Joyce

zobothehobo

Scooby
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I'm re-watching Buffy again... I just started... And I'm remember how much I hate Joyce. When she died, I wasn't sad. I mean, I was sad Buffy was sad and I felt bad she had to deal with all of that on top of everything else going on with Glory and the fact she was stuck with Dawn... but I really hate her. I wish she had died some other time when Buffy wasn't in the middle of all of that. Seriously, any parent that parents by "the books and tapes" is god awful and shouldn't have had kids in the first place. No wonder Buffy's dad divorced her.
 
Aww, I love Joyce! I thought she was a really good mom, even if she did make mistakes, and she loved Buffy and Dawn more than anything. I was upset when she died, but I still love the seasons after her death.
 
D
dan k
[No message]
N
Nymphetamine
[No message]
Yeah, I got the impression Joyce's insight into parenting was probably gleamed from an "Idiot's Guide To Parenting" book in the self-help section.

I had no great emotional impact from "The Body" ...
 
I had emotional impact from The Body... but that was mainly because I've seen both my parents nearly die and prepared my self for both of their deaths so I was imagining how I would feel.
 
Wow, this thread, the OP in particular, is harsh. I loved Joyce, the character, and Kristine Sutherland was so great! I loved the bond she & Buffy have, despite the difficult circumstances (being a Slayer, the divorce, the move, single parenting, etc). I'm watching season 3 right now and Faith's reactions to her are very telling. She didn't have an active, loving parent, so seeing Joyce through her eyes is interesting. And I always liked her interactions with Spike. I'm wondering if you guys are parents?
 
caitaintdead
caitaintdead
[No message]
The only thing I have to say is I never cared for how Joyce reacted to Buffy's calling. "If you leave this house, don't even think about coming back".
 
Z
zobothehobo
That OUTRAGED me. I was like "YOU BITCH! She didn't choose it!"
Definitely don't hate her. Definitely don't love her. No strong feelings about her at all really. She was pretty meddlesome but she's a mom 🙂 It's what they do, lol.
 
I didn't like her much either. My favorite Joyce moment is when she thinks she's a teenager. I still love The Body, but like you said, you feel more sorry for Buffy having to go through it on top of everything else.
 
How can anyone hate Joyce?! She was a loving mom. Of course she is going to say things that people don't like. She's a mother and she's just trying to protect her daughter. I mean, it's every parents calling to make us hate them in any way possible. it's just the nature of things. and i'm sure we were all forbidden to do certain things. Buffy and Joyce had one of the best mother/daughter relationships on tv imo. I cried during The Body. It had such a huge impact on me. Neither of my parents have died but I probably would have reacted the same way Buffy did. In all....I love Joyce
 
Wow, this thread, the OP in particular, is harsh. I loved Joyce, the character, and Kristine Sutherland was so great! I loved the bond she & Buffy have, despite the difficult circumstances (being a Slayer, the divorce, the move, single parenting, etc). I'm watching season 3 right now and Faith's reactions to her are very telling. She didn't have an active, loving parent, so seeing Joyce through her eyes is interesting. And I always liked her interactions with Spike. I'm wondering if you guys are parents?
I know it's harsh... but I really hate her.
I am not a parent... but I might as well be. My parents are kind of... non-parents. I've been raising my little sister Xena since she was 10 and I was 13

---------- Post added at 01:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:46 AM ----------

How can anyone hate Joyce?! She was a loving mom. Of course she is going to say things that people don't like. She's a mother and she's just trying to protect her daughter. I mean, it's every parents calling to make us hate them in any way possible. it's just the nature of things. and i'm sure we were all forbidden to do certain things. Buffy and Joyce had one of the best mother/daughter relationships on tv imo. I cried during The Body. It had such a huge impact on me. Neither of my parents have died but I probably would have reacted the same way Buffy did. In all....I love Joyce

I just felt like she was rude and clueless 99% of the time. She was the PERFECT person for Hansel and Gretel to target because she was so... I don't know the word... almost unable to think for herself. I mean, she thought about her parenting through the books and tapes... not her own mind... she thought about everything through ways people told her to... and it bothered me.
 
