Is Twilight Truly the Villian or Is It Buffy?

[AvatarofTruth]

It's would certainly be poetic, for Buffy's last Big Bad to be Buffy herself.

 

[Chase Summers]

Wow, Phoenix, I think you have some deep stuff going on here. I quoted the section above because I both agree and disagree - I think that the idea of control of knowledge as power is a great one. The cat is out of the bag - if ever the demons of the world were on alert against goodness, it's right now. They are all looking over their shoulders and trying to expect what they can't know for sure.

I'm not as certain about robbing people of their right to choose their lives... I do agree with your point, however, I also think that each of these girls was robbed of that right when they were born and thrown into the pool of "potentials." Prior to Willow's spell, any one potential at a time could have been forced to choose the life of a Slayer... but only one at a time. Regardless, at the death of a Slayer, the new one is forced to choose. Waaaay back in Season 1 we saw initial resistance from Buffy when she learned that Giles was her new watcher; she thought she'd left that part of life behind (just for a second). But ultimately she discovers that she really has no choice. Is the crime any greater if it happens to the multitude suddenly, rather than trickling down to possibly 20 or 50 over a single generation? (This point is more for discussion - I can see that there are a lot of ways to look at it)



I think that the scales are considered tipped because the initial balance was a ratio of 1 Slayer: Infinity Demons. That's what was established as a baseline "balance." Even though we're looking at even numbers now between Slayers and Demons, with more produced all the time, we aren't looking at the previous template for an established balance by any means.

Also, I love the idea of the First Good. We complain about Him/Her all the time in real life - so why doesn't He/She/It fix everything or support the Slayer more if He/She/It exists in Buffy's world? Who knows? I suspect it comes back to an issue of free will and doing the right thing for the sake of others, rather than expecting a reward to come down from the First Good (if there is one). Kind of a typical Judeo-Christian answer.

Thanks for the compliment! I completely agree with your thoughts on the imbalance. That is what I was thinking, but couldn't quite word it correctly. As far as the demons and fear of the slayer go I was thinking, maybe that's not so important as the consequences of her and Willow's action? I feel like the point is the natural order/template (to borrow your word) is 1 Slayer: Infinity of Demons, and that natural order has been disturbed. Someone's gotta pay up. Perhaps there is no real villain. Each party believes they are on the side of right.

I like your comments on a First Good. What gets me is that Joss is a self professed atheist and has at conferences called God the "big sky meanie" and believes we are all choosers of our own destiny and savers of ourselves, yet he instills omnipotent evil in his stories. I kinda find omnipotent evil to be far sillier than omnipotent good. The closest thing to a First Good would be the Powers that Be over on Angel and even they aren't ominpotent and all powerful. They once resided on that universe's plane and left. Now, they just watch and feed intel from time to time because being on a higher plane they can see more of the bigger picture - not all, just more. And even they seem self serving.

I get Joss's thinly veiled metaphor that we as humans own the goodness in the universe. That God and good is within us and our capacity, and is not an external force. And sure he throws internal darkness into the mix, but I think his atheism causes a bias in the Buffyverse. A First Evil, but no discernable First Good in a universe that preaches balance? a BIG oversight IMHO.

 

[DrusillaRox]

im thinking this has something to do with the line

"you're at war with the human race"

 

[La Luna Unita]

I kinda find omnipotent evil to be far sillier than omnipotent good.

I get Joss's thinly veiled metaphor that we as humans own the goodness in the universe. That God and good is within us and our capacity, and is not an external force. And sure he throws internal darkness into the mix, but I think his atheism causes a bias in the Buffyverse. A First Evil, but no discernable First Good in a universe that preaches balance? a BIG oversight IMHO.

Yah, it's a fundamental difference in mine and BtVS' view of the world, I guess...

I believe we are helped by a God but that the evil we face comes from ourselves (although I of course believe that we have great capacity for good as well). Seems to be an opposite world in BtVS. I never thought about that before.

However, if we see that Buffy ends up being her own worst enemy in S8, perhaps we'll be exploring a slightly different paradigm. Joss and co. have often expounded on the theme of Buffy's inner and involuntary darkness... not the same as evil, but pretty close.

 

[Cordelia Chase*]

I see it as this. There is a imbalance. Even bigger than what we think. LIke my good friend Bored of the Dead said. There are two imbalances.

1. When Willow raised Buffy from the dead.
2. WHen Willow and Buffy decided to changed the slayer line together.

Forcing BUffy back into the world caused a disruption. Disturbing the balance between good and evil. I think thats how the first evil came along. If the First would of took out BUffy then there would have more balance with just Faith.

Then comes along Giles and many potentials. Scared girls that cant fend for themselves. Looking up to Buffy for help and protection. BUffy knows she needs power and goes after it and the First alone. (( when shes at her best.)) She learns more of the Scythe from the guardian and Willow unleashes the power of it make every potential what she is. A Slayer. Not because she felt alone. BUt to empower them. So they wouldnt be scared. So they could fight back against the evil. BUffy saw this as the only way. Some of you think it was selfish but at the same time I ask you this......if the First wasnt pushed back into the Hellmouth and she didnt learn of the Scythe....do you honestly think BUffy could go around the world protecting thousands of potentials?? This would bring a even greater weight on her shoulders.

But this is just what I think.

And just Buffy has down wrong. But like it was said above...she feels that she has to take care of these girls. Like a mother to its cub. Do what it takes to make sure these girls are safe.


ANd speaking of betrayal...we cant forget in ANywhere But Here, the scene with Buffy on the ground crying. I trhink the girls will attack her because they will become even more targeted as well if the whole world of vampires, slayers and maic is unveiled.

 

[CharmedSlayer85]

I think that the scales are considered tipped because the initial balance was a ratio of 1 Slayer: Infinity Demons. That's what was established as a baseline "balance." Even though we're looking at even numbers now between Slayers and Demons, with more produced all the time, we aren't looking at the previous template for an established balance by any means.

Yeah but the established baseline was created by a group of men who decided to make that the baseline, it wasn't created by say The Powers That Be. It was man that created the slayer and it was man (Buffy) who changed those rules, so why is it that her change is really that bad, because again the number of demons in the world still heavily outweigh the number of slayers.

And I'm also wondering with Willow's spell does this mean that now girls will be automatically born with the powers of the slayer?