If Xander Never Existed

[white avenger]

Cordy came to tell her about gym class being cancelled, sees her with Xander, Will and Jesse and tells her "I don't mean to interrupt your downward mobility..."

So she had certainly started to deduct cool points from Buffy. So my point is (and I actually think we are making the same point) that all the reasons she liked Buffy are still there, with or without th Scoobies. In fact, there is an argument to be made that they would have been closer friends without them.



Well, I wasn't suggesting that they would become friends right away, let alone BFFs. But that the chance of Buffy and Cordy being friends isn't hampered by Xander not existing. In fact I kinda think it offers them a greater chance to be friends. 🙂

I think that the "downward mobility" comment was more aimed at Willow and Xander than Buffy, just her reinforcing the concept that she felt superior to them, and a warning to Buffy that they were also below HER level, so don't spend too much time with them, unless you want Willow to do your homework for you (and be on the look out for that "deliver" thing in Computer Class).

As for Buffy and Cordelia being friends, if there had been no Xander, I have my doubts that it would ever have happened, Given the way that she was portrayed while living in LA, both in the single flashback that we see when she first meets Merrick, and the movie/comic book, Buffy was pretty much an uber-Cordelia herself when she lived there, and she seemed to be trying to break away from that role there in Sunnydale, whether because she no longer wanted to be that person, the social life would have made the night patrolling impossible, or a combination of the two. Buffy and Cordelia probably wouldn't have really become much more than classmates, at best just talking acquaintances, if it hadn't have been for Xander's fixation on Cordelia, simply because the two girls wouldn't have been associating on that intimate a level. Take away Xander, or someone very like him, and they would have had little to do with each other beyond just knowing each other from school.

Then again, Willow could have been the one fixated on Cordelia, and THEY could have had the secret affair that eventually became common knowledge. That would have brought Cordelia into the core group just as well as her relationship with Xander did. But then, if you did that, it would have changed a lot of what happened in Angel's series...

 

[sosa lola]

As for Buffy and Cordelia being friends, if there had been no Xander, I have my doubts that it would ever have happened, Given the way that she was portrayed while living in LA, both in the single flashback that we see when she first meets Merrick, and the movie/comic book, Buffy was pretty much an uber-Cordelia herself when she lived there, and she seemed to be trying to break away from that role there in Sunnydale, whether because she no longer wanted to be that person, the social life would have made the night patrolling impossible, or a combination of the two. Buffy and Cordelia probably wouldn't have really become much more than classmates, at best just talking acquaintances, if it hadn't have been for Xander's fixation on Cordelia, simply because the two girls wouldn't have been associating on that intimate a level. Take away Xander, or someone very like him, and they would have had little to do with each other beyond just knowing each other from school.

I agree. I don't see Buffy wanting to be friends with Cordelia, but I do see them talking -wasn't Cordelia attracted to Angel? She wanted to have Angel for herself for a while. Also, Cordelia usually found herself caught in Buffy's life by accident, not because she wanted to be there. I think her unspoken/unrealized attraction to Xander and her secretly admiration for the Scooby dynamic was what made her want to visit the library more. Not just Buffy.

 

[white avenger]

I agree. I don't see Buffy wanting to be friends with Cordelia, but I do see them talking -wasn't Cordelia attracted to Angel? She wanted to have Angel for herself for a while. Also, Cordelia usually found herself caught in Buffy's life by accident, not because she wanted to be there. .

I see the point, but the very fact that Cordelia DID make such a play for Angel might have served to keep Buffy and her apart more, and, without that, there might have been fewer, if any, of those accidents to be drawing Cordelia closer into Buffy's gang.

 

[Kean]

I agree. I don't see Buffy wanting to be friends with Cordelia, but I do see them talking -wasn't Cordelia attracted to Angel? She wanted to have Angel for herself for a while. Also, Cordelia usually found herself caught in Buffy's life by accident, not because she wanted to be there. I think her unspoken/unrealized attraction to Xander and her secretly admiration for the Scooby dynamic was what made her want to visit the library more. Not just Buffy.

I think the Angel is a very interesting potential catalyst for a alt!Scooby gang here. Lets just say Willow and Xander are out of the picture Angel is going to be a bigger and more frequent presence in Buffy's slaying life. Cordy gets pulled in the exact same way as she did in actual canon i.e. Buffy saving her but also has the added incentive of being around Angel more. Eventually (S2 most likely) they form an Alt!Scooby gang of sorts. Does Cordy pull Angel out of himself the same way she does in Angel's own show?

The dynamic between the three of them would be very interesting.

