Question In HIM, why is it BUFFY'S responsibility to find SPIKE housing?

[garfan]

I thought the difference between Spike and Angel was that Spike got his soul voluntarily, while Angel was cursed with it. I'm thinking it's part of the curse that he was suffering so much from it. With Spike seeking out his soul basically for growth and becoming a better man, the situation was different.

Of course not everyone who has a soul is good and doesn't do evil things, but I feel it was more about giving Spike a chance. He was also not some random stranger, but someone she already cared for before on some level, intentionally seeking his soul to become better. That justifies at least a shot to prove yourself without getting stake
And by the way, i think the Mayor mentioned selling his soul, implying he didn't have one anymore.

Plus they decided that Angel didn't go straight into alleys eating rats, he spent time willing to feed on criminals for a few years, then he tried to play at being normal a bit after that

so who knows. Maybe Spike, a century after getting his soul would be a more different being, compared to six months after getting it

 

[hoponlilmama]

Yes. You are partly correct. Just because I am pedantic he never said make me the man I was, he said make me what I was. Now, that's basically what you said. However you neglect(ed) to finish the quote where he says: "Make me what I was, so Buffy can get what she deserves."

The "so Buffy can get what she deserves" is the real part that is up for debate and any double meanings that can be taken from it.

I wish he HAD gone to get the chip removed instead of getting his soul..

 

[Skanky Vamp]

I wish he HAD gone to get the chip removed instead of getting his soul..

Pretty sure that Buffy didn't deserve him getting his chip removed.

 

[hoponlilmama]

Pretty sure that Buffy didn't deserve him getting his chip removed.

We as an audience did though. 😁

NotASlayer- Would Spike as a Big Bad in s7 have worked though?

 

[Skanky Vamp]

We as an audience did though. 😁

Thankfully Spike didn't ask to give him what the audience deserves, although that would have made a really interesting S7

 

[thrasherpix]

I'd have loved Spike getting his chip removed and becoming the Big Bad. I do think it could work, and as a bonus, it feels much more like "back to the beginning" that the writers promised (but failed to deliver).

Still, there's a part of me that would not care for a return of Angelus with Bleached Hair. They'd need to do something different with him, more so than they had already, to prevent it from become a Bangel clone that chooses the bad boy over shining knight standard option of romance (if with Joss twist, of the knife).

 

[Tueuse de Vampires]

I'd have loved Spike getting his chip removed and becoming the Big Bad. I do think it could work, and as a bonus, it feels much more like "back to the beginning" that the writers promised (but failed to deliver).

Still, there's a part of me that would not care for a return of Angelus with Bleached Hair. They'd need to do something different with him, more so than they had already, to prevent it from become a Bangel clone that chooses the bad boy over shining knight standard option of romance (if with Joss twist, of the knife).

Exactly, he was already the big bad in season 2, so that would have felt a lot like recycling the storylines. I do also appreciate that they decided to end Spike's story on Buffy as one of growth, not reverting back to the original state.

I as a viewed would have been pissed if they'd undone all of his development, same as how they basically ruined all of Cordy's development on Angel in the end.

 

[Tome]

It's simple. It was not her responsibility, but she cared for him. She knew something was going on with him and she wanted to help him.

 

[hoponlilmama]

I'd have loved Spike getting his chip removed and becoming the Big Bad. I do think it could work, and as a bonus, it feels much more like "back to the beginning" that the writers promised (but failed to deliver).

Still, there's a part of me that would not care for a return of Angelus with Bleached Hair. They'd need to do something different with him, more so than they had already, to prevent it from become a Bangel clone that chooses the bad boy over shining knight standard option of romance (if with Joss twist, of the knife).

A lost opportunity, I guess!

I suppose to make Spike a Big Bad in S7 is to have The First in background - his chip gets removed and Spike becomes a killing machine, taking his place as Master Vampire again. And The First makes him stronger (along the lines of the ubervamp).

 

[Faded90]

‘Why is Buffy responsible for Spike?’

A question you could probably ask in every single episode of S7 infairness 😂 the guys largely a chain around her neck making her life harder for the vast majority of the season.

Within the universe I think part of it is guilt because she’s been told multiple times that he got the soul ‘for her’ so she feels responsible for his well-being. Which is messed up but home girl doesn’t get the therapy she really needs 😂

It’s funny though because a lot of fans on Twitter deem Buffy a ‘B ITCH’ early S7 for ‘leaving him alone in a basement’

 

[NoShip]

‘Why is Buffy responsible for Spike?’

A question you could probably ask in every single episode of S7 infairness 😂 the guys largely a chain around her neck making her life harder for the vast majority of the season.

Within the universe I think part of it is guilt because she’s been told multiple times that he got the soul ‘for her’ so she feels responsible for his well-being. Which is messed up but home girl doesn’t get the therapy she really needs 😂

It’s funny though because a lot of fans on Twitter deem Buffy a ‘B ITCH’ early S7 for ‘leaving him alone in a basement’

Those "fans" aren't just on Twitter, I read this board's episode discussion of CRUSH and the "Buffy is a Bitch" crowd is alive and kicking here!!!!!

Also, lots and lots and lots of "Spikey is treated so badly" and "Spikey's feelings" and 'Spikey is the best" and "i hate Spikey dressing like Riley" drivel. AND they actually call him SPIKEY!!!!! I thought i was going to heave.....

