Innocence vs Surprise

yes... please watch them and tell me what you think... i love these eps... i havent watched the earlier seasons in a while... im too busy watchin angel and charmed... i love the older seasons.. especially the whole bangel thing.. so going to watch them too 😀
 
I really didn't care for Innocence..I mean some of the scenes were sweet..th e whole sex thing..but it was a little to much Bangelness..I'm just not into romance..I did like "Surprise", better..I guess because we really saw how Angel..use to be at one point..but I really just didn't like the Angelus character..it just seemed really awkard.
 
i liked Innocence better as it is the turning point for season 2 where everything starts to turn to crap because Angelus is back,plus you see Buffy deal with her sleeping with Angel and then him changing into a different person and even though its not exactly the same in the real world but people do have to deal with this type of thing, so i just think it portrays what real people have to deal woth everyday really well.plus it is a really good episode in its own mannor.
 
I love Innocence is only really good if you've watched Surprise too, the first time i saw Innocence, it was kinda sad, but it didn't really hit me till i watched them together.
 
I truely love both so much but I'd have to say innocence, so much happend in 1 episode it was packed and amazing.
 
Surprise is the episode that Buffy and Angel sleep together at the end, right? Innocence is the next episode when Angelus is back?

I think I preferred the episode that ended with Buffy telling her mother to just let the candle burn. I think one of the few times that Buffy needed one huge hug.:: fantom
 
Innocence because:

1. Giles and Joyce were so tremendously supportive of their girl, even though Joyce didn't know what was happening.
2. Previously stated 'Joy of the Rocket Launcher' (nicely put Jill Valentine).
3. Angelus is pretty much a smokin' hottie.
4. The impending excitment for things to come experienced by the viewer when the credits roll.

Having said that, Innocence wouldn't be as good if Suprise wasn't excellent as well.
 
I was rather disappointed by these two episodes. The whole "Angel loses his soul" plotline seemed to have been handled in an anti-climatic manner. Very disappointing.
 
In these two episodes, I wonder whether Giles was justified in getting so angry at Jenny. Why? Buffy I could understand, she had lost Angel, anyone connected with that happening would incur her wrath. But Giles - even though he was disturbed that Jenny hadn't been honest with him, it wasn't as though she had caused the disastrous events to happen herself. She did the best she could think of, trying to persuade Angel to get out of the country with the piece of The Judge. In the overall scheme of things it wasn't such a bad plan. What could she have done better? Maybe if she'd told Buffy and Giles who she really was and why she was in Sunnydale and what she knew about Angel's curse, Buffy would have known not to do what she did (although who knows). But revealing everything about herself, given her obligations to her family not to mention her existing relationship with the group, would have been difficult to do. I would think Giles, with his older perspective, would have understood.

Not to mention the fact that Giles himself hadn't told anyone about HIS background leading up to what happened in the episode "The Dark Age". What happened then had put Jenny in great danger.
 
S
Spirit_Of_Fred
[No message]
Giles wasn't angry at Jenny. It was all about loyalty. Jenny wasn't loyal to Giles, while he was loyal to Buffy.

In fact I think he said as much.
 
Innocene is way better. I just watched those two episodes today. I love sad Buffy. I don't like it when she is sad but she does that part so well. I actually believed her there, she was that good. Another reason is because they kill The Judge and the big fight with Angelus and Buffy. Also it really nice to see the bad side of Angel because we don't see that very often.
 
S
Spirit_Of_Fred
hm...im was gonna watch those two tomorrow. what a small world! :)
I thought "Innocence" was better. It had way more emotional depth, and Sarah was awesome! David was too, you could tell he really enjoys playing Angelus. "Surprise" was almost as good, but some of the cheesy romance makes me cringe.
 
Innocence was alot better than Surprise in my opinion. I think alot of people could relate to this episode with the whole sex thing and how it effects you afterwards. Its extremely sad and you could definitely feel for buffy in innocence. Its definitely one of the best episodes of season 2!
 
I'm the oddball here, I really like Suprise better.
Although Innocence was more emotionally tuned and smybolized maturity and growing up, I am just a sucker for the early Bangel romance. After Suprise, I just think the Bangel relationship went down hill. . . and stayed there. Now, down think I'm hating on Bangel, I'm not. I may be new to the whole BtVS scene, but I just love their pre-Innocence days. They are happy, and well, for lack of a better word, so innocent.

I thought that Angel giving her the claddagh ring was so romantic, and that ring symbolized a whole lot after Innocence.

Angel: My people, before I was changed, they exchanged this as a sign of devotion. It's a claddagh ring. The hands represent 'friendship.' The crown represents 'loyalty.' And the heart ... well, you know. Wear it with the heart pointing towards you. It means you belong to someone. [shows her his own claddagh] Like this.

I wonder if he ever changed the position of his ring. Or rather if Angelus did.

And I loved how the episode ended, with the whole consumating of their relationship and not really understanding why Angel shot up like that. I was still left with a happy feeling. . . that was until I watched the next episode.

Blowing up the Judge was awesome, and the Spangelus kiss was to die for. But all in all, Innocence was just too depressing for my taste. Now, I know enough about BtVS to know that it couldn't have ended well for Buffy and Angel. It has bee a recurring pattern in the seasons that I've seen, that characters don't stay happy or together for very long. And what kind of drama would it be if everyone was happy all the time? Not a very good one.

Innocence was so much more dark, and though it sent a powerful message in the most extreme way, "sleep with a man, he goes all evil on you", but I still think that Surprise was the better of the two.
Although I loved the way Innocence ended as well - in the car with Giles got me all teary, and one of the lasts lines.

Buffy: I got older.
 
Yeah I like Innocence better. When the real Angelus shows his true colors. I didn't actually like surprise at all...it was just one of those episodes that I didn't enjoy. So I deffinately liked Innocence much better!
 
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