I was thinking about how much characters in BtVS and Angel have developed over the years. You though who I'm talking about Wesley, Willow, Cordy ect. But then I got to Buffy and I thought "does she even have much of a character?". Now I'm gonna say this and a lot of Buffy fans will probably curse me but I think Buffy has always been a plain character. Xander was the funny guy, Willow was the nerdy (and in later seasons powerful) girl but what was Buffy? She was the Slayer but what else? Does she have any distinguishing character traits? It seems to me the only things she has ever done since season 1 is bitch about being the Slayer (which got worse as the series went on). To me Buffy doesn't really have any deph apart from being the Slayer.
Is Buffy The Least Developed Character In The Whedonverse?
- Thread starter No Angel
- Start date
Emma Caulfield
Salty Goodness
I think Buffy has matured. She gone from a teenage slayer to a adult slayer. Sometimes she could be quite childish but now she understands her slayer duties better and understands hwo important she can be!
U
Utopia
Guest
I think Buffy's been through a lot of changes. One being her relationship with Spike. All of Season 6 was basicly Buffy getting in touch with the darkness inside. Season 7 was her embracing her heritage and using it against the First. Her changes may not have been apparent and obvious, but they were there. You just have to read between the lines. 🙂
U
Utopia
Guest
Season 1 - A new slayer, trying cope with it. Needing a normal life.
Season 2 - Dealing with her relationship with Angel. This accumulates with her having to actually kill him. This makes her run away.
Season 3 - Trying to cope with Angel's death. Getting in touch with some of her darkness because of Faith. Finally lets Angel go.
Season 4 - Trys to get on with life without Angel. Not a lot of changes happened this season.
Season 5 - Gets in touch with the slayers before her. Has to deal with her mother's death. Realizes that saving the world is more important than saving herself. She sacrifices herself.
Season 6 - Gets brought back. This presents a lot of turmoil inside her. She goes to Spike for comfort, which makes her sick. This is why that season was so dark.
Season 7 - Finally intune with herself. She thinks she can't win the battle but she definitely wants to go down fighting. She takes pride in herself and saves the day.
It's obvious that Buffy is not the stubborn little girl she was in Welcome to the Hellmouth.
Season 2 - Dealing with her relationship with Angel. This accumulates with her having to actually kill him. This makes her run away.
Season 3 - Trying to cope with Angel's death. Getting in touch with some of her darkness because of Faith. Finally lets Angel go.
Season 4 - Trys to get on with life without Angel. Not a lot of changes happened this season.
Season 5 - Gets in touch with the slayers before her. Has to deal with her mother's death. Realizes that saving the world is more important than saving herself. She sacrifices herself.
Season 6 - Gets brought back. This presents a lot of turmoil inside her. She goes to Spike for comfort, which makes her sick. This is why that season was so dark.
Season 7 - Finally intune with herself. She thinks she can't win the battle but she definitely wants to go down fighting. She takes pride in herself and saves the day.
It's obvious that Buffy is not the stubborn little girl she was in Welcome to the Hellmouth.
ana8
Missing you....
She is the loner.
No matter how many friends she has, she is the Slayer, and that means being alone. Its her nature.
I would argue that she is the most complex character out of all of them.
I think why people think she's not that well developed is because she hides her emotions, she doesnt say what she feels, she keeps it in inside.
No matter how many friends she has, she is the Slayer, and that means being alone. Its her nature.
I would argue that she is the most complex character out of all of them.
I think why people think she's not that well developed is because she hides her emotions, she doesnt say what she feels, she keeps it in inside.
Magui
Scooby
I am totally with you No Angel...Buffy is just The Slayer,...nothing else...
About growing,well,yeah,obviously,nobody can be a teenager forever...
ana8
Missing you....
Primal Slayer
Did I Fall Asleep?
I think that Buffy did change and grow a little.
Season4-She was by her self a lot growing up and getting a new boyfriend, and she thought she couldnt get the job done.
Season5- ofcourse she changed in this season since she had a sister now, she was a lot more careful and tried to be mature about things. She also worried alot espically after her mother died.