Then again, Cordy could get in a snit that Angel wants Buffy and just bails altogether.

 

[sosa lola]

Then again, Cordy could get in a snit that Angel wants Buffy and just bails altogether.

LOL! That's the most likely to happen. But I do love your other S2. God, so many ideas for the fic. I'm so excited. 😀

 

[The Unspoken]

This could be written in pretty much any direction possible. For example, if there wasn't a Xander for Buffy to reject in 'Prophecy Girl', perhaps she wouldn't be in school later to overhear the conversation Giles and Angel were having and she might not have died facing the Master etc.

Anyway, the catalyst to the formation of the Scooby gang was (arguably) Xander and Willow finding out Buffy was the Slayer. The way they found out was pretty arbitrary, so a Xanderless universe could feature a different formation of the Scooby gang. Xander was pretty vital to Buffy's Slayer duties though, for simply being an extra pair of arms and for willing to throw himself in the fight to protect his friends.

 

[Kean]

LOL! That's the most likely to happen. But I do love your other S2. God, so many ideas for the fic. I'm so excited. 😀

LOL, I think that is most likely what she would do too! Let us know what you write, I'd love to see the Buffy/Angel/Cordy dynamic explored. Buffy/Cordy are my secret favourite BBFs that never happened. lol

Oh, BTW, you said you didn't think Buffy and Oz ever clicked. Check out Glossings fanfic on the two. Or on any of the characters really. She's amazing.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

I shudder to think of how Xander would turn out without Willow. I see cigarettes and beer, a Faith-like Xander.

What? He was a pathetic loser in the first episodes.. that's the way they portrayed him. He thought he was cool. Nothing Faithlike at all, he would be a tall Jonathan.

 

[The Unspoken]

You know, you could have Anya reverse the spell during the fic. Hey, look, Anya isn't a complete sociopath. Now that would be a cool twist. 🙂

What? He was a pathetic loser in the first episodes.. that's the way they portrayed him. He thought he was cool. Nothing Faithlike at all, he would be a tall Jonathan.

Sure, Xander was goofy, but he had a lot of other qualities. I don't think he's anything like Jonathan at all, to be honest. He was extremely strong-willed and even ruthless whenever it came to protecting his friends, like when he talked down Dark Willow or in his dealings with Angelus. Personality-wise, he's actually quite similar to Faith in several ways, certainly more so than to Jonathan.

 

[Skanky Vamp]

Sure, Xander was goofy, but he had a lot of other qualities. I don't think he's anything like Jonathan at all, to be honest. He was extremely strong-willed and even ruthless whenever it came to protecting his friends, like when he talked down Dark Willow or in his dealings with Angelus. Personality-wise, he's actually quite similar to Faith in several ways, certainly more so than to Jonathan.

No, I think he GREW into that. If he had not have befriended Buffy he would have been much different, he had few of those characteristics to begin with. He was not strong-willed or ruthless in the first season. I think his character started to grow when he had to give Buffy mouth-to-mouth. The second season you start to see the beginnings of those traits you mention.

 

[brinkster130]

I think Willow would be in a very dark place without Xander. I'm not sure how she'll turn out, but I don't think she'll be the same sweet and insecure girl Buffy met had Xander still existed. I shudder to think of how Xander would turn out without Willow. I see cigarettes and beer, a Faith-like Xander.

I think when it comes to Buffy/Cordelia, Buffy would rather be friends with someone else. Like in canon. She'd probably be friends with Amy after she saves her from her mother.

I doubt Buffy and Oz would be friends, they never really clicked IMO.

I have trouble believing that Willow would have never made friends if Xander had never existed. K-high school is a long time to go through school (in the same town) and never make a friend. Sure, Willow would still be reserved and probably still a nerd; but we know that Sunnydale High had other nerd types. Jonathan, Jesse and Marcie for example; who is to say that they didn't form a small group and stick together...isn't that pretty much what Willow and Xander did?

And what if Cordy had decided in first grad that she wanted to be best friends with a red head? We may have seen a Willow Cordette type person....who knows. Crazier things have happened.

I don't see Xander turning to cigarettes and beer if he didn't have Willow. Im sure he would have been different but I have trouble picturing him going down that path. Maybe he would be a hs dropout who works at Double Meat Palace who is still skateboarding around town and hitting on every girl he runs into.

Buffy/Cordy are my secret favourite BBFs that never happened. lol

You and me both! 😉

 

[sosa lola]

Oh, BTW, you said you didn't think Buffy and Oz ever clicked. Check out Glossings fanfic on the two. Or on any of the characters really. She's amazing.

