deer. Where do animal spirits that have been sacrificed in a dark ritual go? To hell?

 

[PrincessBuffy16]

I think they would do it anyway. If Giles had left, he would be with Dawn and Spike in the living room, and they would bring her back just like they did 🙂

 

[Willow-Tree]

I aslo keep thinking about that poor deer. Where do animal spirits that have been sacrificed in a dark ritual go? To hell?

I remember Alyson saying in an interview that that was the worst thing she has done on Buffy, and almost refused to do it.

 

[white avenger]

I think that, whether Giles had remained or not, the ritual would have been preformed anyhow. The Scoobies had already made all of the preparations while he was still in town, so, unless he somehow found out about it and was there to interrupt it, Buffy would have been resurrected, one way or the other.

 

[tkts]

I think it's pretty clear that they intended to do the ritual whether Giles was there or not. In fact, him leaving was a surprise, and just after he leaves, Willow says "I was hoping we'd figure it out before he left."

 

[Xander's Girl]

I think they would have done it, Giles or not Giles. They loved Buffy too much to not do it. And I'm glad they did bring her back. 😀

 

[anyatara]

I don't think they would have brought Buffy back, had Giles been around. When Anya says she tried to get the last Urn of Osiris through a Magic Box supplier, like Willow says Giles could have noticed what they'd been looking for, had he not been so busy sorting out leaving. I don't think he'd have allowed the Scoobies to bring Buffy back, had he known - He knew the power it required, and he always doubted Willow's power and worried about her. He'd have found out sooner or later, and I truly believe had he stayed he'd have found a way to stop them. I'd have liked to think they'd have found a way to bring her back, even with him around, but I think it'd been harder; and would have involved more sneaking around.

 

[Dancing man]

I think they would still of done it, they dont have that much respect for Gilles they dont always listen to him.

 

[Flannen]

I think they would still of done it, they dont have that much respect for Gilles they dont always listen to him.

Out of interest, what makes you think that? I've never picked up on a lack of respect from any of the Scoobies apart from Buffy towards the end. By the time the spell was going to be cast I think he was still their first port of call a lot of the time. I could see what you mean that maybe his decision to leave at the start of season six could have changed how they felt due to the fact they realised they could do it without him but I never really picked up on it before.

Now you've made me want to rewatch season five and look out for it lol 🙂

 

[owa]

I think it's pretty clear that they intended to do the ritual whether Giles was there or not. In fact, him leaving was a surprise, and just after he leaves, Willow says "I was hoping we'd figure it out before he left."

Indeed, I was worried I was the only one who knew this question was answered during the episode.

 

[Flannen]

Indeed, I was worried I was the only one who knew this question was answered during the episode.

Well the one of the original questions was would Buffy still be alive? So just because they (Willow) intended to do the spell whether Giles was there or not doesn't necessarily mean the spell would have been cast.

So maybe it's not a question as to whether they would have been scared or still determined to do it, but whether or not Giles, had he known/found out either before leaving or staying completely, would have let it go ahead, demand they stop or sabotage it?

 

[Zeno]

I'm in agreement with Flannen. Willow had the power, and went out and gathered all of her supplies. I don't think anything would have changed, except they would have brough Buffy back in a lot more secrecy and it would have taken everyone else a bit of an extra "push" to go around Giles. Of course they did the same with Spike, but they have little to no respect for him.

 

[tkts]

I think their intentions are clear: Giles' presence would not have stopped them from trying. This much is evident from the fact that they were disappointed about him leaving before they could do it.

The question, then, becomes whether Giles would have tumbled to what was going on and intervened.

 

[owa]

Well the one of the original questions was would Buffy still be alive? So just because they (Willow) intended to do the spell whether Giles was there or not doesn't necessarily mean the spell would have been cast.

You can ask a what-if to anything. All we know is that 1. Willow was powerful enough. 2. She was VERY determined. 3. No one but the core group had ANY idea of what was going on. 4. They had all the materials and were ready to go.

The only thing that came up was that Giles left, but he wasn't a factor anyway as Willow had already made up her mind.

I guess my dilemma comes from the logic behind the question(s). Anything could have come up, but for all intents and purposes nothing was going to stop them from doing it. The intent was there, and we already know Willow wasn't going to take no for an answer.

These types of What-Ifs are a little frustrating to me because the answer is always another "What if". It's not as simple as Giles staying, it also has to mean, "What if he finds out about the spell before or during?" and "What if Willow doesn't want to stop if Giles tells her to?" or "What if the Scoobies don't want to stop?" or "What if some do and some don't?" It just becomes an endless stream of 'what ifs'.

 

[Flannen]

You can ask a what-if to anything. All we know is that 1. Willow was powerful enough. 2. She was VERY determined. 3. No one but the core group had ANY idea of what was going on. 4. They had all the materials and were ready to go.

The only thing that came up was that Giles left, but he wasn't a factor anyway as Willow had already made up her mind.

I guess my dilemma comes from the logic behind the question(s). Anything could have come up, but for all intents and purposes nothing was going to stop them from doing it. The intent was there, and we already know Willow wasn't going to take no for an answer.

These types of What-Ifs are a little frustrating to me because the answer is always another "What if". It's not as simple as Giles staying, it also has to mean, "What if he finds out about the spell before or during?" and "What if Willow doesn't want to stop if Giles tells her to?" or "What if the Scoobies don't want to stop?" or "What if some do and some don't?" It just becomes an endless stream of 'what ifs'.

Then this probably isn't the thread for you then, considering it's one huge 'what if', lol.

These sorts of things might well frustrate you but they interest others, which is why they are opened. Of course there can be 'what ifs' for everything, but I think this particular one is an important one, as do some others. 🙂

Personally, in response to my own questions, I wouldn't have been surprised if Giles would have actually tried to stop it. I don't think he ever really agreed with that type of magic and he knew that one day, some how, his slayer would die and he was coming to terms with it.

 

[Grey Ghost]

As with others I too believe that they would have still gone through with raising Buffy, Willow would have pushed for it. By this time the addiction of powerful magicks had gone deep into her. UI think that this was another way of proving how powerful she was and she would not have worried about Giles who in comparrison was quite weak on the magick scene. Remember he had to have power given to him from witches in England and if had not returned home he could not have gotten this extra power.