I think if they showed us more of Buffys past at Hemery we wouldve seen how much she has grown(we only saw one little scene in Becoming). I mean because from what we hear from Buffy she was just like if not worse then Cordelia.
The way I look at it, Cordelia is a lot like Buffy, started out like her had her family taken apart, trying to find her place in the world then becoming a fighter agianst the evil.
Everyone around Buffy had an image of what they saw her as and Buffy tried not to let them down(IE: being afraid of telling them about her and spike sleeping together) Buffy has a lot of insecurities about her self. Like when Kendra came she was afraid that she would take her place as Giles favorite, when Faith came Buffy was afraid Faith would take Angel and her friends away from her.
Season4-She was by her self a lot growing up and getting a new boyfriend, and she thought she couldnt get the job done.
Season5- ofcourse she changed in this season since she had a sister now, she was a lot more careful and tried to be mature about things. She also worried alot espically after her mother died.
I think if they showed us more of Buffys past at Hemery we wouldve seen how much she has grown(we only saw one little scene in Becoming). I mean because from what we hear from Buffy she was just like if not worse then Cordelia.
The way I look at it, Cordelia is a lot like Buffy, started out like her had her family taken apart, trying to find her place in the world then becoming a fighter agianst the evil.
Everyone around Buffy had an image of what they saw her as and Buffy tried not to let them down(IE: being afraid of telling them about her and spike sleeping together) Buffy has a lot of insecurities about her self. Like when Kendra came she was afraid that she would take her place as Giles favorite, when Faith came Buffy was afraid Faith would take Angel and her friends away from her.
AngelsGirl
Our job sucks!
I'd say Buffy matured quite alot. Just look at her in Season 1, and then look at her in Season 7. She's grown and matured so very much.
U
Utopia
Guest
But you mentioned Willow becoming powerful, etc. Well, if memory serves, she reacted to Angel getting his soul back by starting witchcraft and eventually becoming all powerful. Are you saying this isn't considered character change? I know I do.
It's our actions that determine how we shape ourselves. Buffy made bad choices and she became stronger for it. 🙂
It's our actions that determine how we shape ourselves. Buffy made bad choices and she became stronger for it. 🙂
slayerangel
b/a always & forever
As the Slayer in S1, Buffy knew about the isolation and how she could never have a normal life as the Slaer, but she didn't really understand all of it. So when Angel went bad, she became stronger emotionally and understands more about the isolation and the world instead of just worrying about her hair or if she's still popular. She matures even more in S5 as she finds more about her origins in mythology and knows that sometimes hard descisions has to be made. She wasn't as mature in S1.
I think that Buffy has changed...and I agree with most of that change being aparent in the last two seasons...but I will also agree that as far as her personality goes it always was a bit flat. I would agree that her character isn't as well developed as many of the others. I also believe that's why you don't see as many people going nuts about her character as they do say for Willow or Anya even. I see where you're coming from No Angel.
blake
Child ofthe lesser God
Has Buffy changed, was she an interesting character? Did we like her?
Now when I say this, I'm going to sound wierd, for some reason most of the time i take the Minority opinion. I guess it's just because i'm unique. Ok, anyway, In all of the Whedonverse, Buffy is my favorite. Why, Because she is compassionate, smart/ has razor sharp wit. And in my opinion was the most conflicted character on the show.
For Starters, you see the big changes, the characters go thru, Because at the inception of the show, they were children for the most part. I mean look at Willow at the start, she was really a child, so of course over the seven years we are going to see her grow into a woman. I've never seen character developement, as the way Joss did with Willow. Also with other characters in the show, they grew.
However, even at the beggining of the show, Buffy, had been the slayer for a while...and I'd imagine that even at sixteen, that had aged her beyond her years. There really wasnt much room for her to mature, as she had done so much, in the earlier eps. I'd like to Argue that the "mature" adults in Buffy really didn't change much, look at Giles, or Joyce. You can argue that, Wes changed and such or even Spike, But look at how Immature Wes was when they first introduced his character, all he has really done is grow up, the same can be said for spike.