Nope, love Joyce to pieces and cried like a baby when she died. Cried like a baby throughout all of 'The Body' and I'll cry every time I watch because Joyce was an awesome mom who did her best, even when she made crap-tasticular mistakes. And I'm thinking Hank had at least half to do with the reasons they got divorced. And to be honest, Buffy wasn't always the perfect daughter, just like Joyce wasn't always the perfect mother.
 
Wow I feel a little bad for Joyce now don't hate me.
See the thing about Joyce is you have to remember Buffy is not a normal teenager she is a slayer a lot of these things are happening and Joyce can't explain them. Then when she finds out she acts like a lot of normal people, we feel differently because by this point we love Buffy IMO. I think later on her bond with Buffy and Dawn were shown and it was nice to see. It is still so sad to see the Body because of Buffy and Dawn's pain, like Buffy said mom did everything she didn't know how to do any of this. I don't know I respect your opinion but I don't think Joyce is that bad.
 
caitaintdead
caitaintdead
Well said.
Nope, love Joyce to pieces and cried like a baby when she died. Cried like a baby throughout all of 'The Body' and I'll cry every time I watch because Joyce was an awesome mom who did her best, even when she made crap-tasticular mistakes. And I'm thinking Hank had at least half to do with the reasons they got divorced. And to be honest, Buffy wasn't always the perfect daughter, just like Joyce wasn't always the perfect mother.

I, too cry every single time I watch the Body...it's so sad 🙁

Also I agree with you on that last part. Buffy would be one hell of a child to raise, no matter who the parent was or how they tried to raise her. Also, Everyone does make mistakes, but the fact that Buffy always wanted her mommy just shows you that the bond the both had was beyond amazing.
 
I have a feeling zobothehobo might change her mind when she's a little older.

I didn't think that there was anything wrong with Joyce's parenting skill. I believe the most important thing about being a parent is giving love and understanding to your child. At first Joyce found it difficult to understand what was going on with Buffy. Joyce did not know that there were vampires in the world and did not know that her daughter was chosen to fight them. It's also important to remember that in the Buffyverse we are told time and time again that adults find it more difficult to believe in things that are out of the ordinary, which explains her reaction.

On top of coming to terms with this discovery, she also had to come to terms with another discovery - that the child she loves is living a harsh, cruel, dangerous, lonely life. Do you think when Joyce threw Buffy out of home that she didn't love her? Or wanted her to leave? I believe that she wanted to protect her only daughter from the horrors that she has to face.

Once Buffy was back home Joyce made every effort possible to come to terms with what had happened to Buffy. She wanted to come slaying with her, and learn the phrases that Buffy uses. She wanted to arrange a schedule with Giles so that Buffy could get the most out of her life.

It's also easy to forget that Joyce left all her friends, and lifestyle that she enjoyed in LA so that she could give Buffy a chance to go to school. Buffy could not get in to any other school in LA, and it would have been easier for Joyce to send her to a boarding school for troubled girls, or tell her to go get a hairdresser apprenticeship. Instead she gave up her life to move to a small town where she knew no one.

I also find it difficult to accept Joyce's actions in Gingerbread. I don't think it made her a weak person either because she succumbed to an evil power. We have seen many people under thrall, or taken over by demons, ghosts or the similar. Just to name a few - Xander, Wesley, Buffy, Angelus, Jenny, Angel.

Joyce may not be your idea of a perfect parent (especially at age 18), but I bet Buffy would beg to differ... And really... Isn't that all that matters?
 