I don't usually read anything that doesn't have Xander in it, but I'm very flexible and open-minded. Can you link me to the best Buffy/Oz fic written by her? I'll give it a try. 🙂

What? He was a pathetic loser in the first episodes.. that's the way they portrayed him. He thought he was cool. Nothing Faithlike at all.

Duh! That's because he was friends with two other goofy geeks. He was able to be himself around them and they accepted him no matter what. But if he never knew Willow, who was obviously the sunshine in a life with two bitter alcoholics, the one Xander would escape to when things get rough at home, then yeah, I see him becoming someone completely different. He'd probably cope with it by smoking or following the family tradition, and in order to do that he'd probably befriend boys who liked to drink and smoke. Become an a-hole like his father earlier than S6. (Faith would have become a different girl if she had a friend during her childhood like Xander did.)

Xander and Jonathan are very different guys. Xander is braver, wittier, short-tempered, judgmental, stubborn... while Jonathan is quieter, more well-mannered, and less brave and out-going than Xander. The only share their love for comics and Star Trek as well as being bullied in school.

I have trouble believing that Willow would have never made friends if Xander had never existed. K-high school is a long time to go through school (in the same town) and never make a friend. Sure, Willow would still be reserved and probably still a nerd; but we know that Sunnydale High had other nerd types. Jonathan, Jesse and Marcie for example; who is to say that they didn't form a small group and stick together...isn't that pretty much what Willow and Xander did?

I agree. It will probably depend on who Willow becomes friends with and that friend will shape her into a different Willow than the one we know. I do love the idea of Willow and Marcie becoming friends and hating Cordelia together.

I don't see Xander turning to cigarettes and beer if he didn't have Willow. Im sure he would have been different but I have trouble picturing him going down that path.

I think he's capable of that. He has the characteristics to be that person; he can be a bitter and angry kid when things don't go his way. It also depends on who he becomes friends with or if he'd like to follow his parents' footsteps. He can prove he's a man by smoking and drinking, ditching school and hanging out with the wrong crowd.

 

[Willow My Love]

Will could have gone either way, I think. Without Xander, who she relied on a lot, she could have been either even more shy and quiet, or she could have been someone like the girl that was supposed to help Buffy in School Hard but didn't. Personally, I think that she and Buffy still would have wound up friends. They both still would have been outcasts. But Willow wouldn't have been as quirky.

I think Buffy needed to platonic guy friend in her life. She needed male figures since Hank went MIA so strangely. Xander was the brother she never had. Speaking as someone who's father was also MIA, I love my "adopted" brothers. (I love my real ones too. 😛)

The show wouldn't have been the same.

 

[Marisa]

If Xander didn't exist is a really good question. I think Buffy would have still met Willow and formed the scoobies I just think Willow would have been very lonely during those early years.

If you still think Willow would have went dark maybe Buffy would have been the one to talk her down? It is so weird to think of Xander and Willow not knowing each other all those years.

I think you said one of the biggest things that I can think of about Buffy dying in season one unless you think Willow would have been the one to save her? Or maybe even Jesse he could have still existed? Very interesting thoughts.

 

[BuffyThoughts]

Absolutely!

I doubt Cordelia would be friends with Buffy so quickly after the whole "Childhood Trauma" incident. Cordelia cares so much about her reputation and statue at school. Buffy's weird behavior would only drive her away.

I think Buffy would be closer to Angel and do depended on him if Xander and Willow weren't around. I'm not sure it would be healthy, though.

I agree, Cordelia would avoid Buffy. The "childhood trauma" incident was a good reason, but not the only one. I just finished "Beauty and the Beasts," where Pete says, "Here's Scott liking the manic-depressive chick," meaning Buffy. That's Buffy's reputation.

 

[LondonDude]

If Xander didn't exist then Willow would possible be a loner and Buffy would have died in Prophecy Girl.

 

[Mr Giles]

Then he wouldnt have brought Buffy back to life in Prophecy girl 🙁 (cries)

 

[Daniel Osbourne]

In Xanderless Sunnydale, Buffy would definitely have died, and I believe Kendra, Willow and Cordy would eventually have perished as well. Faith might have stopped the Mayor's Ascension, and then again she might still have been drawn in by his false promises. Even without the Mayor, there's still Glory. Speaking of which, Dawn might never have been created. Without Buffy or Cordelia to start Angel on his path to redemption, none of Angel can possibly happen. Oh, and Spike never gets his soul back.

Pretty bleak verse without Xander, isn't it?