Buffy had aged beyond her years at that point. To say she didn't have a personality, is saying to much I think. If Buffy was a boring character,Then why did we watch it? Buffy is the one who carried the show. I didn't tune in every week, or everyday for that matter to see Xander or willow. I was, and Am a fan of Buffy. I am a fan of Buffy, because she was such a great character. At first Buffy was selfless, she helped everyone because she cared so much! She sacrificed the one person that she loved, for the world because she knew she had too. Overtime there were bumps in the road, Buffy became less selfless, less concerned for others, Even when she sacrificed herself to save her sister she came back, Bitter and numb to life......She didn't care at all. At the end I think most of us just wanted her to shut the hell up. Stop with the speeches, what have you. But Buffy went from at teenage girl with a stake in her bag, wearing a miniskirt... To a general leading an army to a battle she couldn't win.
OH Yes....... Buffy's character changed....But Where as willow's character progressed into the HIGHLY attractive, witch she became, Buffy's character almost regressed, as she became more selfdestructive and unable to handle the heavy burden life gave her.
and once again Blake puts the soap box away
Now when I say this, I'm going to sound wierd, for some reason most of the time i take the Minority opinion. I guess it's just because i'm unique. Ok, anyway, In all of the Whedonverse, Buffy is my favorite. Why, Because she is compassionate, smart/ has razor sharp wit. And in my opinion was the most conflicted character on the show.
For Starters, you see the big changes, the characters go thru, Because at the inception of the show, they were children for the most part. I mean look at Willow at the start, she was really a child, so of course over the seven years we are going to see her grow into a woman. I've never seen character developement, as the way Joss did with Willow. Also with other characters in the show, they grew.
However, even at the beggining of the show, Buffy, had been the slayer for a while...and I'd imagine that even at sixteen, that had aged her beyond her years. There really wasnt much room for her to mature, as she had done so much, in the earlier eps. I'd like to Argue that the "mature" adults in Buffy really didn't change much, look at Giles, or Joyce. You can argue that, Wes changed and such or even Spike, But look at how Immature Wes was when they first introduced his character, all he has really done is grow up, the same can be said for spike.
Buffy had aged beyond her years at that point. To say she didn't have a personality, is saying to much I think. If Buffy was a boring character,Then why did we watch it? Buffy is the one who carried the show. I didn't tune in every week, or everyday for that matter to see Xander or willow. I was, and Am a fan of Buffy. I am a fan of Buffy, because she was such a great character. At first Buffy was selfless, she helped everyone because she cared so much! She sacrificed the one person that she loved, for the world because she knew she had too. Overtime there were bumps in the road, Buffy became less selfless, less concerned for others, Even when she sacrificed herself to save her sister she came back, Bitter and numb to life......She didn't care at all. At the end I think most of us just wanted her to shut the hell up. Stop with the speeches, what have you. But Buffy went from at teenage girl with a stake in her bag, wearing a miniskirt... To a general leading an army to a battle she couldn't win.
OH Yes....... Buffy's character changed....But Where as willow's character progressed into the HIGHLY attractive, witch she became, Buffy's character almost regressed, as she became more selfdestructive and unable to handle the heavy burden life gave her.
and once again Blake puts the soap box away
Primal Slayer
Did I Fall Asleep?
well I can see why her personality didnt change that much since she already had a major change that we didnt see, when we first met Buffy she was basically already stronge willed and stood up to others where as Willow started out as a geek to people and basically the same with Xander.
Could it be for the great (in my mind better) supporting cast like Willow and Xander? Rayne basicly put what I'm trying to say in better words. Buffy as a character is very flat and lifeless. When I think about it what is there for Angel and Spike to fall deeply in love with? Maybe Joss meant to make her a flat character. Buffy is the character we see everything through. Maybe Buffy is boring because she is just the vessel that we use to see people and events through? Do you even get what I'm talking about?
U
Utopia
Guest
Plus, the entire fifth season was all about change for Buffy. You might want to consider looking over this season in particular because it's chock full of Buffy becoming more mature. Or maybe you just don't read into the episodes very much ...