I agree with Zobo. I don't know if I'd go as far as saying I hate her, but I very very strongly dislike her. 😛 Same goes for Dawn, though I'm liking her in what I've so far watched of Season 7. Joyce was just so annoying! I wasn't sad at all when she died, probably because I'm a spoiler-addict and knew it was coming, but I don't remember shedding a single tear in the Body. I don't know...maybe I'll have to re-watch it. Then again, I love Spike and throughout most of the episode was wishing for the next one so I could get my Spike fix. Seriously, the main reason I started watching Buffy was to see Spike (I started at the end of Season 4). Every episode I'd be thinking 'When's Spike gonna show up? I wanna see Spike!' Now, however, having watched the first three seasons, I've started to appreciate the other characters. Anyway, thinking that I'm nearing the episode in which Anya dies makes me sadder than Joyce's death. I mean, I felt bad for Buffy and all, but I just never cared that much for Joyce. She always seemed air-headed to me.

Sorry to all those who like Joyce.:embarrassed: That's just my opinion.

EDIT: I don't criticise her parenting, though, just her personality.
 
Z
zobothehobo
"When's spike want to show up? I want to see Spke." That's what runs through my head when I watch Buffy.
Oh my! Poor Joyce getting bashed 🙁 I think she is a great mum,and I loved it when she featured. Her and Spike some classic moments!!!
 
S
Spikefan31
I agree about her moments with Spike :)
M
Marisa
[No message]
Oh my! Poor Joyce getting bashed 🙁 I think she is a great mum,and I loved it when she featured. Her and Spike some classic moments!!!

I love it when Buffy comes home and Spike is going on about Dru leaving him... That scene CRACKS me up. "Got any of those little marshmallows?"
 
Anya2012
Anya2012
[No message]
As the saying goes: "It takes a village to raise a child." I firmly believe that the wrongest of all the parenting tracks the western world is on today is that the nuclear family is thought to be our natural state and that parenting, as a result, is viewed as a purely private matter. Through Joyce, I think Whedon et al. did a good portrayal of the ups and downs of modern parenting. Sometimes, it is really, really hard to know what to to. If you then lack a "village", other adults to talk to, books and tapes can be a way to get new ideas and inspiration to get a troublesome relationship back on track. I'm married to my kid's father, but still deeply appreciate the input I get from my friends, my parents, my favourite parenting forum - and my books. I love reading about handling horses, about sewing, about cooking, about biology, about Greek myths, about politics, about religion, about ... nearly every topic under the sky. Why would I not let "books and tapes" inspire me in my parenting, probably the most important task I have ever taken on?

Zobo, I do by no means praise all Joyce's actions and decisions. But that goes for every single character on the show. That's part of what makes them real to me. Real people mess things up more or less regularly. I'm sorry, though, to read that your parents have been doing such a lousy job of parenting. Not taking responsibility for children is a far cry from the acceptable mess up-rate.

Edited as my language was not accepted.
 
As the saying goes: "It takes a village to raise a child." I firmly believe that the wrongest of all the parenting tracks the western world is on today is that the nuclear family is thought to be our natural state and that parenting, as a result, is viewed as a purely private matter. Through Joyce, I think Whedon et al. did a good portrayal of the ups and downs of modern parenting. Sometimes, it is really, really hard to know what to to. If you then lack a "village", other adults to talk to, books and tapes can be a way to get new ideas and inspiration to get a troublesome relationship back on track. I'm married to my kid's father, but still deeply appreciate the input I get from my friends, my parents, my favourite parenting forum - and my books. I love reading about handling horses, about sewing, about cooking, about biology, about Greek myths, about politics, about religion, about ... nearly every topic under the sky. Why would I not let "books and tapes" inspire me in my parenting, probably the most important task I have ever taken on?

Zobo, I do by no means praise all Joyce's actions and decisions. But that goes for every single character on the show. That's part of what makes them real to me. Real people mess things up more or less regularly. I'm sorry, though, to read that your parents have been doing such a lousy job of parenting. Not taking responsibility for children is a far cry from the acceptable mess up-rate.

Edited as my language was not accepted.

Being inspired by the books and tapes is one thing. Doing something because the books and tapes say so is another. In the first season, Joyce often refers to her books and tapes as rules for parenting rather than suggestions.
 
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