All this AFTER Spike kidnaps Buffy, cattle prods her, chains her up in the DUNGEON OF LUV beneath his crypt, and turns DRU loose to kill her while chained up. BUT "poor Spikey!!!"

I thought i was on REDDIT.

 

[Faded90]

Those "fans" aren't just on Twitter, I read this board's episode discussion of CRUSH and the "Buffy is a Bitch" crowd is alive and kicking here!!!!!

Also, lots and lots and lots of "Spikey is treated so badly" and "Spikey's feelings" and 'Spikey is the best" and "i hate Spikey dressing like Riley" drivel. AND they actually call him SPIKEY!!!!! I thought i was going to heave.....

All this AFTER Spike kidnaps Buffy, cattle prods her, chains her up in the DUNGEON OF LUV beneath his crypt, and turns DRU loose to kill her while chained up. BUT "poor Spikey!!!"

I thought i was on REDDIT.

Wowsers. I’ll stay out of that one then!

On this episode Reddit seems to have decided that no episode written by David Fury counts because apparently he hates Spike and everything bad he does is OOC. Of course nothing in Crush is even remotely OOC

 

[Skanky Vamp]

NoShip I think Buffy would have been much better off with evil Spike than clingy, wimpy, "I got my soul for YOU!!!!! I went thru all this pain because of YOU!!!!!" Spike.

Spike was the best thing that happened to Buffy that season. Her journey would never have been completed without him. He was always the catalyst for her growth and change.

 

[hoponlilmama]

‘Why is Buffy responsible for Spike?’

A question you could probably ask in every single episode of S7 infairness 😂 the guys largely a chain around her neck making her life harder for the vast majority of the season.

Within the universe I think part of it is guilt because she’s been told multiple times that he got the soul ‘for her’ so she feels responsible for his well-being. Which is messed up but home girl doesn’t get the therapy she really needs 😂

It’s funny though because a lot of fans on Twitter deem Buffy a ‘B ITCH’ early S7 for ‘leaving him alone in a basement’

Not to get too off-topic, but Angel gives the sickest burn to Spike over on AtS (I think the episode is titled Destiny?) when Spike is trying to make a big song and dance out of getting his soul.

Let me find the exchange:

Spike: Look at you, thinking you're the big savior fighting for truth, justice, and soccer moms. But you still can't lay flesh on a cross without smelling like bacon, can you?
Angel: Like you're any different.
Spike: Well, that's just it. I am, and you know it. You had a soul forced on you, as a curse, make you suffer for all the horrible things you'd done. But me, I fought for my soul. Went through the demon trials. Almost did me in a dozen times over, but I kept fighting 'cause I knew it was the right thing to do. It's my destiny.
Angel: Really? Heard it was just to get into a girl's pants.

Zing! 🤣 And it's true. Spike said as much in s7, "the soul, the changes, I did it for you". He didn't get a soul to be better to mankind. Or to make a difference. He made a rash decision (as Spike does) and went off to Africa.

 

[NotASlayer]

You know, Spike spends so much time guilt-tripping Buffy about how he did this for her, that it increasingly makes it look like he did it purely for himself.

 

[Faded90]

You know, Spike spends so much time guilt-tripping Buffy about how he did this for her, that it increasingly makes it look like he did it purely for himself.

He DID do it for himself. It’s entirely about ‘what can I do to get back in her good graces’. It’s never ‘he became a better man for her’ it’s ‘he became a better man so he can get what he wants from her’

Mostly I wish Buffy had just pushed back and told him that she never once asked him to go get a soul for her so she had nothing to feel guilty about

 

[AlphaFoxtrot]

My guess is that Buffy had a really long summer to think about how she treated Spike over the past year, and came to the conclusion that Spike can't be Angel, expecting moral behavior from an memory of a man with a no moral compass is unfair, and, if he shows up again, to take a different approach to him, based on that, he is trying.

 

[NoShip]

He DID do it for himself. It’s entirely about ‘what can I do to get back in her good graces’. It’s never ‘he became a better man for her’ it’s ‘he became a better man so he can get what he wants from her’

Mostly I wish Buffy had just pushed back and told him that she never once asked him to go get a soul for her so she had nothing to feel guilty about

Except.....if Buffy had a backbone, Spike couldn't become The Champion.

Then, where would a spin-off be?

 

[AlphaFoxtrot]

Yeah, I think a lot of the inconsistencies in Spike's story can resolved by him being the Chosen One for some unrevealed faction. Like, someone else wants a Vampire with a soul, or wanted a backup plan for Angel, et al. Hey, the Guardians of Mu weren't mentioned until the last episode, so another mysterious group isn't that much of a plot hole.

 

[NoShip]

It's mentioned that Anya didn't live with Xander anymore and I do remember her having her own place. I know at some point she had to leave because of assassins after her, but she was in Buffy's home. Maybe Xander's before that?

(I also can't remember why Xander moved out, if there was a reason given for that or not--and I've learned if no reason was given then no reason exists other than contrivance, because I used to assume things that made sense out of the situation which the writers, including Joss, kept saying never occurred to them.)

So why do I have memories of Anya with Xander arguing over Spike being there? And of Anya spying on a sleeping Spike (even sneaking into his room)? What was Anya doing there at all?

I'd like to know, but not willing to watch it again.

Sleeper s7 e8 is what y'all are talking about. See my comment above. It has one of the funniest gags in the entire series - where Anya tries to convince Spike that A STAKE IS A GREAT SEX TOY!!! Well worth the watch.